On/off pin length for my mag

[Wank107]

1st - my settup:
Automag, xvalve LX, pure energy 68ci 3000psi preset tank.


I have been told if i want my mag to shoot faster, to get a shorter on/off pin. Is this true?

[Dayspring]

At the cost of breaking parts, it's not worth it.

I've seen two trigger rods snap at the threads b/c somebody messed with their on/off pin and the ROF the gun hit. On an Emag, it doesn't matter much. On a manual- you're screwed.

On/off pins are set for specific bodies and valves for a reason. AGD people are ALOT smarter than us. What say we trust their judgement.

Sidenote- I've seen SEVERAL posts from you about not liking the ROF on your Xvalved mag. My advice- Practice. That, and you can get an adjustable tank and up the pressure somewhat so you have a bit more kick to your trigger.

[Wank107]

Everytime i post about by xvalve...half the time they say the pin valve. and the other half, its you saying dont the opposite. I realy dont have the money to buy a 2/300 dollar adjustable tank, that isnt even gerunteed to work any better. I rather spend 14 dollars on a new pin, and just see how that goes. Unless its terrible if i do that...

[Wank107]

Whoa, i just noticed you live in Bridgewater. I live in basking ridge. Maybe we could meet at a p8ball store sometime and u could help me out?

[Dayspring]

Well, I'll be at Paintballistix (PBX) this saturday in Jersey City. You're more than welcome to drive up and we can look at it then. Free time during the week is non-existant and weekends go to the team.

[cgrieves]

To offer an alteernative viewpoint, I have a classic mag with Emag valve. With the standard Emag quad o-ring top it wouldn't fire at all. With the normal twin o-ring on/off setup it would fire but you could hear the valve recharging slowly after each trigger release, which meant fast firing rates dropped off badly. To cut a long story short I found that the pin wasn't coming far enough out of the on/off top, so there was only a tiny air passage for air to recharge the valve.

I bought another pin as a spare and filed it down. At about .740 the slow recharge cured itself. At .730 my trigger is now nice, feels light and reactive, but doesn't bounce. I carefully checked my bolt and sear after every day's play and can see absolutely no ill effects. Job done.

My advice would be to get another couple of pins, maybe another sear and rod, and hack them around until you find a trigger response you like. Every valve is machined slightly differently and each one needs individual tuning in my opinion. If you break a trigger rod, so what, it's a cheap part.

I hear what Dayspring is saying, but if AGD really do set their markers up to perfection out of the box, why has every X-Mag I've seen come out of a box refused to fire until the Level 10 is set up, and not worked on mechanical mode until the trigger rod has been moved out? AGD are great, but they are a small company of human beings working to known tolerances- each marker is different and most need individual tuning.

[Dayspring]

The Xvalves need tuning b/c you're using a fresh oring. It hasn't broken in and therefore you need to change out the carrier they have in the valve in order to start the wear in process.

As for the Trigger rod. That's BS. Once I got my Level 10 carrier oring straightened out, I pulled the gun out and it worked beautifully. Yes, the oring started wearing in so I had to change carriers. But other than that, she worked gorgeously.

The trigger rod is set at a certain length for very specific reasons. And unless you have an engineering degree or are a tech for AGD, I suggest NOT playing with it. Blazingace broke a trigger rod at the threads 2 weeks after replacing the first one that snapped. That gets somewhat expensive when you have to replace a complete sear assembly every two weeks.

There are several reasons as to why his gun may not be as reactive as he likes. (tank not putting out 850psi or whatever) I am very willing to work on his gun and see what he wants. If that means changing his on/off, then so be it. But I want to see this thing first hand before we start speculating and spouting off.

Originally posted by cgrieves
I hear what Dayspring is saying, but if AGD really do set their markers up to perfection out of the box, why has every X-Mag I've seen come out of a box refused to fire until the Level 10 is set up, and not worked on mechanical mode until the trigger rod has been moved out? AGD are great, but they are a small company of human beings working to known tolerances- each marker is different and most need individual tuning.

[Wank107]

My mom isnt willing to drive me down to Jersey City 2morrow. Im not sure what im gonna do. I have 2 opposite opinions, and both seem to make sence. any 3rd opinions out there?

[cgrieves]

As for the Trigger rod. That's BS.

Err, I have one within five feet of me, that came out of the box with the trigger rod too short. Yes, that's too short. Repeat: Too short. In mechanical mode the rod would never protrude enough to fire the marker. It needed adjusting. And I know of at least two other X Mags that had the same problem. This is not a criticism, it is a fact.

And yes, I do have a degree in Engineering (BSc Hons Aberdeen 1991) but that's irrelevant- I have had one of the two best AGD techs in this country stand in front of me and actively encourage me to play around with rod lengths, pin lengths, every configurable part of the marker. In his words "If you don't f**k around with it you'll never learn". None of the technology in an Automag is rocket science. Great design and engineering yes, but not rocket science.

So you'll pardon me if I experiment, learn things for myself and report on my experiences. That's not speculation or spouting off, that's my right as a user on this forum.

[Dayspring]

That's fine for you who knows and has access to the techs. How about the guys who don't? I don't recommend it do you?

[cgrieves]

Actually the tech in question also said words to the effect of "I'm not gonna tell you everything because the best way to learn about it is to try it and break it"

It's a valve on a paintball marker, not a baby respirator monitor or nuclear reactor- so what if you break a sear/trigger rod or file a pin down too far? Who's gonna care? What's the cost compared to a case of paint?

The only thing I've ever been scared of breaking on my valve is stripping a thread, the rest is baccially a lump of metal with O-rings in it! :)

The guys who hack their guns Today are the techs of Tomorrow :)