Leak on classic devolumized, capped valve.

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  • OPBN
    OldPBNoob

    • Sep 2008
    • 5240
    #1

    Leak on classic devolumized, capped valve.

    As usual, I havve apparently fixed one of my mags until it's broke.

    Just got the valve back from being devolumized by Loguzzzzz. Put the marker back together and getting a leak down the barrel. Leak goes away when cocked. If uncocked, leak does not go away when the trigger is pulled.

    Probably need to add that I have removed the AIR reg and capped the valve. Using a Bob Long inline reg. Leak does not seem to be affected by adjusting the reg unless it's completely out.

    Bushing is in. I have tried tightening and loosening the field strip screw. Took everything apart and cleaned it, reoiled etc

    Also noticed an odd thing that occassionally, it is going semi auto on me. The bolt spring is cut pretty far down, so this shouldn't be happening.

    What am I missing?

    Edit: Took the on/off assembly out and exchanged the two top o-rings from another valve. Seemed to help the leak considerably. Now it is very light. Also unscrewed the powertube assembly, wiped off the reddish color o-ring, reoiled and put back together.

    Does not leak at all when cocked, but still slightly when not. Still going semi auto sometimes. Seems to be more prevalent after quick firing a few times. Almost like it is buiding up too much pressure from rapid fire.
    Last edited by OPBN; 03-04-2011, 03:13 PM.
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    • Ando
      Magusmaximus
      • Jun 2009
      • 4144
      #2
      Your leak is your PT spacer. The .220 spacer is the money spacer with pumps. Usually.

      As for your semi problem. You have to cut your bolt spring a little more.
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        • OPBN
          OldPBNoob

          • Sep 2008
          • 5240
          #3
          Originally posted by Ando
          Your leak is your PT spacer. The .220 spacer is the money spacer with pumps. Usually.

          As for your semi problem. You have to cut your bolt spring a little more.
          It wasn't leaking before and it doesn't leak if it's cocked. So that would still be the spacer?

          Bolt spring is already cut. Seemed to be fine before devolumizing.
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            • Ando
              Magusmaximus
              • Jun 2009
              • 4144
              #4
              Originally posted by OPBN
              It wasn't leaking before and it doesn't leak if it's cocked. So that would still be the spacer?
              Even though it wasn't leaking before. The wave spring will sometimes cause a leak. The .220 spacer has been 100% so far . I had to replace it on 3 of my pump mags. BE and a few others had to go down to a .220 as well. It seems to be the money spacer

              Originally posted by OPBN
              Bolt spring is already cut. Seemed to be fine before devolumizing.
              The only thing that's going to cause you to go semi on a pump is your bolt spring doing it's job, its too strong for the wave spring to counter react. Cut it just above bolt length, you should be in the ball park. I keep all my worn out gold springs for this purpose. They're perfect for pump mags, no cutting necessary


              EDIT:
              When you cut your bolt spring. You want the most tension you can get on that wave spring before it goes semi. If you tinker enough with it. You can get a very nice buttery pull on the pump handle, so much that looking at it will cock the bolt. I'm over exaggerating but if you do it right, all you should need is the slightest touch from the cocking rod on the face of the bolt to get it firing.
              Last edited by Ando; 03-04-2011, 06:52 PM.
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                • OPBN
                  OldPBNoob

                  • Sep 2008
                  • 5240
                  #5
                  I just don't get why the spacer wouldnt work, when it was working before when it was already pumped. Spacer that is in it is blue, and I don't have any others.

                  Bolt spring is already shorter than the bolt. not sure how much more I can cut it and again, it was working fine as a pump before I sent the powertube out. Just confusing.


