BPS limit question

[Lohman446]

Ok... this may be addressed elsewhere, but looking through all the BPS questions and comments would take.. umm forever (there like the universe, always expanding).

Now I don't want this to turn into a thread about should or shouldn't... let me address this from a techincial aspect.

We have all seen trigger bounce, cheater boards, etc. Programs set to make the gun go full auto after 26 shots as long as it is tipped sideways or whatever. THe point is, people have cheated around the one shot one pull rule already?

How are you going to enforce a BPS cap - just trust people not to play with the program and leave the BPS cap there. Yeh right - that will last until, hmm WAS thinks about it. How you gonna chrono check those, crap we already have enough arguments about bounce. Some really fast fingered ref.?? The point is, as paintabll is now, it is not possible to enforce a BPS limit is it?

BTW, I understand through the use of radio transmission to a central area we might accomplish something, but would not people cheat around that and send false signals. And this would be cost prohibitive.

[Brophog]

The difference is, manufacturers and referees are LETTING them circumvent the idea of "one shot, one pull".

Its not a question of can they do it, its a matter of enforcement. So far, no one is trying to enforce anything.

Lets try to enforce some rules first, and then deal with the sneaky ones that try to get around them.

[Methylphenidate]

ya but how are we gonna enforce it ???

[Lohman446]

Ok.. can you enforce a BPS rule if the BPS limit is set at 20 to 30? How?

[Woogie12]

Make everyone shoot revvies. There, problem solved.

[Brophog]

Your putting the cart before the horse, and at any rate, we've already discussed detection methods.

Now let me ask you some questions.

Did you personally modify your marker to shoot that fast? I'm willing to bet real big that none of you modified your marker to shoot 20 bps.

Who did then?

Who made the circuit board? The microswitch? The trigger? The feed system?

Who programmed the circuit board?

That's right, manufacturers did.

First, we need an organized body to pronounce there is a limit of 20 bps. All markers capable of higher bps will need to be modified. All production of markers over the limit will cease to exist.

Now manufacturers must make markers and components that are under 20 bps. They are now liable for their products.

This is where you start. After that, you only need to enforce people that personally modify their markers or others. Sponsored teams would not attempt such a thing, or their sponsors could be held liable as well.

This is the same as wiping folks. People wipe because they have something at stake, and because no one is proactively enforcing the rule. If we enforced the wiping penalties, and trained enough refs to enforce those rules, we would see much less wiping.


Don't tell me its not possible. You don't see anyone out there with knives or fireworks, do you? You don't see anyone out there without a full face mask, do you? You don't see any tourney's without a chrono limit, do you? No, insurance companies wouldn't cover them.

I didn't think so. We've forced manufacturers to change before.

[Woogie12]

I think the use of revvies in NPPL, PSP, and other tourneys would be much, much easier and more cost effective.

[Lohman446]

Originally posted by Brophog
Your putting the cart before the horse, and at any rate, we've already discussed detection methods.

Now let me ask you some questions.

Did you personally modify your marker to shoot that fast? I'm willing to bet real big that none of you modified your marker to shoot 20 bps.

Who did then?

Who made the circuit board? The microswitch? The trigger? The feed system?

Who programmed the circuit board?

That's right, manufacturers did.

First, we need an organized body to pronounce there is a limit of 20 bps. All markers capable of higher bps will need to be modified. All production of markers will cease to exist.

before.

Full face masks, chronos, no knives, no tools - have little to no gray area, they are rather easy to enforce wtih standard equipment today.

As for programming - no problem, if I could shoot that fast, liked electros, I would pick out the right one, and could get it modified. Then again, I know people that design and prototype computers for Ford and GM so... Ill admit you have a point there for most people.

Limiting hoppers to no force feed (or all revvies) would be much more cost effective and get the same results.

As for putting the cart before the horse.. certainly before you woudl consider making a rule you would make certain that you had the ability to enforce it, would you not? And I do ask that nicely, I'm nto trying to be a jerk about it. It would just seem to me, making a rule you could not enforce.. would be a mistak.

[Brophog]

I just told you how to enforce it. You make the rule and force manufacturers to abide by it. We've done it before.

We had a rule of 13 bps. Why does it no longer exist? Not due to enforcement, but due to the fact that the people who passed the rule overruled it.

We had a non force feed hopper rule. They overruled that so the Halo could come out

You guys are making this too complicated. You just have to make the rule and manufacturers will have to follow it in order to sell products. At this point in time, enforcement by detection is not even an issue.

Maybe down the road detection is a problem. At that point in time though we're dealing with a MUCH smaller portion of the population in violation of that rule.

[Woogie12]

Well if companies did start doing that, what would happen to everyone's guns that were made before this? They wouldn't be able to use them, and they couldn't sell them. You probably wouldn't be able to have it so that you could trade in olod guns for ones with the new boards either. Companies would just lose too much money that paintball would have a tough time surviving. Full masks are a bit different from restrictings markers. Markers cost much more and it's not like many people can just buy new ones like a full mask. Just my .02

[Brophog]

Mark my words.

There will be a time that there is a bps limit. We either accept it now, or have it enforced on us later.

Manufacturers will just have to eat the costs. These things happen in a lot of industries, for one reason or another. Usually there is a grandfather clause put in to allow the older products to remain in use if they are made before a certain date.

Or better yet, we set a practical limit that few if any have reached. Then your only enforcing what will be made in the future.

The first step is making a rule. Each day a new product, reaching a higher limit is developed, making this problem a whole lot worse.


This idea isn't by any means new.

[Woogie12]

Although I don't totally agree with you, you make a very good point. However, I still really doubt that companies would just "eat the costs".

[jtoothman25]

All you need is a maximum ammount of paint a team is allowed to use at the start of the game. Then it isnt a game of flooding the other side. I believe it more fun when you have to snap shoot people, instead of just painting their bunker til they stick their heads out. If you have 320 paintballs or so, then if you shoot them at over 20 bps, you'd be screwed.