ManInBlack's Autotrigger

[viper-mayhem]

How realistic is it for you to product the trigger as is? And when?

[ManInBlack]

Looks like it will probably happen IF there is actually enough interest in it. And by interest I mean paying customers. But that's a bit into the future. MagHog and I are still working on getting it right. I finally got my tanks filled and should be able to get this pretty version working soon. Once that happens we'll go from there.

I'd also like to say thanks to everyone commenting in here. It's good to hear what people think about this.

[matteusz]

It's probably going to end up being a set screw you'll have to move into place to chrono or whatever (if you even ever get to use this in a game ). A cam might work but I designed this to be as simple as possible. And also, it's a FULL AUTO trigger .

Tell you what, I'll do some experiments and see if I can get a cam thing or something to work. In all probability though that's probably not going to be realistic to produce.

Here's outside the box for you. Put a pair of magnets to use. Embed one in the trigger and a second one in a piece that could be used like a cam. All you need is a way to slide the "cam" (or maybe jam would be a better term) into place without coming loose. Nothing some simple machine work can't fix.

Bam slap in the jam and chrono. Pop it out and put in in your pocket (or on a string or something) and you are ready to rock.

[Hilltop Customs]

Here's outside the box for you. Put a pair of magnets to use. Embed one in the trigger and a second one in a piece that could be used like a cam. All you need is a way to slide the "cam" (or maybe jam would be a better term) into place without coming loose. Nothing some simple machine work can't fix.

Bam slap in the jam and chrono. Pop it out and put in in your pocket (or on a string or something) and you are ready to rock.

hehe you made an idea pop in my head....how about a small top portion that hits the metal spring directly. Imagine a single and double finger trigger on the same trigger. Pull the upper trigger you get single shot, bottom trigger full auto.

Wouldnt be hard to do this one, probably easier than the cam that I was talking about earlier.


Edit hopefully this makes more sense. The top trigger would pull both triggers, but it would put force against the spring...keeping it from bouncing and going FA. The bottom trigger would only pull the spring back on the bottom, allowing it to bounce and go full auto.

[ManInBlack]

Ok, interesting ideas, but again maybe getting a bit complicated. At this point I'm thinking the best solution would be a simple clip on type thing to fill in the spring gap at the top of the trigger. Yes it's another part to carry around but you'd be doing that with the magnet idea anyway (btw, I'm trying to visualize that and it is kind of a slick idea).

[matteusz]

Ok, interesting ideas, but again maybe getting a bit complicated. At this point I'm thinking the best solution would be a simple clip on type thing to fill in the spring gap at the top of the trigger. Yes it's another part to carry around but you'd be doing that with the magnet idea anyway (btw, I'm trying to visualize that and it is kind of a slick idea).

Thanks. All I mean is instead of a clip you get a chunk that goes behind the spring. Either way a simple piece like this would be the most economical in my mind.

[Maghog]

I think that trying to force this trigger to be a do all, be all trigger is a mistake. Sure, we can figure out a way to lockout the full auto effect, and make it work. One way or another though, you'll require a tool, part, or something to make that happen. Just being able to flick in a lockout switch would make the trigger much more expensive, and when we come along saying that the trigger costs 100$ without any kind of lockout, half of you will be asking us why we can't make the whole thing for $10.50 and probably not buy one anyway.

It's this simple, if you want full auto, put the trigger in. If you want single shot, put your normal trigger in. That's that. If you want another version, fine. I can incorperate a nifty little switch in there that will double the price of the trigger. Most of the ideas for a lockout that I've seen here might sound good, but we need to think longevity. The last thing I want to do is hear that these triggers start to fall apart in a year.

I am willing to do what you guys want. I really love this mod, and that's why I'm considering making a run of them, but as soon as the *****ing and moaning about money starts, I'm done. It's not my source of income and I don't need to stress myself more than I already am.

So you guys think about it and make up your minds what you want.

I don't mean to sound bitter, rather I am talking out of experiences I've made in the past.
I'm done giving away stuff for nothing, and I can still promise that I would work on this project with a minimal profit margin, JUST to make you guys happy.

Dan


Sorry about the cussing Mods, I got carried away.

[viper-mayhem]

Agreed. I would buy the trigger if the cost is relatively inexpensive(under $35). Thats a comparison on aftermarket trigger. Yes some do cost more and some less. Your idea is fine. Let the others figure out a way to make it either full or semi. Production must start before changes occur. If more of an interest is in the cam idea after production, then use some of that money to fund the project further.

Guys, he had definitely done a lot of work and hasn't gotten paid yet. If you like the idea, then show him the cash.

[DanMan]

when you buy something custom think about how long it will take to make it. Then think how much you get paid per hour. Alot of stuff it is pretty well priced when you think of it like that. So i have to agree with Maghog, dont complain about the price if you want it, it very well could be more expensive.

