AGD is Great... But...

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  • HyperSnyper

    #1

    AGD is Great... But...

    Before I start opening up and speaking out loud, I would like to applaud Tom and his great team of airsmiths that developed such a great gun! The design is such an engineering masterpiece. Simplicity with Performance, no strings attached.

    This is my own opinion, not to flame anyone, but I have noticed alot of excessive trust in the designs of Toms great work. Many people here seem to just openly say "Just let Tom do the guess work, his design will always be the best". It bothers me that there are many people like that here. Mindless zombies that put their entire faith into the working of one man (sorry Tom, no pressure).

    I guess what Im trying to say is I wish people would challenge Tom, give their own ideas about different desings. Point out possible (?) flaws. Stimulate the minds here in the Forum. That is what the purpose of this forum is. To expand and collect the creative thoughts, ideas, and opinions of the Mag community. I mean, cmon you guys have to agree with me, what kinda forum would this be if everyone was just a follower and replied to each thread as "Yeah Tom sounds great, put that thingy into production and we'll buy it" or "Wow, thats got to be the greatest idea in the world, I dont think that the design can be perfected anymore". If drivel like that dominated the forums, this forum would be dull and boring.

    The reason this thread popped up was because of too many people responding to my questions with "Dont do anything, Tom has designed it like that for a reason, and anything else will hurt its performance, the design is already the best it can be..." If that was true, then why did Tom see fit for the development and production of the RT valve over the original A.I.R.?

    AGD will always continue to develope new designs, if not they will definately fall behind in the Paintball industry. It is our duty as Forum members to aid Tom as much as possible. I know Tom doesnt have a large research team or anything, but by having a large opionative community online, we are enlargening his R&D department tenfold with the ideas of ACTUAL customers.

    I am not in anyway an AGD hater, I have grown to lust (yes thats right... LUST) after their design. I prefer AGD's design of a gun with a fixed volume air chamber (another variable in the guns consistency) anyday over traditional guns with valve dwell. I have researched the dynamics of other guns (LP Spyders, Cockers, Electros) and chose the simplicity of the Mag over any other gun and instantly upgraded my LP SPyder and GF's LP SPyder to my Micro and GF's Minimag. I have never regret my decision even til today. I dont even regret my decision even with the horde of players here that tell me "Whyd you get a Mag? Dont you know their obsolete... you shoudlve gotten a cocker... (blah blah blah)"

    So again, people keep an open mind, and Tom, great work on such a great gun! I simply cant wait to see what the future of AGD will do to again revolutionize the Paintball World!

    -HyperSnyper
  • shartley
    • Jun 2026

    #2
    Going against the grain....

    HyperSnyper,

    Comment

    • cphilip
      Former Moderator

      • Jun 2026
      • 16216

      #3
      I agree with both of you on this. Tom needs differing opinions and not just gushing praise all the time (well...not that he minds it! ) But it's helpfull to hear the other side sometimes. Don't be afraid to challenge things. He listens to it. Remember the laser graphic on the Intelliframe? He proposed two designs. The majority here said no design at all. At the risk that he wanted one of the two. Heck he might have even drawn them himself. I didn't know or care. So we said forget the designs so the intelliframe would be more neutral for anyones Marker. Presto! He took it. See?


      AGD, where we are so good we can do it with only ONE tube!

      cphilip.com

      Comment

      • slayer
        Registered User
        • May 2001
        • 669

        #4
        Although I give my opinion a lot I believe that many people on this forum, including myself do not have the technical background or understanding to formulate educated and useful opinions on the more technical problems. Maybe I am wrong, and this forum is populated by machinists, tool and die makers, mechanical engineers, and fluid dynamic physicists, but I am just a senior computer engineer and can't say much. With that said, everyone can say whether they like how a marker looks, or how they think it would feel in their hands etc.
        Death smiles on us all. The only thing we can do is smile back.

