Ridiculous Store Rules? Or not?

[maniacmechanic]

Loneassassin don't you mean a caveman
To heck with the 1st store , you should have ask for a on/off pin for a X valve just to see the look on his face
I guess nobody has ever heard of bending the rules , most insurance companys also say no full auto on the PB field ( insurance co's suck )
I NEVER use locktite on reg threads
I try to use my local B & M but he rarely has anything I need ( Mags & AKA's ) but I still stop in & shoot the bull
Sound's like shop #2 has it going on , I bet if you take your other 2 tanks he will fill them for free also

[d4m4don3]

Sorry to hear about the bs going on in your area.
Out here competition is still cut throat and there are a bunch of paintball stores competing for your business. Those guys are pulling your leg. Most stores here will not only sell you the regulator right out of box but they will also offer to install the reg for you free of charge and not pull the overnight required bull. They will ask to keep it overnight to check for slow leaks but most of the stores here aren't going to pressure you to do it. Do what a lot of folks are doing now, buy it online.

[mpsd]

I have a small, personal rule: if you have to beg to buy something, just don't. The market is open and big and I preffer to spend more money and have good service than having to ask some shmock to sell me something for the love of G-d (unless, of course, we are talking about a SFL Mag or something just as rare).

But, then again, that's just mine personal rule.

[MagBearingBear]

They don't. My local Fire & Safety department screwed my MaxFlo on my Crossfire tank for free, and said they never use locktite on any of their compressed air tanks. They used a giant strap vice and a huge wrench to tighten it on, that sucker ain't goin nowhere.

The reason Fire Departments do not Locktite their pressure bottles is because it is a chemical, and the tanks are used for breathing air. Don't want anything like that in a closed breathing system, which can be deadly. Use red Locktite if you want for securing the reg valve on your bottle (paintball uses are more demanding, so I always use the stuff). The tanks the FD uses have scuba connections, so the valves are not subject to the twisting paintball tanks are put through.

[OPBN]

Just got back from the second shop. Barely made it before closing time, but the guy didn't even bat an eye to stay later, put the reg on, fill the tank and my others, and you know what? I bought a new barrel and tank cover for the new tank

Man I need to find somewhere closer for fills.

[BiNumber3]

On the insurance side, they needa make sure there's no way they'll be held liable for an unscrewed reg. As for locktite, maybe it's more to make sure that even if they don't torque it to spec it'll be ok, most of those guys workin in those shops prolly don't even realize there is a spec'ed torque rating
They do needa make some money as well.

The shop nearest to me wont even fill a tank if they know you installed the reg yourself...

As for needing loctite for paintball uses.. I believe TK and Glen palmer stated that there is no need as long as the reg is torqued to spec

[Beemer]

You guys can sort it out and I know you dont want to hear it but this is just another reason I say Paintball GOT stupid. Screw in tanks at 4500PSI is stupid.

Its about STANDARDS,we dont HAVE or follow any. ASTM ya right. Same fill nipple for 3000 and 4500PSI ya stupid.

DO NOT use RED loctite on your reg. You risk damage to the threads on the vessal and the reg when you try to remove it. Torque standard not locktited....DOH

Paintball had a clue till all the smart folks left.



___________

[Watcher]

I sell regs and CO2 valves all the time at my store. We always offer free installation on any parts purchased at our store in case someone doesn't feel like screwing around with it, but if they want to handle it themselves we won't tell them they have to do otherwise.

We've had noone seriously injured blowing their reg off of a tank by vicing it and removing the old one with 3000psi still in the tank and them coming into the store and sueing us...



I don't know what that guy was trying to pull.


Personally, i can't stand letting other people tech my stuff unless it is something I obviously can't do. Like weld/solder...

[trevorjk]

was to lazy to read the rest of the thread after your post. BUT, it is RECOMMENDED that a certified tech install the tank regulator. however, you have to be a complete moron not to be able to screw a tank regulator onto a tank with a drop of red loctite to keep it in place.

with that said, this shop is being to cautious. find another local shop that will sell it to you, or worst case buy it 3-5$ cheaper online.

[Hobbez]

As someone who has owned a business, had to pay for the insurance, and faced a frivilous lawsuit, I understand why the store may have this rule. I think you'll find its not a required thing, but something the owner put in place because hes had problems in the past. He sells a reg, someone installs it wrong, it blows up and they sue his business for 5 million dollars. Its not his fault, but the lawers don't care about whos actually in the wrong, just about the cash. Hes just trying to cover his ***. Its a crappy rule, and will hurt his business in the long run but, a couple of idiots is all it takes to wreck it for the rest of us.