[ManInBlack]

MagHog has spoken

Anyway, next step is for me to get this version working (still have a little filing to do) and then beat the snot out of it. I'm literally going to be running thousands upon thousands of cycles with this thing. Different pressure settings, speeds, etc. I'm going to try to break it. If it can survive what I'm going to put it through then we'll be closer to making some.

[matteusz]

I think that trying to force this trigger to be a do all, be all trigger is a mistake. Sure, we can figure out a way to lockout the full auto effect, and make it work. One way or another though, you'll require a tool, part, or something to make that happen. Just being able to flick in a lockout switch would make the trigger much more expensive, and when we come along saying that the trigger costs 100$ without any kind of lockout, half of you will be asking us why we can't make the whole thing for $10.50 and probably not buy one anyway.

It's this simple, if you want full auto, put the trigger in. If you want single shot, put your normal trigger in. That's that. If you want another version, fine. I can incorperate a nifty little switch in there that will double the price of the trigger. Most of the ideas for a lockout that I've seen here might sound good, but we need to think longevity. The last thing I want to do is hear that these triggers start to fall apart in a year.

I am willing to do what you guys want. I really love this mod, and that's why I'm considering making a run of them, but as soon as the *****ing and moaning about money starts, I'm done. It's not my source of income and I don't need to stress myself more than I already am.

So you guys think about it and make up your minds what you want.

I don't mean to sound bitter, rather I am talking out of experiences I've made in the past.
I'm done giving away stuff for nothing, and I can still promise that I would work on this project with a minimal profit margin, JUST to make you guys happy.

Dan


Sorry about the cussing Mods, I got carried away.

Hmm I was just knocking around ideas. When it comes to actual production the decision is you guys. Do you want to make it, will it sell for enough to make a profit worth doing it? If you can't answer yes to those I would be happier if you didn't do it either. Besides when it does come down to it I wonder how much practical use anyone will get out of one of these anyway?

[chinstrap]

Besides when it does come down to it I wonder how much practical use anyone will get out of one of these anyway?

Personally, I was planning to use it in outlaw games where everybody is playing with full-auto electros.

I prefer my mech mag and don't have the resources (read time or money) at the moment to convert it even if I wanted to and also haven't been able to find an adjustable tank for a decent price.

This just happens to be the perfect solution if it can get around 10 BPS with an 850 PSI preset and ends up being under $50 or so (ideally). That, and both versions look sweet; ManInBlack's because it's got this vicious, nasty, made-in-a-garage, no-frills kind of thing going on and Maghog's because it matches the spinnaz on my Escalade.


So either way, I'm in and will be waiting patiently with my fingers crossed. No way to turn it off needed; I figure I can stick something in the middle of the bouncy thing and the trigger if need be.

I also don't care how ghetto it looks, for the record, as long as it functions well and doesn't mess up my marker.

[Maghog]

Alright, let's do the math, because your expectations (so far stated)are not feasable for me.
I need two and a half hours to hand cut, carve, file and polish one of these. This does not include overhead, with polishing pastes, saw blades, cutters, plate stock, electricity, and so forth. Then I have to ship them to ManInBlack who still needs to fit in the steel blade, test and send it on to the customer.
How much would you ask for a single unit if you had to do all this to produce it?


Now, I could look into have these things cast to reduce the cost, which would be poorer quality, and only really work if we made a batch of 500 or so. This would require a large up front investment that I don't have and a commitment on the part of the consumer which is hard to rely on. In the end you could cut off 30-40% of the above mentioned method, and still risking the poor quality which could wind us up with 500 broken triggers in a half year. This is a path I'd rather not follow, but worth mentioning for the sake of this post.

So I know what I'd charge, but it's interesting to hear your thoughts.
Honestly, what would you expect to make for such a production?
I'm interested.
Dan

[snoopay700]

Alright, let's do the math, because your expectations (so far stated)are not feasable for me.
I need two and a half hours to hand cut, carve, file and polish one of these. This does not include overhead, with polishing pastes, saw blades, cutters, plate stock, electricity, and so forth. Then I have to ship them to ManInBlack who still needs to fit in the steel blade, test and send it on to the customer.
How much would you ask for a single unit if you had to do all this to produce it?


Now, I could look into have these things cast to reduce the cost, which would be poorer quality, and only really work if we made a batch of 500 or so. This would require a large up front investment that I don't have and a commitment on the part of the consumer which is hard to rely on. In the end you could cut off 30-40% of the above mentioned method, and still risking the poor quality which could wind us up with 500 broken triggers in a half year. This is a path I'd rather not follow, but worth mentioning for the sake of this post.

So I know what I'd charge, but it's interesting to hear your thoughts.
Honestly, what would you expect to make for such a production?
I'm interested.
Dan

Honestly man for the practical uses of this trigger and the fairly small amount of people that are interested in it, i would say it's not really worth it on your part.

[trevorjk]

i would say its not worth it to do a production run, but more of a built upon purchase thing. with the time an effort i could easily see these triggers going for $75-$100 easy. and at the price the majority of paintballers will not be buying. however you will get some sales, just not enough for a production run.

just my .2cents