        Comment

        • AGD
          The man from AGD

          • Oct 2000
          • 5916

          #5
          Well I bought this forum so i could listen to the players. As I stated in another post a day ago I do things based on what YOU tell me. You guys brought back the Z-grip, named the Intelliframe, put a Blade trigger on it too (thanks thats a hot seller). You reworked the side feed, and urged us on with the Superbolt. I almost can't think of anything you all HAVEN'T influenced dramatically.


          AGD
          sigpic

          Comment

          • MajorDamage
            King of Polyester!
            • Dec 2000
            • 3141

            #6
            Most people will say "Let Tom do it" because other companies that make mag products (Benchmark, Shocktech, ANS, and others) dont do tests on their stuff thats up to AGD's standards. So knowing that they dont have high standards, I would go to the people who have been known to have high standards, and great customer support to back up their products. So when I go to get a new trigger frame what options do I consider? Just one: the Z-Grip. I bought this before the Intelliframe(and I never really cared for a .45 frame, and prefer the stock mag frame over a .45) and I went for a Z-Grip. I didnt even consider any of the other frames because I knew they would be a downgrade. I don't consider myself a "YesMan" but I do think thanx should be given where deserved. And AGD's products are made with very high standards, and are very nice products. Ive had a few problems with some of my equipment, and it was usualy either my fault, or the fault of another product(like my old crossfire tank). But AGD, or someone on this forum always helped me out. But I think most of us try to throw an idea or two in when we think of something that could help. Like I didnt vote in the Dye sticky grips VS hogues on the Intelliframe, because I didn't plan on buying an Intelliframe, and didn't think my opinion(if any) would help any with this. And I didn't vote on the 11 bps being to slow thing because I don't really know. I know some people will consider this to slow, but I know some will think its fine. I don't want to talk AGD out of something based on my opinion if its just my opinion(and if I don't think alot of other people have the same veiws on it) if I don't plan on purchasing it myself. I mean, if I say I think this looks better than that and you should do it how I like it, but I wont buy it, does that help? I don't think so, because in this situation I am not the consumer. I am more of a bystander. I don't plan on getting a new 11 bps setup because I am enjoy my ReTro valve, and I don't plan on getting an Intelliframe when I am completly satisfied with my Z-Grip. I hope this makes sence, if not just yell at me .

            ENDO!
            Oldskool

            Comment

            • slayer
              Registered User
              • May 2001
              • 669

              #7
              Originally posted by AGD
              Well I bought this forum so i could listen to the players. As I stated in another post a day ago I do things based on what YOU tell me. You guys brought back the Z-grip, named the Intelliframe, put a Blade trigger on it too (thanks thats a hot seller). You reworked the side feed, and urged us on with the Superbolt. I almost can't think of anything you all HAVEN'T influenced dramatically.


              AGD
              Well if you want our opinions then that is cool and I will continue to give them where I think I know what I am talking about
              Death smiles on us all. The only thing we can do is smile back.

              Comment

              • Miscue
                Super Moderator

                • Oct 2000
                • 7105

                #8
                Believe it or not, there are people who actually know what they are doing. If there weren't, I'd be paranoid everytime I stepped in an elevator, crossed a bridge, rode on a roller-coaster, flew in an airplane. This is my philosophy: Trust technology. Trust the engineers responsible for it.

                Good engineers + the drive to make things great = something special. I think that drive is the more important. Airgun has this drive - you'd have to have your eyes closed to miss this.

                Comment

                • PowerFedMag
                  RT of reliability.
                  • May 2001
                  • 461

                  #9
                  AGD!!! I am not a yes man!

                  Well, since we influence AGD, here's what I would like to influence!

                  -Lighter stock tigger pull

                  -More accessible vert. bodies (i still dont kno where to get one)

                  -chocolate covered bodies, fer when the playing slows down

                  -V nubbins everywhere!

                  -a bolt that isn't so mean to paintballs, forcing them to explode before they reaach barrel exit (maybe that's just my bad paint)

                  -and of course ---- 1'in fore-grip extenders, or even .5'in

                  -impossibly cheap intelliframes!

                  oops, one more ---colored bodies, dark gun metal grey, copper, brass, dark green, etc...


