?sweetspotting questions....

[trxtr]

forgive my ignorance (I've had my Retro for 4 days), but "sweetspotting" is when you apply the right amount of pressure to your trigger to get your RT to simulate full auto, right? And the ULT makes this easier? I've seen posts where people have set their ULT's so they will NOT sweetspot, why? Isn't that the point of the ULT, to compete ROF with electros?

thanx
trxtr

[Dayspring]

It competes with the electros for pull weight.

The same physics reason that it lightens your pull is the same reason that the RT force is lessened.

You can't really have it both ways.

[Z-man]

Right.

Without the ULT you can adjust your input to feel LOTs of RT or little, but the ULT simply lightens the trigger pull and virtually eliminates the RT of the valve. For this reason, I won't get one. I think it makes the RT feel like the automag A.I.R. valve. Of course that is my opinion, many people love the ULT.

[trxtr]

...

ok, I understand the ULT lightens the trigger pull, thus, reduces reactivity,as well. but, I'm still not sure about the sweetspotting. Why would one set their ULT to eliminate it rather than encourage it? personal preference? tourney rules? I must be missing something.

thanx
trxtr

[Z-man]

sort of. See the RT trigger is often described as a "HARD, crisp" pull. I like it, but it's not a feather light trigger in the sense that you touch it and it fires. If you give it that 1.5Lbs of force to pull the trigger (I forget if that is the magic number) the trigger snap off a shot. This can be lessened by lowering the output pressure of your tank (by around 7-600psi the trigger feels more like an autococker trigger than a Mag).

So why get the ULT? Well for some, the RT trigger is to hard. They would like a softer pull; more the feel of an electronic gun. I will say that after shooting about 1000+ rounds as fast as I can, my hand hurts and I have to rest; that is just the RT trigger (or perhaps I am a wimp).

The ULT makes the force needed to pull the trigger significantly less and also softens the overall feel of the trigger for both classic Mags and RT valved Mags. I tried out the ULT on an X-Valve and hooked it up to my Max-Flow at 900psi to see if it would rapid-fire or at least feel reactive. Virtually NO bounce at all. My best description is that it felt like a soft AutoMag A.I.R. valve trigger.

Some love this. As I understand, there is work being done on an even softer trigger that may even allow for walking of the trigger (but that is my speculation only).

It's a matter of preference. To my knowledge there is not increase or decrease of efficiency of air or cycle rate of the valve. It's soft-no bouncy trigger vs. sharp bouncy trigger.

[Steelrat]

I shot that same X-valved ULT mag as Z-man, and it was definately lighter, though not quite walkable. I found that Im able to shoot a normal RT as fast as the ULT, but there was virtually no return force on the trigger from the valve.

[bsolomon]

Aside from the excellent description from Z-Man which pretty well describes all of the aspects of personal preference on trigger pull, as you mentioned, if you play tournaments, there are rules.

Specifically, virtually every tournament requires markers to operate in a true semi-automatic fashion: one ball fires per trigger pull. Sweetspotting is a definite no-no because it essentially gives you a full-auto-like mechanism where you pull the trigger back once, and (if you prevent the trigger from returning all the way to the original position) you can keep the marker firing continually. Some makers sweetspot easily, and others less so, but it is always a possibility with a reative trigger mechanism.

So the long and short of it is that good chrono refs know which markers are likely to do this, and if they see one they will usually try to sweetspot it themselves. If they can sweetspot it, the marker is illegal. Since you tend to chrono going onto the field just before a game, that's a really bad time to end up without a marker. So, if you want to use your reactive trigger in a tournament, you want to make really sure that it will not sweetspot (or at least that no one can find the sweetspot, other than you).

[blakdragon21]

bsolomon: That is exactly what I am looking for. The sweetspot that only I can do and the refs can not in tourneys. We mag guys need every advantage to keep up with those timmys, imps, angels and any other electro. more power to the mech