Another electropneumag...

[magpump]

Ill base it on stereo equipment to give you a better idea.

The pancake noid is like a a sub.

The battery is the battery.

The cap is the larger caps used by the amp.

The battery feeds power to the amp in the car which next dow the line is the cap.

The sub woofer gets a signal to do its "thing", which needs a larger boost of power that the amp is supplying. Instead of the amp pushing all the power in huge spikes, the sub looks to the first thing in the line to draw power from,... the cap.

The cap gets drained of power, the sub gets its needed juice to "do its thing", the amp draws power from the battery again, "fills" the cap with needed juice to work, then the cycle restarts.

Reason being is that the amp doesnt get power spikes, the battery doesnt get power spikes, the alternator doesnt take on bigger loads. It helps save ur system.

Same thing with the noid.

It looks to the first thing in the line that has 9volts,.. if you didnt have the cap. ur battery wouldnt last 5 seconds. The noid looks down the line for its 9volts it needs,.. sees the cap as having 9volts, and takes it to fire. The board sees the cap requiring power, the cap handles the power spikes and resistance in the line between the noid and the board.

The Electrician explained this much better than I can,.. but I tried without the cap, then with the cap, and hes right.

You need the cap with the pancake noid,... or u need a HUGE battery!

yup thats what i thought, i posted something like that right before you. just not with the huge explanation.

[p8ntbal4me]

yup thats what i thought, i posted something like that right before you. just not with the huge explanation.

Yeah, credit goes to the Electrician for explaining it to me.

I related it to stereo equipment and it made sense to me.

[Pneumagger]

the TL;DR version:

electromechanical (pancake) and ION solenoids draw more power than solenoid Valves (skinner, humphrey, etc.). All can run off 9 volts, but a 9 volt can only deliver so many milliamps at a time.

Power = volts * Amps

Now if you wired several 9 volt batteries in parallel, you could increase the power output and still only be pushing 9 volts. Or (the more common approach) a capacitor is like a temporary battery that can be charged up to 9V by the primary battery and discharges it's power nearly instantly (as opposed to being restricted to chemically producing it's own power like a batery - it's all stored up ready to go).

----edit---
It comes to this: If your noid's power usage rate is less than the battery's ability to chemically produce power - then the battery is sufficient. If the noid draws more power than the battery can supply, use a capacitor fed by a battery. If your noid draws more power than a capictor can push, add another capacitor or a get bigger one.

[Lenny]

the TL;DR version:

electromechanical (pancake) and ION solenoids draw more power than solenoid Valves (skinner, humphrey, etc.). All can run off 9 volts, but a 9 volt can only deliver so many milliamps at a time.

Power = volts * Amps

Now if you wired several 9 volt batteries in parallel, you could increase the power output and still only be pushing 9 volts. Or (the more common approach) a capacitor is like a temporary battery that can be charged up to 9V by the primary battery and discharges it's power nearly instantly (as opposed to being restricted to chemically producing it's own power like a batery - it's all stored up ready to go).

----edit---
It comes to this: If your noid's power usage rate is less than the battery's ability to chemically produce power - then the battery is sufficient. If the noid draws more power than the battery can supply, use a capacitor fed by a battery. If your noid draws more power than a capictor can push, add another capacitor or a get bigger one.

You know, I'm really friggin tired of you making me feel stupid. So I'll add my own bit of useless trivia.

If you open up a nine volt battery, there are 6 rods that house the actual battery components. The housing rod thingies are technically AAAA batteries and hold a charge of approx. 1.5volts. With a small plate of metal (say, part of the outer 9vlt case), they can be fit to cheaply and easily run AAA appliances (basically, subtitute for a AAA battery).

BOO-YAH!!!

[Pneumagger]

You know, I'm really friggin tired of you making me feel stupid. So I'll add my own bit of useless trivia.

If you open up a nine volt battery, there are 4 rods that house the actual battery components. The housing rod thingies are technically AAAA batteries and hold a charge of approx. 1.5volts. With a small plate of metal (say, part of the outer 9vlt case), they can be fit to cheaply and easily run AAA appliances (basically, subtitute for a AAA battery).

BOO-YAH!!!

Don't you mean 6 rods (AAAA cells)? Cause it's not like 6 x 1.5 doesn't equal 9 volts.
(the emag battery has 14 similar 1.2 volt cells in series)

/sorry
//had to do it.

