Wisconsin DNR prohibits paintball on state lands

[Tyger]

I'm on a mailing list of players in Wisconsin that play renegade ball. They contacted the DNR to ask about paintball on public lands, and got this reply :

From: "Breister, Patricia A." [email protected]
Sent: Friday, August 29, 2003 8:06 AM
Subject: RE: DNR Website Information Request: Law Enforcement Information

Sorry no state land available for paint ball.
It falls under littering on State land.
Pat
DNR Information

Consider that in January 2002 we went down to the public hearing, and they agreed to rework the wording on the proposed ban, but never got around to doing it. And now, it seems they've decided to call it 'littering', even if the litter breaks down to nothing. Same department that allows snowmobiling on public land.

Now how does this affect people? Well, some legitimate paintball fields are adjoined or abbuted to DNR controlled 'public lands'. Stray balls that come to rest in public lands could now be considered littering. That's a few thousand dollar fine.

My original problem wiht the proposed DNR paintball ban originally was that it included a ban on "Pantballs, Paintberll guns, and paintball equipment". Which could translate to if I was wearing my JT jersey or my paintball shoes on my feet or even my "Raven" gloves on my hands while I was on DNR land, I could be fined if the Ranger had a bug up his boot that day.

But it seems that, without a public hearing, or even a chance to rebut it, they passed legislation or at the very least an unofficial rule to ban it. For most of us, it may not make a diffrence. I play on commercial fields, so it's not really going to affect me personally. But if your field or backyard touches DNR land, and you stray into it with your gear, it could affect you.

I understand the intent of the rule. It makes sense. If people don't know there's a paintball game going on in the woods, they could wander into the middle of a firefight and get hurt. That being said, however, it seems that they are going about it in the wrong way.

Rep. Pettis is on the DNR committee. You can contact him at [email protected] My only request to you all is to be nice about it, he probably has no idea what's going on in the DNR office and may be as in the dark as we are about this new stance from the DNR. Plus the last time we mailed him as a community, we almost locked up his e-mail. So, play nice people, and be professional. You represent the sport, remember.

Passing along news and making some trouble...

-Tyger

[raehl]

eh? Who cares.

Yes, the DNR allows snow mobiling on public land.

BUT...

Only on authoried trails...

AND...

Snow mobilers are required to maintain those trails.

Its not like you can just willy-nilly snow mobile anywhere you want on public land in WI.

Same goes for paintball. If the DNR doesn't want to permit paintball on the land they control, that's fine.

My problem with the ban, as proposed 1.5 years ago, was that it would make it a crime to even POSSESS paintball on DNR land, which was obviously ridiculous.

There are some places its ok to play paintball, and some places it isn't. I don't think the DNR should be any more expected to provide land for paintball play than my neighbors should.


If paintball wants to use WI DNR land, then paintball needs to establish a WI paintball players organization and lobby for the privilege, just like everyone else who has permission to use DNR land.


I also think it's important to note that DNR land is *NOT* the same as state-owned land. DNR land is mostly forest/nature preserves, where you're not allowed to do much of anything (except hunt a few weeks a year) period. There's plenty of state-owned land out there that's both not under DNR control AND much more appropriate for paintball (like the athletic fields at UWEC, where the University wants to have paintball for students this spring.)


- Chris

[Tyger]

Heya Chris :

You do have good points, but there's a problem. Mainly that not everyone goes to college at a place where they can have a sporting program. And even if they do, I don't know if Article 9 (It's article 9 isn't it? The one about affirmative action in sports?) affects paintball in colleges.

I understand your stance, and I'm not all for bandit play on public lands myself. My problem is that it doesn't allow for fields that adjoin "public land". I also think that players should be allowed to ask for permission to play out there, if they can prove they can.

I won't get into paintballers trying to make politics, but it doesn't always work.

As for the snowmobile thing, well, It's an example. Is there a snowmobile lobby? (I'm serious, asking...) If they can do trails, why can't paintball players have fields they can maintain in the same way?

