Questions about X-Valve, Lvl X and ULT

[Battlewear]

Hey all

Ok, first off let me say that YES I am reading the LVL X thread, about a 1/4 of the way through it (just want to read for general knowledge of the product) and when done I plan to read the ULT thread..

Ok here is the situation.. I recently got a X Valve (with the LVL X bolt. I had one before and had a ULT, I have put the ULT into the X Valve. I have heard that the X is totally walkable, maybe not so much with a mech mag but for sure with E and Pneu.. Now I have heard some people say it is possible with the right tuning to make it walkable on a mech mag.. I did get it going a couple of times last night but had some troubles after that (only walked for about 3 seconds a couple of times)..

I have some questions about different parts of each of the units and hope the good folks and Tech Wizards here might be able to help :)

Ok, first my set up - Minimag with X Valve, with ULT and LVL X (2 Shim, 1.5 Carrier, med spring (red spring)). Carbon Fiber grip with 2 finger trigger. 137/3K Tank with fully adjustable reg (50 to 1000 PSI output)

First when I got the X Valve in the instructions it said something to the effect of 600 PSI imput for walking, 800 for reactive.. Sorry, I am not sure exactly, I lost the paper from my tool box the last time I played . Can any one shed some light on this and what is best for walking and why?

LVL X - With my current set up it seems to be working ok (no leaks, leaks on 2 carrier but not 1.5) Now it is my understanding that the shims delay the 2nd stage, which is the firing stage correct? Would it then be best to have as many shims as possible? Can some one explain a little more about the shims for me please? The current set up seems to be a bit hard and when I used a popsicle stick yesterday (turned sideways at the bolt) it choped it off!!! YIKES GLAD it wasnt my finger! LOL So would adding shims delay stage 2 making it more sensitive to balls 1/2 way in?

ULT - This is my biggest mystry.. I got it like 2 years ago and I think my wife tossed the instructions out when I had it working in my classic valve.. Now I want to see if I can get it set up to work in my X Valve and make the trigger as walkable as possible. My current ULT set up is 4 or 5 shims (sorry dont know if they are ULT shims or LVL X shims! How do ya tell????) What do the shims do and why?

Any and all help would be greatly appreciated :) I hope with every ones help to have a kick butt marker for this weekends Big Game, maybe it will get some new people interested in the MAG

[flyingpootang]

Xvalves don't work under 850 psi and even. With a ULT being walkable it's kinda hard even when well tuned. Best bet is to go with a SpyderMag conversion from lukescustoms.com

Tune the ULT first. Start with 2 shims and fire it. add 1 shim at a time until it goes full auto, then remove 1 shim.

The L10 shims are for tunning the bolt when it resets. Use no shims & a squigee 1/4" away from the bolt and fire the marker. The bolt should stay forward. Keep adding 1 shim at a time until the bolt resets itself after hitting the squigee.

Shim thickness are different from the ULT & L10, but can be mixed/matched to fine tune both the L10 & ULT.

[Asym]

ULT - This is my biggest mystry.. I got it like 2 years ago and I think my wife tossed the instructions out when I had it working in my classic valve.. Now I want to see if I can get it set up to work in my X Valve and make the trigger as walkable as possible. My current ULT set up is 4 or 5 shims (sorry dont know if they are ULT shims or LVL X shims! How do ya tell????) What do the shims do and why?

ULT shims are .005 thick and LX shims are double the size of the ULT shims at .01. You can tell them apart if you have good eyesite and compare them or a set of calipers.

Shims in the ULT make the on/off body longer, effectivly changing the point at where it cuts off the airflow. The more shims you put in acts like its shortening the pin. Too short of a pin in any style on/off makes it more reactive/full auto. Thats why flyingpootang said put in enough shims to make it full auto then remove one, so its no longer full auto.

[Battlewear]

Xvalves don't work under 850 psi and even. With a ULT being walkable it's kinda hard even when well tuned. Best bet is to go with a SpyderMag conversion from lukescustoms.com

Tune the ULT first. Start with 2 shims and fire it. add 1 shim at a time until it goes full auto, then remove 1 shim.

The L10 shims are for tunning the bolt when it resets. Use no shims & a squigee 1/4" away from the bolt and fire the marker. The bolt should stay forward. Keep adding 1 shim at a time until the bolt resets itself after hitting the squigee.

