Lack of accuracy is what makes paintball the game it is.

[nak81783]

Repeatability. now that works. I care more about the ball hitting the same place every time than anything.

Don't mean to pick on you cockerpunk and blackdeath1k, but sure...

We will change the already established scientific contrast between accuracy and precision, and instead make accuracy equal to precision, and precision not equal to repeatability, but it's own thing. Can reproducibility still be equal to repeatability, or should we get really crazy and make it equal both repeatability and precision...and therefore accuracy?

I truly mean this is good fun.

I see why it's better to take, whatever word is used, in context...

[blackdeath1k]

Repeatability. now that works. I care more about the ball hitting the same place every time than anything. That and it breaking on target. Don't like paint bouncing off of steel structures hitting me in the back.

But that said. I don't think this would have stayed a hide and seek sport regardless of paint. To many players want the fast in your face action.

[nak81783]

SCIENCCCCEEEEEE FIIIIGHT!!!!!!!
lol. Make any marginally technical claim on AO and it's like throwing chum in the water.

I lose. He's got too much data.

We're simply getting our jargon down, so we can discuss things better.

[cockerpunk]

SCIENCCCCEEEEEE FIIIIGHT!!!!!!!
lol. Make any marginally technical claim on AO and it's like throwing chum in the water.

not anymore sadly

<3 deepblue ... was probably the thing that inspired me most to do punkworks.

[Laku]

SCIENCCCCEEEEEE FIIIIGHT!!!!!!!
lol. Make any marginally technical claim on AO and it's like throwing chum in the water.

Part of why I love the place

[BTAutoMag]

theres a guy I play play with, Ben (we all call him "one ball"... Grimm's played against him) he plays pump an he uses a Sniper. Nothing special, doesnt even bore match his paint, uses a .689 stiffi. I LOVE playing against him, cause I get better everytime I do. Normally when you hear someone shoot and when you hear balls break around you, you lag a little. You know that chances of someone hitting you with that first shot is very slim and you can probably get of a few before he sights you in and you pull back. with this guy, however, if you see/hear him shoot, you better have your head already in the motion of pulling back into cover. I have a pictures of me in a fire fight with him, me having pods laying around my feet and splotches of yellow paint peppering the edge of the bunker around where I'm popping out. I've only shot this guy twice, once was the first time he played with me and I was severely under estimated when I shot him with a rental. The last time I ran my butt off to a bunker with a hole in it, knowing his favorite bunkers, and shot him without him even knowing I was there. Grimm will attest to how good this guy is with a pump, hosing paint into him and he pops out and shoots you once in the face mid run.

he is very quiet, doesnt brag and is one of the most humble and kind players I know. He doesnt call himself a sniper, nor do I consider him one as he like to be in your face when playing.

But I guarantee it'll only take him one shot to hit you, lol

[Patron God of Pirates]

SCIENCCCCEEEEEE FIIIIGHT!!!!!!!
lol. Make any marginally technical claim on AO and it's like throwing chum in the water.

[Frizzle Fry]

Let's get our popcorn and dunce caps.

[nak81783]

haha, don;t get me started on science education in this country ... haha

i guess it just seems silly to me bring it up, and it happens every time, someone does it. and its just a whole discussion that doesn't need to be had compared to the main point. im all for accurate (hehehe) terminology, but everyone in this thread knows what we are talking about, there isn't an ambiguity here. and an even better term then precision would probably be repeatability. but again, thats neither here nor there.

idk, i have had A LOT of online arguments about the technical side of paintball. i have fought A LOT of battles on line about this stuff. i convinced the paintball world to use barrels smaller then there the paint for god's sake, i have had some knock out, drag out, fights. and maybe im just old and tired of it, but this one i just can't seem to bring myself to care about. everyone already knows what we mean when we say a guns accuracy ...

Ok. In the post you called me out on, let's pretend I used accuracy/precision interchangeably and said "because it's up to the shooter to provide the skill and execution.

[cockerpunk]

I knew you'd be the one to call me on this. As I stated, it is only for the hypothetical discussion of this thread that I brought it up. Since you said you're fine with my rationale, I'll leave it at that.

