What does the word "mint" mean to you in relation to a sale?

[punkncat]

I know this seems a very obvious question. I just wonder, if you are taking about an item that is several years old, do you think there is any allowance for saying "mint" and the expectation of that condition in spite of its age?

More in a minute...

[wetwrks]

Mint would mean to me (reguardless of age) basically NIB. I have dealt with collecting coins and comic books and I have a really high standard reguarding what mint means when refering to something.

[questionful]

To me it means: in the condition it was in when it was new.

[Madmarx]

I know this seems a very obvious question. I just wonder, if you are taking about an item that is several years old, do you think there is any allowance for saying "mint" and the expectation of that condition in spite of its age?

More in a minute...

As "obvious" as that may seem to you or I... there ARE people on this site and others that just don't seem to understand what that DOES mean. There are many other terms that can mean the same thing and they all seem to be used without hesitation.

My opinion... if it's something you are SELLING, be honest. ie if there are scratches thru the ano or even not thru then say so in your post. Don't say it's mint or excellent when you yourself would be upset to pay top dollar for an item only to receive it all scratched up.

If you are BUYING then ask a ton of questions and get detailed pics. If you don't then you will be sorry.

[punkncat]

Well I see that the few of us, and I am sure more replies will follow are all on the same page regarding this. I know of two sites that hold themselves to a standard a bit higher in regards to honesty in selling, and buying. This being one, and so far MCB being the other.
I have not dealt with all of you in a buyer seller relationship, but I know that at least one of you I have. I know that whenever and where ever possible within the scope of my knowledge and familiarity with a product I hold myself to a very high moral character about disclosure. Even to the point of damaging my ability to sell an item at times. I have worked very hard to maintain a good reputation here in my feedback and don't want to damage it with one deal that will follow me around from that point forward hurting my ability to sell items.

Apparently I am a bit nieve in that I have an expectation that others be so forthright about the condition of their sale items as well....

[SithSteve]

I have dealt with collecting coins and comic books and I have a really high standard reguarding what mint means when refering to something.

Especially if you're grading by CGC standards.

[PumpPlayer]

In the world of collecting, it also implies that the item was unused and/or uncirculated (as applicable to the item in question). In order for a comic book to be "mint," it cannot have any bent or creased pages, no fading on the cover, etc. It also can't have a postmark or shipping label (more common on magazines), price tag or anything else that was added by someone other than the factory or (in limited cases) an authorized dealer.

With manufactured goods like a paintball gun, I can forgive some flaws and still call the item "mint." To use an example I'm familiar with, CCI Phantoms often have a slight smudge in the anodizing on the left side of the frame behind the safety because of the way they sit in the anodizing racks. As this is an expected deviation due to manufacturing practices, I would not consider it a flaw and the item could still be legitimately called "mint." Although the collectibility and/or value of a flawless specimin may be greater, something with a common and expected flaw can still be "mint."

With age, something else comes into play and that it factory packaging methods. Not common storage methods but the manner in which the manufacturer suggested it be stored because of its packaging. Similar to a minor manufacturing defect, this is something that the mnufacturer did that can cause a flaw on the object. Placing a finished metal surface directly against cardboard, for instance, can cause "ribbing" in the finish as the resins in the cardboard slowly leech out over time. With an old paintball gun, this was common with painted brass being fairly unceremoniously tossed into cardboard boxes for delivery and then shoved into a warehouse for 20+ years. I would consider a NIB Sheridan that had some minor ribbing to still be "mint," even though it shows flaws since they are the result of the original packaging.

Lastly, some finishes and components can wear out or break down over time. Seals can crack if they get dry (as in, the gun's never even been oiled), lubricants can pool and stain, paint can dull, raw brass can oxidize, etc. Within low limits of such flaws, such items could still be called "mint," IMHO. One or two slightly cracked seals is a relatively minor thing on a 20+ year old gun that's never been out of the box.


Short of those minor and expected flaws, however, you shouldn't use the term mint.

[punkncat]

So anyway...the point of the thread that I keep getting diverted from.

I just purchased an Angel G7 Fly from a guy on the nation. I know, should have known who and where I was dealing with.....The guy has a load of really good feedback. He described the marker as one he was selling for a friend, that it was mint and in perfect working condition.
I got this thing in RECORD time, it was shipped Sat and was sitting on my porch today. It came packed well and everything that was described in the sale plus a few bonus but non critical items were in the box.

Provided with the sale were some good pics that seemed to cover everything. When discussing with him the condition through PM's he once again mentioned the perfect shape and working order.

Upon taking the marker out, the first thing that I notice is a very obvious scratch on one side, through the anno, and another nick on the other. There is a minor problem with the anno in a recess that is nothing to worry too much about. So much for mint.
Its not a matter of me being so worried the scratches. Things happen to markers and I plan on playing with it. No big deal. Would have been nice to know, but hey.....but on to what REALLY bothers me about the deal.
I get airline on it, get it ready to go, turn it on, and the damn LCD screen is all bugged up. You can tell the marker is on, and I was able to fuddle through some settings simply because I am familiar with these boards. Basically I defaulted it, and then worked from there with the booklet and the small amounts of screen I can read.
The marker fires fine so far as I can tell. I will not have the opportunity to actually shoot it over the chrono till later.

The latter part really does irritate me. I payed a bit above market on this marker and was of the expectation that it would be as specified. Not that overall its totally not worth it, and honestly considering that my plan was to eventually Virtue the thing anyway it will not turn out to be a huge issue in the long run in anything except the resale value of the stock board and battery combo.

I am going to contact the seller. I feel like guy should make right on this in some way. Not sure how, and honestly doubt that he will. Overall, its not a deal breaker anyway. Not like I want to send it back to him over it. Just pisses me off that he wasn't fully forthright from the getgo. And I hate that bad feedback trap.

[wimag]

if he said mint it should be mint. You have his verbage that says it is.... go after him. Dont worry about the bad feedback trap.
I went through the exact same thing with FBM years ago and called him out on it.

[robnix]

I know this seems a very obvious question. I just wonder, if you are taking about an item that is several years old, do you think there is any allowance for saying "mint" and the expectation of that condition in spite of its age?

More in a minute...

In terms of paintball gear, mint to me means the exterior needs to be scratch free and the marker needs to be in perfect working condition.

[trevorjk]

usually a flavor, mostly associated with gum

but seriously, i hold mint as in basically a BNIB condition. but i have learned that nothing is mint untill i see hi-res pictures that show amazing detail of every inch of the gun. if i dont get those, i wont purchase a used gun.

[maniacmechanic]

if he said this ; When discussing with him the condition through PM's he once again mentioned the perfect shape and working order.
go after him PC & don't let him use the it was my friends gun , I didn't know card , seems to me he should pay for a new stock board , or whatever it takes to fix it
your lucky you know angel's , what if some other noob bought it & didn't

[punkncat]

I wrote the guy a rather lengthy reply. I am asking him to make right on the deal. We will see where it goes.

[BigEvil]

I have NEVER received one item Ive purchased via PBN arrive in the condition it was described.

[punkncat]

I have NEVER received one item Ive purchased via PBN arrive in the condition it was described.

Honestly this was only my second transaction there. I really try to avoid it when I can because of the same stupid stuff. In both transactions there have been problems....just not too many other places to find an Angel nowdays. Even AOG is rediculous, slow and high.