I guess I should have asked for opinions on performance as opposed to just opinions. It seems like a great deal of the paintball world (sometimes myself included) will focus on apperance instead of function. If I were to adjust the original question....it would probably read more like... Looking for on hand users of the new Empire Resurrection. Wanting to know if you feel it will be a good reliable marker. Wanting to know if it will be hard to tune, tinker with, or be as finicky as autocockers of the past. I have owned only one other autococker in the past 15 plus years and told myself I would never do it again. The fact that automags are usually fixed by replacing an oring was way too impressionable on me while I watched others not be able to play all day while "fixing" their guns. Please give any feedback you feel would sway my opinion of the new Empire (aside from apperance. afterall, it is not looks that allows you to play on the field all day). Thanks
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The same could be said about motorcycles... Anyways, like I said... "to each their own". There's no point going down this road. You can't argue with someone's sense of beauty/style, because it's not a science. If someone likes it, then that's all that matters. You can either accept it for what it is, or shake your head and look down on them.
I know that this is obviously not the forum to be trying to pump up said marker.
AO has somewhat of a mob mentality when it comes to these things, so I'm not going to get into that. It'd be a futile effort on my part to try to have an unbiased discussion here.
I've shot one. They are nice. Like I said in my original post, I wanted to hate it, but I can't. They shoot well. The trigger is smooth and very hard to short stroke. On the flip side, your fears are valid. It will go out of time like any other cocker if you mess with the settings. It's still a cocker.Last edited by rschoi_75; 06-09-2013, 08:35 AM.Comment
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I personally like the way Autocockers look aesthetically. Only reason I have shied away for the most part is the continual mention of how finicky and hard to tune they can be.Comment
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The same can be said about motorcycles, cars, lawnmowers, power tools... basically anything men typically try to be compensatory about. But right now, we're talking about cockers.The same could be said about motorcycles... Anyways, like I said... "to each their own". There's no point going down this road. You can't argue with someone's sense of beauty/style, because it's not a science. If someone likes it, then that's all that matters. You can either accept it for what it is, or shake your head and look down on them.
I know that this is obviously not the forum to be trying to pump up said marker. AO has somewhat of a mob mentality when it comes to these things, so I'm not going to get into that. It'd be a futile effort on my part to try to have an unbiased discussion here.
I'm not trying to "pump" the marker either way; I'm just trying to be rational.
The parts that always annoyed me on my old autococker were the 3-way o-rings, which were the first to leak and were a pain to get at. (In fact, the second time around, I decided it wasn't worth my time and sold it.) Here it looks like you can slide the assembly out the back (?). You can also service the ram without removing it, and it has the wrench flats where appropriate. Those were some of the niceties that I mentioned.
I do find it curious that amidst all this talk of aesthetics and manufacturing origin that very little has been said about the valve. If it shares the same design as the Sniper, that means it's a Spyder valve, and the valve has to come out the back and take an exciting ride over the IVG threads."Accuracy by aiming."
Definitely not on the A-Team.Comment
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If you buy one Toof, I am going to borrow it, a lot. I got to shoot the one that a player was using at Tuna Ball. A couple notes on performance: the trigger was nice and crisp, not too light and not too stiff. As much as I tried, it was really hard to short stroke it. One of the design implements I noted right off the bat was a lack of a cocking rod coming out the back. I meant to ask Simon about it but did not have a chance. Overall I sense that the reliability will be good, just as long as you don't mess with the timing
Now as a personal opinion, I loved cockers for their ability to be upgraded and mod'd to ones personal taste. There was a lot of aluminum on the bodies and that made a great canvas for millwork and personal touches. One of the things I liked about the cockers was all the moving parts. I thought it was cool having the back block cycling and all the sound it made.
Mag's are the coolest, but cockers are cool too. Wait until people start selling their used resurrections or the price comes down...even though it sounds like you are ready to order one.Comment
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No cocking rod required because it's a half block design
The bolt pin cocks the hammer through a slot in the bodyComment
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My friend just told me about this thread and I figured I would throw in my 2 cents because I have some strong opinions about this gun. Now first let me say, I have not even held one yet. But with that said, I not sure if I want to. 550 for a Mech gun, an Autococker? Really? Who thought up this price point? A gun that although has a great reputation for air efficiency, nice appearance and accuracy but also notorious for having problems and being a gun that the average person has a hard time working on. Several people mentioned the performance but 550 I will say it again, does it come with a guarantee not to miss? I love my Mags, and I love my mech mag with the ULE body and X-valve but I don't think I would pay that for a mag new. I say if you really want one wait a year and they will be down a couple hundred bucks. I would have also liked some new colors like the old cockers not just this gray color. Lastly I too am not too excited about a barrel kit that goes up in sizes of .005, might work some times depending on the paint but it also might be too big or small depending on the paint.Comment
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Grab a set of calipers and move them .005 apart to get a feel for how small of an increment that is.Comment
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As the person responsible for bringing an autococker back to the market, it's interesting to see people upset about a mech gun costing $550. Are you under the impression that it should be cheaper than an electro just because it's mech?