[Lenny]

Don't you mean 6 rods (AAAA cells)? Cause it's not like 6 x 1.5 doesn't equal 9 volts.
(the emag battery has 14 similar 1.2 volt cells in series)

/sorry
//had to do it.

What ever dude, it's late. *sigh* Edited.

It is cool, though.

[p8ntbal4me]

I have more than enough "testicular forditude" to get shot at for our country.

But no where near enough to go taking apart batteries!

Baaaaaaad personal experience.


Hope you feel better now!

[Ydna]

http://www.zdspb.com/media/customwork/ion/megarelocate_frame1.JPG

[MagModderMatt]

different method

(shortcuts to stuff on bottom)

You know there is a Very cheap way to do this kind of project, I did it like this, and came out with Close to the same thing

went to Scenerio Dreams, They sell a Spyder grip frame for $15 It not only has lots of space It has a place with set screws to fit the Mpa-3 (where the pancake E-noid went)

Then I bought a UTB, (it is the most tiny board I could find) has very virsitle with the membrane buttons!
Bought the EP noid & the mpa-3 at air soldier (all this for less than $100)
all that fit's in that grip very nicely. (enough room for battery and a CAP and room to spare)

I ran the Lpr off my drop forward (yes I like drop forwards) and up through the bottom of the grip frame. thing doesnt even look like a E or EP gun, the grip frame has no words/markings and is very high quality, (especialy for $15)
Grip=

http://www.scenariodreams.com/oscommerce/product_info.php?cPath=18&products_id=135

UTB=

http://www.scenariodreams.com/oscommerce/product_info.php?cPath=32&products_id=195

[afortuna]

(shortcuts to stuff on bottom)

You know there is a Very cheap way to do this kind of project, I did it like this, and came out with Close to the same thing

went to Scenerio Dreams, They sell a Spyder grip frame for $15 It not only has lots of space It has a place with set screws to fit the Mpa-3 (where the pancake E-noid went)

Then I bought a UTB, (it is the most tiny board I could find) has very virsitle with the membrane buttons!
Bought the EP noid & the mpa-3 at air soldier (all this for less than $100)
all that fit's in that grip very nicely. (enough room for battery and a CAP and room to spare)

I ran the Lpr off my drop forward (yes I like drop forwards) and up through the bottom of the grip frame. thing doesnt even look like a E or EP gun, the grip frame has no words/markings and is very high quality, (especialy for $15)
Grip=

http://www.scenariodreams.com/oscommerce/product_info.php?cPath=18&products_id=135

UTB=
http://www.scenariodreams.com/oscomm...roducts_id=195

2 Things: Damn that is cheap for a frame and all those wires make that board look ridiculously funny. Nice way to go. How much work to mod that frame for sear movement?

[MagModderMatt]

how much it took

Actualy it wasnt bad, I just used a dremmel to put a 1/4 inch deep channel along the top for the mag sear - from right before the mag front mount screw (almost all the way to the back field strip bolt) and the only other major thing was drilling streight down for the sear rod, it meshes with the mpa-3 well I had to cut the noid channel a bit farther forward and add 2 set screws (one on top 1 bottom) because the mpa is not as fat as the pancake and I wanted it to fit tight ofcorse. About 1 hour of work all told. the asa screws are not the offset spyders, it comes with regular ones.

I am going to put this noid in it because the grip is big enough to fit the board+bat+noid easily WAS Noid 5VDC and up to 200 psi that can cycle 120CPS $hit you not!
Here is the Link for the noid WAS EP Solenoid link
Check it out guys!!

2 Things: Damn that is cheap for a frame and all those wires make that board look ridiculously funny. Nice way to go. How much work to mod that frame for sear movement?

[p8ntbal4me]

I am going to put this noid in it because the grip is big enough to fit the board+bat+noid easily WAS Noid 5VDC and up to 200 psi that can cycle 120CPS $hit you not!
Here is the Link for the noid WAS EP Solenoid link
Check it out guys!!

Good luck getting one from WAS.

They still owe me 1,.. that was over a year ago.

Im using the same solenoid,.... but it doesnt say "WAS" on the side of it. CPS is well above 77.

~ P8nt

[questionful]

How does that compare to the cycle rate of other solenoid valves? When I get around to building my e-pneu frame, I want something that will last. I mean, I would not at all mind replacing a few cheap parts (like O-rings) every once in a while, but I don't want it to die on me and then have to go buy another noid.