                  There you go good sirs. Please do not be offended if I ask the impossible...Which I am sure I did. But seriously I'd love to see all those things, cept the choclate bodies, put those on cockers on a hot day!
                  lookin fer IR3 or Xtreme (C&C)

                  black RT Mag for sale. Great condition. Stock barrel, sanded bolt, I-frame, blade trigger. Extra parts, bolt spring, internals o-rings, extra hardline, nubbins, hardline. it doesnt break balls except on ppl. asking $450.

                  AIM SN: Fishsauce66

                  Comment

                  • DarkPhoenix
                    Advanced Fire Support
                    • May 2001
                    • 719

                    #10
                    I do not consider myself a yes man, I am a great admirer of fine quality products. I like the way AGD does their R&D, by listening to the people who actually use their products they are making great improvements.

                    Airgun Designs is doing a very good job. They are using all the resources that are available to them to make products that we like and the performance that we expect, at a reasonable price.

                    I am proud to call myself a member of this board, and am more than happy to help in any way I can.

                    "The BEAST"
                    "No-Rise" E-mag
                    Level 10 Bolt
                    AGD Flatline 91cu in/4500psi
                    Black HALO B

                    "Red Heatseeker"
                    Red to Clear Fade Freak Factory Impulse
                    68/4500psi Max-Flo
                    Red HALO B

                    Comment

                    • X-Plosive
                      AO's sexiest member, and biggest post whore :)
                      • Mar 2001
                      • 1807

                      #11
                      umm when did we bring back the z-grip?


                      Taking mags apart is fun, its even more fun when you don't know what you're doing

                      Comment

                      • MajorDamage
                        King of Polyester!
                        • Dec 2000
                        • 3141

                        #12
                        I think what he means is that we made the Z-Grip popular again.

                        ENDO!
                        Oldskool

                        Comment

                        • AGD
                          The man from AGD

                          • Oct 2000
                          • 5916

                          #13
                          My ToDo List:

                          Well, since we influence AGD, here's what I would like to influence!

                          -Lighter stock tigger pull ** happens with the retro valve


                          -More accessible vert. bodies (i still dont kno where to get one) *** Call us we sell them direct.

                          -chocolate covered bodies, fer when the playing slows down
                          **** TOO FATTENING!!!!!!
                          -V nubbins everywhere! *** plastic ones in testing, never fold over.


                          -a bolt that isn't so mean to paintballs, forcing them to explode before they reaach barrel exit (maybe that's just my bad
                          paint) *** Superbolt going into production

                          -and of course ---- 1'in fore-grip extenders, or even .5'in ** see aftermarket for these

                          -impossibly cheap intelliframes! ** The impossible takes a little longer....

                          oops, one more ---colored bodies, dark gun metal grey, copper, brass, dark green, etc... ** Aluminium bodies under developement.



                          How did I score!!???

                          AGD
                          sigpic

                          Comment

                          • PowerFedMag
                            RT of reliability.
                            • May 2001
                            • 461

                            #14
                            A+

                            ahhhh! the AGD pres. actually responded to me! ME!!!

                            *faints*
                            Last edited by PowerFedMag; 10-08-2001, 03:54 PM.
                            lookin fer IR3 or Xtreme (C&C)

                            black RT Mag for sale. Great condition. Stock barrel, sanded bolt, I-frame, blade trigger. Extra parts, bolt spring, internals o-rings, extra hardline, nubbins, hardline. it doesnt break balls except on ppl. asking $450.

                            AIM SN: Fishsauce66

                            Comment

                            • Dubstar112
                              Dubstar111x
                              • Feb 2001
                              • 2321

                              #15
                              Its these kind of threads that keep us in check
                              AO #765
                              CCM Series 5
                              Prerelease Impulse
                              Hyperframed Warped Mag w/flatline tank
                              Feedback.


                              Good to know that somone of Tom's status seeks "relief" from a sport he helped create. A sport now ruled by a single patent.

                              Comment

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