[OPBN]

As someone who has owned a business, had to pay for the insurance, and faced a frivilous lawsuit, I understand why the store may have this rule. I think you'll find its not a required thing, but something the owner put in place because hes had problems in the past. He sells a reg, someone installs it wrong, it blows up and they sue his business for 5 million dollars. Its not his fault, but the lawers don't care about whos actually in the wrong, just about the cash. Hes just trying to cover his ***. Its a crappy rule, and will hurt his business in the long run but, a couple of idiots is all it takes to wreck it for the rest of us.

And I don't necessarily have a problem with the rule of them installing the reg. I was willing to bring the tank back in. My main issue was with not being willing to install the regulator on the spot. It's not like they're swamped with customers 24/7. I felt the need to hold it overnight was a bit excessive, especially after explaining the circumstances of the distance I have to drive. And it's not like it's the first time I have been in the shop....

[Chronobreak]

I understand the shop wanting to install the reg themselves if they have the proper tools/trained staff.

I work at a field and you never know how a tank/reg was treated when you got to fill it, how securely it is on etc, from a pure safety standpoint i understand completely.

Maybe next time call ahead and ask a few questions before you drive and this all could have been avoided.

and as said all it takes is one person who installed a reg incorrectly or to get hurt for that shop to be in a heap of trouble, or get a load of bad publicity at the least.

I feel a lot of people treat tank safety too lightly, and its a miracle we have not had more issues with the cylinders we use daily.

[OPBN]

Maybe next time call ahead and ask a few questions before you drive and this all could have been avoided.

Err, I did, that's why I ended up going somewhere else.

And sad to say, but it was all for nought anyways..... Too late last night to actually put the tank on and try it, but got to this morning and realized they gave me a LP output reg. Was having a hard time reaching the correct FPS and decided to check the output. Only registers around 500PSI output. sigh.

[mt84]

First I'm not an expert in any way....

Reminder... A few years ago, a mother was killed by a flying tank at a paintball field in the USA...Investigation found that valve was not properly installed....After that incident an advisory was issued to the industry.....

So before we has a group start complaining...We should check with Local, State and federal (DOT) on the proper way to install the valves...

I Know, TC (Transport Canada) has guide line for such thing....Must be locktit... We use Blue Locktit here. Blue Locktit requies 12 hrs to cure correctly....

My 2 Cents...

[DevilMan]

First I'm not an expert in any way....

Reminder... A few years ago, a mother was killed by a flying tank at a paintball field in the USA...Investigation found that valve was not properly installed....After that incident an advisory was issued to the industry.....

So before we has a group start complaining...We should check with Local, State and federal (DOT) on the proper way to install the valves...

I Know, TC (Transport Canada) has guide line for such thing....Must be locktit... We use Blue Locktit here. Blue Locktit requies 12 hrs to cure correctly....

My 2 Cents...

MT84, that was more than a few years ago. And yes it happened. And yes it was because something was done incorrectly. The player didn't pay attention to what he was doing. If he had been, he would have noticed 1. that it was taking a very long time to get the 5 threads off of his marker 2. that the tension wasn't relaxing on the force of the threads 3. the bottle/system hadn't off gassed after the first few turns. It was negligence on their part from what I ever read/saw/heard about it. And though they did raise a huge stink and it all went to hell... I'm not saying the regs aren't good for us all, but it does take a little bit of grey matter in ANYTHING that you do to keep from getting hurt. When you fail that part and end up hurting/killing someone else you should have the balls to own up that you mucked up... instead you push it off on someone else and blame them.

That also came up with the relief groove cut into the reg threads. I don't know if it's mandatory or not, as I've never cared to look it up, but I'm pretty sure most if not all have that groove cut so that if you get 2 or 3 threads out of the bottle it'll off gas there first. ALSO, the regs on average have a 1.5-2" threaded length that goes into the bottle. If you notice the bottle only has about a 3/4" or so area that is actually threaded. So you are going to be unscrewing for a good bit before you get the reg off. I do think they should make it mandatory if it's not already to have a hole drilled crossways of the reg threads about 1" from the end so that when you get to that point you know it will off gas.

And from what I've heard, I didn't think you were supposed to use Loctite anymore. Could be wrong, it wouldn't be the first, but for sure, I would not use RED on it.

As for the shop... meh.... save gas, buy one of TKs Mini Comps! Shoot all ya like! Charge your friends to fill theirs and make up the cost!

DM