What if the mech gun has more parts (or in this case WAY, WAY, WAY more parts), costs more to make, and costs more to assemble and build than electro guns that are $1,299.95?
Bah, it's mech so it should be cheaper, right
Oh and fancy milling... to compare it to guns of old... but it's not selling at the prices of fancy guns of old... I remember when JUST the body of the KAPP flame cocker was going for more than this gun costs!
If you are just looking at this gun from a price point then you are missing the whole point of the "Resurrection", that's ok though because there are many other options for you to choose from. This gun certainly isn't for everybody, and it was never intended to be.
How many cockers can you buy new right now? One. How many electro options? Too many.
There is something that is just fun about autocockers. If you are the kind of person that knows and understands that and is willing to put up with their quirks then the Resurrection is for you.
p.s. I am quite entertained to see the old 'Mag V's 'Cocker debate raging again. It's been more than 10 years since we really saw that and it's fun to see it even be possible again
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This requires a separate reply.
Thank you.
And then go and check the sizes and tolerances of many barrel bores and let me know the numbers you find...
And then go and check the inconsistencies in paint sizes and let's compare that to the 0.005 in bore size steps...
Oh and as for the size variation, I have seen paint that was loose in a .670 and tight in a .695 in the last year. It all depends on the brand and country of manufacture. Some Russian and Asian paint right now is HUGE, players at HB bought out CP's entire barrel stock of .696 barrels.
Paintball is a global game played in many different conditions with many factors that make the paint vary. With a closed bolt gun being able to underbore the paint is important so prevent roll outs. Hence the huge and extremely good barrel kit that comes with the Resurrection.
As for the Pro teams switching away from the same barrel system?
Funnily enough they just posted a recent picture of Drew Templeton from Infamous on Facebook today shooting a Vanquish. He is one of the most technically capable pro players. If not the most technically capable pro player. Guess which barrel he is using? Yep the original one I made for him which is identical to the kit that comes with the Resurrection.
The move to the freak system, which quite simply is inferior in many ways, was purely due to sales and marketing decisions. I fought against it from a functionality point of view. I lost. I guess that kind of thing is part of the reason I chose to move on.
I believe the barrel kit with the Resurrection is one of the best kits you can get in paintball right now. It kills me that KEE wouldn't sell it on it's own.
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I love the whole idea.
I am a machine guy, as a mechanical engineer I am amazed at machines. I love to watch a machine as it produces what ever it makes. I have sat and watched as an Italian machine had a single strand of 18k gold wire go in one end and woven gold rope chain came out the bottom. . . .simply amazing!
The Autococker is a machine, a contraption if you will. They bang and clack and then a little paintball leaves one end - I love' em! I may even have to get one!
At the moment I do get my Autococker "FIX" from the mid-blocked E2 blade Karnivor that I built for myself a few years ago, I only wish that I used it more but I say that about ALL my paintball guns (the by-product of being a gun whore
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manike is 100% correct in that a mechanical gun does not = cheaper. An Electro has many less moving parts and is much cheaper to produce. the PC board in an electro cost only a couple dollars to produce in the quantities that these companies are buying.
I am glad to see the Resurrection!
. . . . .but EVERYONE knows that Automags > Autocockers ! ! ! !
......You know you want one!!Comment
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To be fair I don't think it is a matter of being upset at the cost. It's just that if you spend a lot of time on used gun forums and ebay you see what were once top end mech cockers (shocktech, eclipse, kapp, and p&p), in good to excellent condition, going for less than what a new Resurrection retails for. I am sure there are good reasons for this, you listed quite a few that should easily dismiss this remark, but it is quite simply a subtle form of sticker shock. I could not imagine a new "stock" cocker going for more than a hot-rodded used one because something about that reality does not seem justifiable in my own mind, and similarly from this thread the minds of others. Would I pay 550 for a resurrection...well if I had that money then yes because the marker is badace, but probably not before I spent a lot of time looking for an old school used one in great shape, with all the bells and whistles, going for considerably less or even slightly more.
My only question is why not a resurrection automag? That would be tie-ties.
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First, isn't "rational aesthetics" an oxymoron?
Also, we have to remember cocker fans like to hear "clack clack clack" instead of chuffs and pings. That's part of the cocker aesthetic. Halfblocks dampen that a lot (no back block), which I find sad, but I have to agree that a full bolt doesn't add anything when you have rod guides.
Fancy bodies aren't what they used to be in mass production. Now, they are just time and tool wear beyond the initial design effort. Still, fancy means extra and is certainly worth something when compared to simple stick of extruded aluminum [WGP].
I like to watch cockers playing, but I can never convince myself to go there. I've owned working cockers, but they never last a week before being pumped, and I have never actually used one on a field, which is pretty far down the list now that I think about it.
At least mags and cockers have an aesthetic. I just realized that I segregate all of my other electros into simple "spoolie" and "poppet" categories. My favorite non-mag electro is another one of Simon's projects in part, which is a Lasoya Promaster. You just can't please all of the people all of the time.Comment
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I agree! It gives me that warm fuzzy nostalgic feeling!
Whether or not I end up with one of these, I'm happy that the autococker lives on and its not just fading away into paintball history.Comment
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