Engineering student seeks guidance.

[DyeWhore]

First of all, I'm sorry if this is in the wrong forum, but I wasn't sure where this would best fit. I figured this forum would work since there seems to be quite a few knowledgable people floating around.

Let me introduce myself, I'm a 20 year old engineering student. I'm currently studying Aerospace Engineering and doing quite well. However, I find myself constantly looking forward to the rest of my life less and less. I really don't think I want to work in the aerospace industry, because I don't think it will ever make me happy. I've always felt you should devote your life to what will make you happy, and what you're passionate about. If I'm not happy with what I do, the fanciest job in the world with the fatest paycheck imaginable won't mean a thing to me.

I have been playing paintball for about 4 years now. I spent about the first 2 years in the woods playing sporadically and the last 2 years have been pure tournament ball playing every single weekend. I am extremely passionate about paintball. I wake up Sunday morning, watch paintball dvds, go practice with my team, then come home and watch some more. I think about it 24/7. If I could spend the rest of my life playing, I would. It is something I am that passionate about. I really think working in paintball would make me happy.

The point of this post is, is there any need for engineers in the paintball industry? I don't plan to do anything drastic like drop out of school to fulfil some crazy pipedream, but I want to see what's out there. The most extreme move I would make right now is transfer to Mechanical Engineering, but I was considering that anyway. If I finish my degree as an engineer, what is the outlook for paintball companies needing engineers? If I could get an answer of any kind from Tom Kaye, that would make my whole month, but I'm not too sure how much he lurks around here anymore.

Is working within the paintball industry with an engineering degree an impossible dream or something achievable? Any feedback is appreciated. Thanks.

- DyeWhore.

[master_alexander]

cool! i am only a 14 year old kid, but AO and paintball is my life so here are my thoughts.

there is always a need for engeneers in any industry. and i am kindof in the same boat as you. but i have yet to be in high school and figure out what i want to be when i grow up.

i wish i could help you more... but i am not that knowlegable. i hope you find what your looking for.

welcome to AO

~alex

[wageslave]

but i have yet to be in high school and figure out what i want to be when i grow up.

Hell, I'm 33 and I don't know what I want to be when I grow up either! (Hint: You never "grow up", that's a myth, I still feel like a kid at heart.)

Back on topic...

A lot of people, unfortunately, are not able to find that perfect job that allows them to do exactly what they love the most. For most people, you get as close as you can, and pour your money into your "hobby" (Which I like to think of as 'what a person would do for a job if they could actually make money at it'). Whatever you choose to do, don't give up trying to do what you love, because you never know when opportunity will start knockin'. Good luck!

[PumpPlayer]

Changing Majors? I dunno...

I'm 22 and graduated a year ago in Marine Engineering Systems (Think mechanical but with more thermo. It deals with the construction and operation of marine power plants.) Here is what I would suggest above everything else.

I like paintball as well. I've been playing about 7 years and have seen a lot of changes in the products and manufacturing of paintball markers. And while I love pneumatics and the design and construction of such systems, I do not think I would seriously consider applying for employment for a paintball products manufacturer. Here is why: The current trend has paintball manufacturers producing less expensive, 'disposable' equipment in automated controlled processes. The current flavor is to produce equipment that lasts 4 to 5 years (when it will be obsolete) using cost-effective automated processes. But because design is usually performed by a small group of core company personnel, the employment need is for CNC operators and skilled-labor manufacturing in addition to traditional corporate labor such as accounting and marketing. Of course, all engineers dream of the day where they are given an R&D team of half a dozen people and an unlimited budget (and I am sure you are no different). However, I do not see a real need for that type of labor in the market right now. Furthermore, funding R&D is an extremely expensive undertaking regardless of the industry. For a corporation to be able to afford an R&D team (which generates zero revenue and has just about the highest cost of any department besides manufacturing), the profit margin on its products must be sufficient to support the enterprise and they must sell a significant volume of product as well! For now, paintball R&D is performed by the core constituents of paintball manufacturing companies. I have not heard of any paintball corporations funding a full-fledged R&D department. Unless you are willing to work as a skilled-labor machinist (not that you can hold a candle to the experience of someone who has been in the trade for a few years - don't worry, neither can I), you are probably not going to find an engineering-related position in the paintball industry short of one possibility: Starting your own manufacturing company.