I just feel that the DNR should have at least held a public meeting over this issue, so that taxpayers views could be aired, and so they could claify the rules, and possibly make a way for exceptions to the rules and laws. That's it.

-Tyger

[raehl]

I think you're making a pretty big leap to say that their policy prohibits paintball adjacent to DNR land. The DNR has the right to allow or disallow the use of their land for various purposes. Your luck in getting things approved, like most things, will depend on which person you end up talking to. Further, I wouldn't put it past an administrator to fudge their reasoning just to not have to deal with more phone calls.

As for college, its Title IX, and it only applies to school-sanctioned scholarship sports. As it is currently, paintball isn't affected by Title IX as it's organized by student interest.

Yes, there is a snowmobile lobby. And hunting lobby, and environmetnalists, and animal rights, and cross country skiers, and ATV, and bird watchers (One guy I know lost 12 pounds of birds in just 2 months! pa-da-ching!)... and all of those people fight for DNR land to be used the way THEY want it to be used, which is NOT paintball, and since they have lobbies and we don't, they win.

As for us maintaining our "field" or whatever on DNR land:

1) Why bother?
2) A group of paintball players would have to create an organized, legally organization to actually be responsible for said maintanence.


- Chris

[Tyger]

Originally posted by raehl
I think you're making a pretty big leap to say that their policy prohibits paintball adjacent to DNR land.

...

As for us maintaining our "field" or whatever on DNR land:

1) Why bother?
2) A group of paintball players would have to create an organized, legally organization to actually be responsible for said maintanence.

Chris, you're arguing for the sake af arguing.

As to the 'why bother'? Well, for starters a lot of people play on public lands. And knowing some of the people I've talked to over the years, I wouldn't put it past someone with an agenda to stand next to a legit paintball field, waiting for stray balls to fly over to serve a fine to a field owner or unsuspecting player.

I don't see it as a big leap in logic when the DNR person themnselves said it wasn't allowed and fell under "Littering". Pretty cut and dry there.

So if a "lobbist" is needed, then that's what's needed. Ok, granted. I'm just passing along info, and a little of my opinion. Besides, like I said, I know that a few paintball fields are either on or adjacent to public lands, and I dont' want to see them crash and burn because of an over-zealous governemnt employee who aggressively goes after them. But that's me.

-Tyger

[UltimatePaintballer]

lets just say

its like paintball is banned in wisconsin except to play on autorized fields, because you can't even walk outside with your gun(for a second) degased, no hopper, or anything and you'll get it taken away if your caught.

[northern paintballer]

Paintball banned in wisconsin?

I called the state of wisconsin DNR in madison about playing on state land and the answer I recieved was that it is only banned in the lower south east part of wisconsin, the rest is still ok to play on as long it is a not a park or picnic area.

[maglover728]

I called the state of wisconsin DNR in madison about playing on state land and the answer I recieved was that it is only banned in the lower south east part of wisconsin, the rest is still ok to play on as long it is a not a park or picnic area.

Call back and get the full name of the person who told you that, incase a judge asks. I played near Marshfield for years on public land. Hell my graduation party was in the McMillin Marsh area. This may be a cause for severe concern.

[Lohman446]

Whats the problem?

Paintball does deface (Not permanately) the land it is used for. There is no reason it cannot, and should not be restriced to private land where one has permission to play.

This is not "banning paintball" its simply making it so this activity does not interfere with others. I don't want any area being played in that cannot be properly controlled, what if some kid walks into the middle of a paintball game unknowing and gets shot - I have played in the woods enough to know that one does not always fully identify the target. What if someone unfamiliar with paintball and carrying a concealed weapon accidentally gets fired at - there have been cases of people mistaking paintball fire for gun fire. Maybe not you or I, but there are far more people with less knowledge of either.

You can't "rope" off public areas. The legality and logistics of it are restrictive at best.

As to not carrying around a marker in public? Again I fail to see the problem. Its a public safety rule and requires such a miniscule amount of your effort to comply with that it makes good sense.

Its a logical argument for both, I really don't see the complaint.