One more point though. Since we don't see threads asking how to improve the precision of our markers, does that mean most of us don't have an 8th grade education? Uh oh.

haha, don;t get me started on science education in this country ... haha

i guess it just seems silly to me bring it up, and it happens every time, someone does it. and its just a whole discussion that doesn't need to be had compared to the main point. im all for accurate (hehehe) terminology, but everyone in this thread knows what we are talking about, there isn't an ambiguity here. and an even better term then precision would probably be repeatability. but again, thats neither here nor there.

idk, i have had A LOT of online arguments about the technical side of paintball. i have fought A LOT of battles on line about this stuff. i convinced the paintball world to use barrels smaller then there the paint for god's sake, i have had some knock out, drag out, fights. and maybe im just old and tired of it, but this one i just can't seem to bring myself to care about. everyone already knows what we mean when we say a guns accuracy ...

[Patron God of Pirates]

True but, what makes the game challenging is that FS rounds force folks to choose low capacity, for long range and better accuracy, or, high capacity for reduced range and reduced accuracy. Successful application of either of these rounds require the appropriate tactics.

True. I have never played any scenario or even seen an FS round. I'm only conceptually familiar with them. I guess my point is more appropriately applied in an across the board manner. Even more so if you take it back to the beginning. What would the game be today if high precision/accuracy (whatever we call it) had been the norm from the get go? Would speedball have ever been born? I'm suggesting that it would not have. The game would be much more milsim and more closely resemble airsoft. In my experience most people start playing paintball expecting a more milsim game and keep playing because actual paintball is way more fun than crawling around in the grass getting bit by bugs. But I digress. I don't want this to turn into a milsim vs. speedball thread (I fully understand and respect both sides of that).

[nak81783]

everyone who has taken 8th grade science likes to bring up the accuracy vs precision argument, and its silly, so im gonna nip this in the butt right now.

in paintball, they can be used interchangeably.

why?

because accuracy is the ability and rate at which a system hits a target. so i can take the same gun, and the same target, and i can shoot it, and get 100% accuracy, and 0% accuracy ... how? just by changing the aim point. the aim point relies on the shooter, so one might say, well, that means the person is reposnable for accuracy, while the setup is responsible for precision. and thats fine, im fine with that. but you also don't see threads on forums saying "how can it get more precision from my gun?"

I knew you'd be the one to call me on this. As I stated, it is only for the hypothetical discussion of this thread that I brought it up. Since you said you're fine with my rationale, I'll leave it at that.

One more point though. Since we don't see threads asking how to improve the precision of our markers, does that mean most of us don't have an 8th grade education? Uh oh.

[blackdeath1k]

True but, what makes the game challenging is that FS rounds force folks to choose low capacity, for long range and better accuracy, or, high capacity for reduced range and reduced accuracy. Successful application of either of these rounds require the appropriate tactics.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Only complaint is when your playing in that scenario with FPO and the paint is warped and dimpled and just plain crap. Then no one can hit the broad side of a barn and has to spray and pray.

[nak81783]

If precision to the edge of breaking distance could be relied on by the shooter, then I do think people would take the time to master the skill. Just like so many of us have tried to master snap shooting and all of the other skills that go with the way the game is played now.

This is a good point. But this could be easily countered, because paintballs are so slow. By the time you visually acquire your target, raise marker, apply appropriate lead and holdover, and fire, I would already be at the next bunker by the time the projectile got there.

And if you were laying in wait, paintballs travel about 1/3 the speed of sound. I'd hear the shot and take a dive before it got there. Granted I might not be able to dodge it completely, but I could certainly reduce my profile enough to reduce risk. My friends and I play "Matrix" once in a while. Two guys 50 feet apart take turns one shot a a time. You can't leave your feet, but you can twist, contort, and otherwise dodge the paintball however possible. I know this sounds goofy, but it's fun and relevant.

I guess what I'm saying is there'd be methods to counter any improvement in precision, within the current velocity/safety realm.

[blackdeath1k]

I really think if the paint was more accurate in a farther distance... Say we all have paint that shoots as far and accurate as fs rounds. All it would change is the distance apart of apposing players. Go to any scenario now. You have your guys that will crawl in the mud and brush across a field for a good hidden sniper shot. And you have your up close and personal fire fight guys. That wouldn't change. The guy crawling in the mud and brush will still be there. Just maybe shooting from a farther distance. And your speedball style players will still be there. Probably not shooting from a farther distance.

A fs round shot at 300 fps will fly farther and straighter because its velocity doesn't drop as fast. Along with other more technical reasons. So we could keep the same fps rules and get quicker distance shots with better paint technology. That said. I'm betting the universally allowd fps would drop to compensate for the difference in average speed the ball will be flying when it hits the target.