                  Edit: Trimmed some more off of the bolt spring, will see how this works. Not sure how to determine the carrier size as I cannot find any markings on it. On the AGD site, they are brass, and states they are clearly marked. Mine is blue and the only marking I see is a line on the side. Not one that goes around the carrier, but from front to back. Unfortunately, all my valves are level X and I don't have extra carriers. Ugh.
                  Last edited by OPBN; 03-05-2011, 08:16 AM.
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                    • athomas
                      Of course it works-its AGD
                      • Jan 2002
                      • 8039
                      #6
                      The bolt spring pushes the bolt back into place. The bolt will rest against the wave spring which will prevent the sear from rotating forward until you manually push it back. The powertube oring is the sealing point between the bolt stem and the inside of the powertube. If the spacer is too long, it holds the oring farther back in the powertube. This is fine with a strong bolt spring, but as you weaken the bolt spring, the bolt sits farther forward due to the wave spring exerting more force than the bolt spring. This requires you to use an even shorter powertube spacer to allow the oring to set even farther forward.
                      Except for the Automag in front, its usually the man behind the equipment that counts.

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                        • Ando
                          Magusmaximus
                          • Jun 2009
                          • 4144
                          #7
                          I have a few of those color spacers. I'll measure them out for ya. IIRC the purple one is the .220 spacer but I'll ck that toinght for ya.
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                            • OPBN
                              OldPBNoob

                              • Sep 2008
                              • 5240
                              #8
                              Ok, now I get it. I'll wager that opening up the powertube perhaps pushed it forward a fraction that is causing it to now leak. Putting in a shorter spacer, will move the bolt back a hair to get it to seal up with the inner o-ring.

                              Sound plausible?

                              Thanks for the help guys. Regardless of what size I have in, sounds like a shorter spacer is the trick. 1/2 tempted to file down the one I have, but will just order a complete set from AGD along with an o-ring kit. Thought I had one around here and apparently don't.
                              Last edited by OPBN; 03-06-2011, 10:15 AM.
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                                • athomas
                                  Of course it works-its AGD
                                  • Jan 2002
                                  • 8039
                                  #9
                                  Originally posted by OPBN
                                  Putting in a shorter spacer, will move the bolt back a hair to get it to seal up with the inner o-ring.
                                  The spacer doesn't affect where the bolt sits. Only the springs and sear affect that. The bolt spring and wave spring affect where the bolt sits when not cocked, and the sear affects where the bolt sits when cocked. The shorter space allows the oring to come forward to rest against the back of the bolt. If the bolt sits farther forward due to a weaker bolt spring and strong wave spring, then you need a shorter spacer to compensate.
                                  Except for the Automag in front, its usually the man behind the equipment that counts.

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                                    • OPBN
                                      OldPBNoob

                                      • Sep 2008
                                      • 5240
                                      #10
                                      Ok, so the spacer and o-ring that sit inside the powertube move? I thought they were stationary and the shorter spacer would let the spring push the bolt farther back, but I guess if it did, than the wave spring wouldn't be doing its job and the bolt would be catching on the sear. So the shorter spacer lets the pressure when the marker isn't cocked push the oring and spacer farther forwrard to seal against the back of the bolt.

                                      So actually, if I was careful, I could file down the back of the spacer to get the same effect right? I am finding more and more uses for a set of digital calipers, I may just go grab a set while I am out today. Will probably still order the spare spacers from AGD, but mess around with the one I have until it works right until it gets here.

                                      Theoretically, you could also file on the inside of the powertube tip as well right? I know it's probably not recommended, but would result in the same effect right?
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                                        • athomas
                                          Of course it works-its AGD
                                          • Jan 2002
                                          • 8039
                                          #11
                                          Originally posted by OPBN
                                          So the shorter spacer lets the pressure when the marker isn't cocked push the oring and spacer farther forwrard to seal against the back of the bolt.

                                          So actually, if I was careful, I could file down the back of the spacer to get the same effect right?
                                          Correct and correct. You should keep the untouched edge against the oring. That would provide the truest surface.

                                          Originally posted by OPBN
                                          Theoretically, you could also file on the inside of the powertube tip as well right? I know it's probably not recommended, but would result in the same effect right?
                                          Not recommended, but yes. It is easier and cheaper to mess with a spacer than a powertube tip.
                                          Except for the Automag in front, its usually the man behind the equipment that counts.

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