Obviously, starting a new business takes a few things you may not have. A solid design, capital, business savvy and a lot of luck. Sure, everyone wants to work for themselves, but you need to be honest about the costs, risks and hard work associated succeeding at it. However... in this modern age of technology where a worldwide audience is an eBay listing away, you may be able to have the best of both worlds. Off the top of my head, I can think of one individual in particular who takes used tracers/mavericks, converts them to bolt action and slaps them inside of a remingon wooden rifle stock. After a paintjob, a cheap scope and a bipod, it looks like a military-style sniper rifle and sells for about $500 on eBay. I can't vouch for their quality as I haven't seen one in person. I bring up the point because someone has a hobby that they enjoy, makes them money (if only a little) and converts otherwise useless material into markers that players will use and enjoy for years to come.

Am I suggesting breaking into the custom markers market through eBay? No, not really. I'm just giving you an example of how you can develop your hobby of paintball into something that is financially productive for you. (as opposed to just playing, which is an expense) People make custom fabric barrel socks and headbands out of knockoff Louis Vutton fabric. Sure it's not engineering, but they're popular and they sell. At $3 a barrel sock, are you going to make it rich? Probably not. But I'm sure they enjoy their hobby and are glad other people find their services useful.

My advice is this: don't quit your day job. As an engineer, you have a skill that is highly valued. But not necesarially by the paintball industry at this time. There very well may come a day where the revenues of paintball companies are such that they can support R&D staff. (paintball IS the fastest-growing sport...) That day is not today, however. (you might have some luck in CAD work, but that's probably not your flavor either...)

You don't need to change your major. From you being 20, I'm going to assume you're in your second year already. It's a wee bit late to change majors to another engineering discipline, but probably not too late. Though believe me, an engineer is an engineer. So you don't like the aerospace industry... so what? (I don't blame you... it's mostly government-driven and it's a very stagnant market. That's aside from the fact that it takes so long to even work up to a respectable position...) But there are thousands of different companies that need engineers and many more that don't know they need them. And even if you have to work in the aerospace industry for a few years... what's the harm? I would encorage you to do the following:

Get your degree. As quickly as possible.
Get an engineering job. ANY engineering job.
Work towards your PE - that'll help you out in the industry tremendously.
Improve your machining skills.

And don't be afraid to tinker. Feel free to design and build your own markers, grenades, mortars, whatever your thing is. I've made bombs, grenade launchers, tanks, all sorts of crap... But draw the line between your hobbies and your profession. You gotta eat, after all. And who knows? Maybe some day you'll see a job for a paintball manufacturing company, jump on it and love it. But leave that 'some day' to chance. You still have two years (or at least one and a half) in school and right now, there are priorities more important than what job you're going to get when you graduate.

As for changing your major, screw the aerospace industry, do YOU enjoy the subject? After all, that's the important issue here, not some future job which you may never have to work in...

As for how you spend your sundays, plan on giving that up in the next few years if you're serious about being an engineer. Few engineering students can afford to lose a day every week and still do enough work to graduate in 4 years... Sorry.

Good luck.
~Ted, E.I.T.

[manike]

A fantastic post above by PumpPlayer and I agree with almost all of it.

A couple of points from my experience.

I almost went to work for AGD as soon as I left University (I have an honors degree in Mechanical Engineering and Business Management).

With hindsight NOT going to work for them was one of the best decisions I have made in my career.

I fully recommend getting a job with a major manufacturer/large engineering company and gaining experience at their expense.

I went into Design and Concept in the automotive industry, then I started and ran the UK subsiduary for a multinational CAD/CAM company. Eventually I got into a full time position in paintball.

I was consulting in paintball for a significant period before the work load and projects got to the point that employing me full time was a better policy. That's when I upped and left the UK to come and live and work in the USA. That was a year and a few months ago. Since then we have been developing a true state of the art R&D facility for paintball. Gino has been fantastic in his commitment to personel and resources. I believe we have the ability here to pay him back and make it worthwhile.

I certainly wouldn't hire an engineer in paintball straight out of college unless he had achieved something major in paintball and had experience in paintball, or was very cheap and the kind of person I could mentor (BTW, you story starts out very similar to mine, but by that time I already had patents pending in paintball).

I would pick someone with an Engineering degree though, depending on the degree and circumstances and courses, etc...

I have not heard of any paintball corporations funding a full-fledged R&D department.

I believe we are the only true R&D department in paintball. Dave Bell (from Viewloader fame) and I (my real name is Simon Stevens) started it for NPS just over a year ago, we now have a stunning set up (full CNC and SLS technologies) and many engineers, both in the USA and at facilities around the world. We have qualified Electronics and Mechanical engineers, all of whom have significant experience in relative fields before getting a job with us. We don't employ people to have them learn here, we bring in people that already know what they are doing, although with that said we are considering doing some co-op projects with local colleges. All design projects are controlled from the USA.

