N20

[FutureMagOwner]

bill i believe tom said because helium is one of the smallest elements that orings couldnt create a seal of fpr the helium which would make it leak and that he believed argon would be the best for paintball but it costs much more than air so it defeated any basic purpose. and bill you seem to be awfully busy at warpig making those reviews would you like an apprentice(i apparently am i a very good writer when im accualy writing not chatting like this and i take the time to spell correctly )

[Xerces]

argon is the best element EVER!

[FooTemps]

Originally posted by Xerces
argon is the best element EVER!

What was the point of that?

Bill is right, N20 would be pretty dangerous to use since it can burn fairly easily (which is why it is used in the racing world). I wouldn't be as worried about the rusting factor but with both combined there could be the risk of an exploding paintball gun...

[Wat]

It is a common misconception that an oxidizer requires oxygen. It was initially labeled that because oxygen is a great oxidizer but not the only one. An even better oxidizer is flourine.

The actual definition

Loss of electron = Oxidation
Gain of Electron = Reduction

Which makes flourine a great oxidizer because it only has one electron in its outer orbital which is quite unstable and ready to latch on to another atom. ITs ready to lose that electron.

Second misconception is that N20 is actually burned in cars. The limit on power in cars isn't the fuel you burn, as you could easily dump liquid gas into the cylinder, but how much oxidizer you can burn the gas with. In this case, N20 is much denser gas than atmospheric air. The heat and pressure in the cylinder decomposes 2 N20 molecules into 2 N2's and 1 O2. And then the O2 burns with the gasoline just like any other combustion. The fuel and reaction is the same, we just use N20 to bring in more oxygen.

[billmi]

Wat,

Thanks for the explanation, that sounds more thorough than any of the previous posts in the thread.

So now, another question.... Is nitrous oxide an oxidizer on it's on, or instead a stable storage medium for oxygen, that will then be broken up in the car's engine into the nitrogen that won't make much of a difference, and the oxygen that is then used as an oxidizer?

That would make sense of the whole oxide/oxidzer confusion.

And FutureMagOwner,
WARPIG has always been an open vehicle for people to submit and have published product reviews, paintball commentary, tournament info, etc. It just happens that I submit more reviews that anyone else.

See you on the field,
-Bill Mills

[Potatoboy]

billmi-

You're right on the money!

N2O is stable and inert at atmospheric pressure. The heat and pressure of the engine is what causes it to break down. Unfortunatley, this will also happen in your tank.

You'll most likely end up with a mixture of harmess N2 (A regular fill) and dangerous, flammable, and oxidizing O2.

[Wat]

Potatoboy,

N2O won't actually break down in your storage tank. N2O is like CO2 in that at around room temperature, it can be stored in whats called a saturated state. IE, its right at the phase change point where it goes from a liquid to a gas. Just like CO2 can be stored as a stable and dense liquid, so can N2O.

People running Nitrous on their cars store the N2O similarly to how paintballers store CO2 (just bigger tanks in the trunk). And just like CO2, we rate tanks by lbs or ounces of fill versus what pressure its filled to.

A lot of people have discussed potential performance improvements by switching to other purer/cleaner/more exotic gases or what not. Someone farting near the vacinity of the shooter will probably effect performance about as much as swithing to another propellant. Lets put it this way, the change in performance would be immeasurable but the change in the cost will definitly be noticeable.

[hitech]

Originally posted by Wat
It is a common misconception that an oxidizer requires oxygen.

Yup, I always thought of oxidation and burning as the same. Thanks for the info.

[billmi]

Originally posted by Wat
Potatoboy,

N2O won't actually break down in your storage tank. N2O is like CO2 in that at around room temperature, it can be stored in whats called a saturated state. IE, its right at the phase change point where it goes from a liquid to a gas. Just like CO2 can be stored as a stable and dense liquid, so can N2O.

People running Nitrous on their cars store the N2O similarly to how paintballers store CO2 (just bigger tanks in the trunk). And just like CO2, we rate tanks by lbs or ounces of fill versus what pressure its filled to.

From this, I would then expect that temperature fluctuations caused by the liquid boiling into gas in the storage tank would give nitrous oxide many of the disadvantages carbon dioxide has as a paintball propellant.

See you on the field,
-Bill Mills

[Conqueror]

Am I the only one to realize that N2O is NOT Nitrous Oxide? NO2 is.

You can power a paintgun with pretty much any compressed gas. Doc Nickel has used argon, neon, nitrogen, helium, and a host of other gasses. Hell, you could even use flourine - for a couple of minutes.

CQ

PS - Bill! What's the word on that article about MROF and CF vs. RF?

[Jack_Dubious]

Sorry to interrupt here....but NO2 is Nitrogen Dioxide (i.e. a part of SMOG...i live in LA) .
N2O *IS* Nitrous Oxide (i.e. Laughing Gas or a pretty fun time with your friends and some ballons) ;P

Originally posted by Conqueror
[B]Am I the only one to realize that N2O is NOT Nitrous Oxide? NO2 is.

[Conqueror]

lol, my bad then. Been awhile since I took chemistry.

CQ

[TheJester]

i don't know what it will do to your gun, but i know what it will do to you, and well i know when i shoot i can smell the compressed air, so i think you're game we get worse threw the day as you got more and more stoned of it