Do barrel "inserts" work?

[Smoothice]

I love my barrel kits.

My first kit was an aci phat kit. It came with 5 different backs and 3 fronts of different length.

I honestly felt it made a HUGE difference. But maybe I just bought into the hype. I play a lot of pump. So with the closed bolt of an autococker it is necessary to have the right size bore.

When playing semi I usually over bore anyways.

[Spider-TW]

(way out in front behind a tiny thing...that you probably shouldn't have ran to....but it's too late now)

I was at that thing a couple of weekends ago. Obviously my barrel is still too long.

[Avianrave]

I can't remember any problems I've had with my scepter barrel kit.

[mpsd]

I have several Freak based barrels (SP Freaks, WWA and DW Fiburs - the BEST of all). I really think they improve accuracy and the barrel to bore match help with the eventual roll downs. Of course, if you have a single bore barrell, it can be just as great, if it fits the paint just as well. I mostly use the following bore sizes: 685, 687 and 690. Still, as I said, if you like aluminum barrels, don't like the idea of having inserts but want to match the paint to the barrel, look for the Eclipse ones and the Dye ones. They allow you to change the back part of the barrel and do it.

[Sumthinwicked]

i wouldnt use another kit besides the freak inserts in my eyes no matter what barrel they are in dw, stiff tip ,or freak back i swear by them i bet money on my shots

[cyberave68]

I am mostly a single peice barrel man my self. I did once go and get the new Sly carbon barrel kit. And i have to say it sucked donkey doo doo. The thing i have learned since then is with a kit of any kind you dont want 2"-3" sizers!!!! they are to short and have way to much room after the sizer for the ball to move around. My grouping went WAY down hill till i put the factory barrel back on my timmy. I do have a freak kit that i like. Those inserts are 6" long and seem to fit just right with the paint. i still have more single barrels but if you want need a kit get one with a little longer sizer/inserts as it will be much better in my opinion....

Cy

[Thotograph]

I agree with Cyber... the effective barrel length shouldn't be overlooked. Both the Sly and Stiffi kit use control bores that are under 3 inches. There's not enough effective barrel length to let the ball accelerate. I don't know if a larger bored front really provides a benefit but a short back is most def a detriment.

I own three different kits: Pipe, Dye ULs, and the new Alien Mayday kit. The pipe is a nice kit for the money. I've found that my Dye backs with the Stiffi front make sense. Not too much porting with the 12" Stiffi tip I have (actually it makes a 13" barrel but ohh well). The cf front is a nice option, and Alien's comes with a CF front as it is.

The Redz kit has 8" backs which is what Tom found to be the optimum effective length. I wish that Stiffi would make a front for the Redz kit b/c I think the chilli porting design is way too ugly for me to shoot. Still they have the right idea in their design as far as function goes.

Lately the Alien Mayday has been my go to kit. If you don't mind shooting a 14" I highly suggest the Mayday kit from Alien. CF front and an even 7" for back and tip. It shot amazingly on my Viking the other day. If Jack made a 12" tip it'd be the perfect kit in my eyes (unless someone releases an 8" back kit that isn't butt ugly). WGP Kaner kits are 8" too but they're rare & expensive (and still pretty ugly imo).

Find what works for you and stick with it. I've bought to many kits to do that but hey... you can learn from all our experiances and hopefully go right to a working combination. For a one-piece I love Javelin barrels from AKA. Lapcos are good too. Just don't be like me and buy too many barrels... I can't decide which one is better so I just keep buying more. The truth is... it's all about what works for you. I also have a DW kit but that doesn't see much use b/c of the evil they harbor inside.

[mabb1975]

I can honestly say in 18 years I have seen every claim and fad that paintball can see. Barrels have always been a huge debate. I remember when SP started and you had to send in your barrel to be drilled. I had one of the very first production 16" SP barrels made for my OLD mag. I loved it. Years later the " insert " debate started. I own upwards of 40 barrels atm. Freak, Stiffi, Revolver and tons of random 1 pc barrels ( most for cocker or Angel ). Between my son and I we pretty much stick to 2 barrels. He uses a full freak kit 12 " and I use a 14" revolver, both cocker threads. I use mine, with 5 inserts, on a Mini, 2 cockers, an SLG, my Pneumag, ICD promaster... think thats all atm, and I couldnt be happier. The field I mainly play at keeps great care of their paint and its darn near factory fresh most the time. Every sunday I get the the field, get my paint, size it and shoot all day. I have great accuracy with maybe 10% at the most going a lil off target to my liking. I will tell you now, it makes NO difference what barrel you use as long as YOUR happy with the output. I do agree with a previous post, the best think about inserts can be with closed bolt markers, aka cocker types. I always go under the paint size with my Ecockers simply to hold paint in place. Hell, my dad still uses a 14 year old chrome J&J 10" barrel with every paint he shoots on his magic box mech mag and loves it. My advice, find the marker that suits you best and then get to a shop that might allow you to sample barrels and find the one you like. After all, my son and I go around and round debating my revolver vs his freak. We cant even win the argument in our own home ! Best of luck

[xero28]

Great information from everybody. Thanks. I have been looking at the Lucky un1tec barrels. The "kit" is basically a bunch of full length, one piece barrels with different bores that attach to a back. They seem relatively inexpensive (I think around $20 for the back and $30 for each barrel). Does anyone have any experience with these. From what I can tell, they aren't made anymore, but I've seen some for sale over at PBN. I think these take care of the problem Cyber was talking about, and really the core of my original question: How could a 2 or 3 inch sizer make that much of a difference when the ball is travelling through another 10-12 inches of non sized barrel?

[Thotograph]

Because it loses the control bore much earlier so for one it can rattle around inside the .7" bore that most are. The increased bore size for the length of the barrel means the majority of acceleration will take place in the 2-3" of sized control bore so it should be less efficient. Quite simply it will lose alot of the push the air has on it because of the severe amount of overboring that occurs. The barrels are used by people with succesful results but for us who understand a bit more of the physics involved we tend to stay away from such an ineffiecient design. One benefit claimed by kits such as Sly is improved self cleaning properties. It most likely just a lack of contact between the bore and the ball as its traveling down. Still I'd rather have a properly sized bore that's at least 6inches long.

[mabb1975]

Just a fast lil reference. My numbers arent exact, to lazy to go measure.

Stiffi Barrel has a 1.5" bore sizer, 4 sizes - good barrel, overpriced imo
Revolver( my fav ) has about a 5" insert, 5 inserts - Love it
Freak ( kids fav ) bout 5" insert, 8 inserts - Kid loves it, I agree its good

Those are the kits I own atm, I have a TON of random single pc barrels atm as well. I have to say there are allot of good barrels. DYE UL's are damn nice barrels with a long history of performance. I still have an original on my mech mag that I use for EVERY brand / size of paint. Bottum line, your trying to make an imperfect paint bore fit a perfect size barrel, it can be a guessing game with all the variables. Send me a PM if ya want more input if ya like, always willing to help.

[cyberave68]

Lately the Alien Mayday has been my go to kit. If you don't mind shooting a 14" I highly suggest the Mayday kit from Alien. CF front and an even 7" for back and tip. It shot amazingly on my Viking the other day. If Jack made a 12" tip it'd be the perfect kit in my eyes (unless someone releases an 8" back kit that isn't butt ugly). WGP Kaner kits are 8" too but they're rare & expensive (and still pretty ugly imo).

Any pics of this kit or a link? I'm in the search for new kit that works...