[DyeWhore]

or was very cheap and the kind of person I could mentor

I'm a fast learner and I'll work for free Hellfire.

although with that said we are considering doing some co-op projects with local colleges.

Hey, I've got nothing to do this Summer.


Ok I'm done being an idiot, here's the serious stuff.

BTW, you story starts out very similar to mine, but by that time I already had patents pending in paintball

I actually have a few ideas, I'm just not sure where to go with them. I have been working on the basic physics lately, but nothing concrete. Like I said, you guys may have beaten me to the punch on one of my ideas when you designed the Evolt, or the Evolt may be far more advanced than I'm imagining. I know the Evolt isn't based off of airsoft design, I think I saw you post that somewhere.

(I have an honors degree in Mechanical Engineering and Business Management)

Do you mind clarifying what an honors degree is? Maybe it's some European thing I'm not familiar with (you are from England, correct?), how does it compare to the American degree levels of bachelor's, master's, etc.

The idea of working for a normal company first before making an attempt at the paintball industry is definetly an answer I can live with. I honestly didn't have much of an idea of how the industry did it's design and I wasn't sure that there was any room for an engineering major. I'm still very interested in learning more though.

[manike]

Do you mind clarifying what an honors degree is? Maybe it's some European thing I'm not familiar with (you are from England, correct?), how does it compare to the American degree levels of bachelor's, master's, etc.

Honestly I'm not sure. I would need to check my documents for when they got me my USA visa. They translated it into the equivalent from here. Bascially you get levels of degree in the UK. Highest is 'honours' degrees and then you get 'ordinary. degrees. Honours go from 1:1 (highest), 2:1 (what I got), 2:2, 3rd and then you get the ordinary degree, You have to get a degree to then be able to do a masters or PHD etc.

The idea of working for a normal company first before making an attempt at the paintball industry is definetly an answer I can live with. I honestly didn't have much of an idea of how the industry did it's design and I wasn't sure that there was any room for an engineering major. I'm still very interested in learning more though.

There is room for engineering majors, and as we move forwards such items will become more important. I definitely use my training and forumulae often at work. Not all companies design the same way...

[PattyG]

I'm 16 and also planing on being in engineer I'm in Engineering draft 2. And I curently have an A (Oh ya). I was wondering what science classes I should take.
As of yet I'm in Biology Next Year I'm planing on taking Pre AP Chemistry and Astronomy
And My Junior Year AP Phyisics. Then to finish it of I'm planing on takeing both Astrophyisics and AP Chemistry 3-4
Math is just normal Geometry, Alg. 3-4, Pre Calc, and AP Calc
How I'm I looking so far
And Then I'll take Eng. Draft 3-4 and Arch Draft

[manike]

What sort of Engineering do you want to get into?

That can govern your classes, but in general I did things I enjoyed.

One point of interest, in the my world I wouldn't employ someone who didn't have decent CAD/Drafting skills.

[SlartyBartFast]

I really don't think I want to work in the aerospace industry, because I don't think it will ever make me happy. I've always felt you should devote your life to what will make you happy, and what you're passionate about. If I'm not happy with what I do, the fanciest job in the world with the fatest paycheck imaginable won't mean a thing to me.

If that's your outlook you may have a very depressing life. The reason I say this is that you are VERY fortunate if you can find gainful employment somewhere where you are both good and what you do and thouroughly "passionate" doing it.

Unfortunately many people are only mediocre at what they are "passionate" about. Or, the field they are "passionate" about is too limited or competitive to provide any income. In either case, they set themselves up for failure placing their expectations and hopes in that one basket.

Take Hockey for example. If you "passionate" about playing and beleive you can only work at what you are passionate about, you're going to be devastated if you don't make the cut to play pro or semi-pro. You only have two possible outcomes in the scenario: desparation and failure, or success as a hockey player. But, if you play regularly, get a decent job in another prospect that you are good at, there are two good possible outcomes: you are employed and happy about your life, or you actually make the cut and life is ecstatic.

To me the choice is usually one of two things: Live to work or Work to live. If you demand that you must be passionate about your job/career then you're in the first group. If you beleive that work is only part of your "Life" you're in the second group and in a far more stable position.

Find something you're good at AND can get you employment. As you gain experience, either find a niche in your employment that you are passionate about or fulfill your life with pursuits and activities you are passionate about.

Equating your passion at work with happiness is a sorry state of affairs. The day you get laid-off from your wonderful job you'll be devastated and LIFE will be meaningless. Equally sad are those who have no LIFE because they are so hung up on not enjoying work they fail to file work away as a simple job and find enjoyment in LIFE.

Hmmm. I'm rambling, so I'll stop now.