Efficiency mod?

[hill160881]

This is where i was thinking of turning an oring grove. Where the point of the pick is, Then it would stay in contact with the power tube the entire time

[RogueFactor]

Did you ever try putting a seal at the front of the breech or perhaps adding a ring to the bolt? Seems like doing this mod and sealing the front end of the bolt could have a larger impact.

That was the very first thing tried(pic below). It was tried on a L10 bolt. This is what lead me to eventually modify the powertube tips, hoping the combination would have a noticeable effect.

It was really an idea that Smart Parts came up with, with their 'Seal Forward Technology' or SFT. This also had negligible effects, both alone and later combined with the modified powertube tips.

[Tao]

Interesting idea. Ive noticed air coming through the sear space when I had leaks down the barrel.

I am interested in what TK has to say

[TwilightG]

It has, but not publicized. This was something I tinkered with back around late ~2006. I did it on both a L10 and L7 tip, here is a pic:

why not publicize it?
I can understand if you were looking to sell a product, that makes perfect sense.
But since you ended up shelving the idea, why not share your findings w/ the Automag community?

Even if the results are negligible, would you mind posting the data you have? This could be more beneficial for pump-mag owners who are trying to get as much efficiency as possible.

[68calsportz]

testing testing

I would love to see what comes out of this mod. I play alot of outlaw ball and i love my mags. But, air hogs they are. Is any one gonna do some intensive testing or what?

[cockerpunk]

That was the very first thing tried(pic below). It was tried on a L10 bolt. This is what lead me to eventually modify the powertube tips, hoping the combination would have a noticeable effect.

It was really an idea that Smart Parts came up with, with their 'Seal Forward Technology' or SFT. This also had negligible effects, both alone and later combined with the modified powertube tips.

the level 10 bolts already had about a .005 swell around the nose in an attempt to seal the breach a bit better.

[Spider-TW]

So could the sustained high rate of fire be what is giving me better efficiency?

And what about putting the oring inside the bolt like a sail oring? Then it would maintain contact with the power tube the entire time.

It's possible. That rate suggests you have a high input pressure though...

http://www.airgundesignsusa.com/rtchrono.shtml

It depends on how you counted your other tank for comparison.

[RogueFactor]

why not publicize it?
I can understand if you were looking to sell a product, that makes perfect sense.
But since you ended up shelving the idea, why not share your findings w/ the Automag community?

For many reasons, but foremost because everything I prototype and test is for the purpose of creating new products. The idea was shelved(not abandoned) to be revisited.

Is any one gonna do some intensive testing or what?

Its not a hard modification to do, nothing really to stop anyone from doing it themselves.

[hill160881]

It's possible. That rate suggests you have a high input pressure though...

http://www.airgundesignsusa.com/rtchrono.shtml

It depends on how you counted your other tank for comparison.

No high pressure, just the normal 850 psi input.

[Dirge]

I would love to see what comes out of this mod. I play alot of outlaw ball and i love my mags. But, air hogs they are. Is any one gonna do some intensive testing or what?

Second that. I would like to see if this leads anywhere (more shots are always welcome )

[Smoothice]

Way to go Hill for trying new things.

I wonder how this an Loguzzzzzz's valve devolumizing mod (wow. Try and say that 3 times fast) would work with 12 gram use. I know I got quit a jump in shots per 12 gram with my "testing" of the devolumized valve.

[hill160881]

devolumised, with the oring on the brass thingy, with an oring on the front of the bolt mite all add up to a hell of a gain. It will be a while but i will do all the testing i can. I just need one of those Level 10 bolts rogue has with the oring on the front.

[Sandman]

De-volumizing (is that a word?) the valve does create more efficiency but raises the operating pressure of the gun. It's already been done and even sold. We called it the HyperMag. Some of you may remember that. It was only on a classic valve. Jeff Schrieber (past airgun tech) used to make the modification to other guns.
Here is a pic of the valve.



We did it for two reasons. Efficiency and trigger speed. Mags love high pressure. The higher they run the faster things move and the tighter the guns felt.

The power tube tip o-ring was done years ago too. The problem is, I don't remember what the conclusion over it was. Obviously it was never put on a production gun, but again I can't remember why. Tom might remember. I have a note to him seeing if he recalls what the findings were.
Sandman

[hill160881]

I would be interested to see why they did not put a version with all these modifications into production. Maybe it all adds up to a small gain but not worth the extra effort in production.

[Sandman]

Tom's response was simple
"because the o-ring's didn't last and rolled out of the groove. tk"

Can't hurt to do more testing.