Shim thickness are different from the ULT & L10, but can be mixed/matched to fine tune both the L10 & ULT.

Ok, I did some testing this morning, I turned up the reg output to 850 then 900 (gauge on the marker read 850 when reg says 900).. I checked out Lukes Customs, and yea, that would be a nice way to go, will have to see.. If I do I might just go with a rocker trigger (some tourneys up here are allowing them)..

As to the ULT, I will start over but currently running 2 ULT shims, 1 X Shim, any more and the ult doesnt go in enough for the bolt to slid into the body. At present it will not go full auto.. Not sure what I can do there if I cant fit any more shims in..

ULT shims are .005 thick and LX shims are double the size of the ULT shims at .01. You can tell them apart if you have good eyesite and compare them or a set of calipers.

Shims in the ULT make the on/off body longer, effectivly changing the point at where it cuts off the airflow. The more shims you put in acts like its shortening the pin. Too short of a pin in any style on/off makes it more reactive/full auto. Thats why flyingpootang said put in enough shims to make it full auto then remove one, so its no longer full auto.

Asym - I see what you mean about the thickness.. I also noticed that they appear to be different colors.. The LVL X shims appear to be a nice silvery colour and the ULT are a darker colour.. Unless of course I have them backwards then my eye sight is not so good LOL..

I can almost sweet spot it, but still she doesnt want to go full auto.. I used up the last 1500 of my tank this morning so I am going to get a fill and try again tonight when I get home..

I do thank you both for your help very much!!! :)

[flyingpootang]

The ULT max is about 5shims. If it goes full auto you have too many. Make shure the shims are all lined up when re-installing the on/off. Also look at your rail bushing that it's not sticking up keeping your reg from slidding in...

[Battlewear]

The ULT max is about 5shims. If it goes full auto you have too many. Make shure the shims are all lined up when re-installing the on/off. Also look at your rail bushing that it's not sticking up keeping your reg from slidding in...

Well, with some very gentle massaging I am up to 3 lvl X shims and 1 ULT shim.. And still no full auto... I dont think I can fit another shim but I am going to try.. A couple of times I had it walking for about 3 seconds but thats as close as it got LOL.. I am thinking a walkable mech mag is not possible... The trigger is now really sensitive though, but still not able to walk, seems like it takes to long to rest the trigger pin into place.. Running at 900 PSI input pressure..

[flyingpootang]

Battle, A stock RT on/off will give you better reactivity/trigger bounce while a ULT is for getting a lighter trigger pull and the Spydermag conversion. Using a RT on/off with the input pressure at 900-950 and your finger on the trigger sweet spot will give you a very fast bounce/full auto effect. One of the main reasons the RT was banned from most tourneys.

[Battlewear]

Ok, this is where I am at as of this afternoon.

I spent a few hours tinkering and tuning at one of our local indoor shops today and I now have 4 LVL X shims in the ULT. I can now walk the trigger for about 3 seconds every 3 seconds.. Very odd sounding but it works and its good for me for now LOL..

As to the LVL X, It was running fine but a couple of times it would seem to stall.. I would run a long string and then it would sort of stop and re-gas.. Then click into place (almost like it ran out of air).. I also had some leaking down the barrel so I went down 1 carrier (now at 1.0) and removed 1 shim and now it seems to be working fine.. I ran 300 shots through it hard core and never got one chop and believe me, with trying to walk that trigger when it really should not of been, I am very happy!! I did have some issues with paint to barrel matching, but that is ok, I have a 3rd barrel that I need to dig out for tomorrows big game.

I have my tank set to an output of 900 and getting consistant 850 at the marker (at least that is what the gauge their says) and every thing ran like a trooper.. I am ready to go..

I think when I am ready to go E-Mag (be it Emag or Spyder or what ever) I will send it off some where to get it done..

I do thank you for your help! Will let you know how things go AFTER a day of play :)

[flyingpootang]

Battle, The L10 bolt will wear in the oring and then be very constant just like what happened to you. When your bolt hesitates like you said you need to add 1 more shim, but since you went down a carrier I think its ok. Just remember if you want to test it use a squigee about 1/4" away from the bolt and fire it. It should hit the squigee then reset. If it stays forward add 1 shim at a time. Great to hear your all set up for the big game. Doing a SpyderMag may be the eaisest conversion that is cost effective and you can always go back to a reactive trigger......