Im Sick of all the talk, i will pay for action!

[hardr0ck68]

if anyone fairly well known and trust worthy in the PB world is willing to orginize (something i hate doing) to do one or more of the 3 following things then i will send a $100 this week and $25 every month after (i hope others will make donations also) to fight Smart Parts

1) run ads in PB mags telling the average player what SP's lawsuits are doing including showing prior art, one of the brothers legal run ins with the patant office, and the harm they cause other businesses (i dont like this so much, i fear the ads will backfire and end up selling more schockers)

2) activly litigate aginst SP and their BS, i know my $$ isnt near enough but i would love to see others support this and maybe make a dam differance

3) support companys like AKA who are activly litigating aginst the Satan Brothers, while i also like ICD and other companys that payed the royaltys i dont like that they caved in (i know its business and what was needed to survive, but i personally believe morals before profit)

[tony3]

I'll organize it....wait, why would I waste me life over such a stupid thing?:o

[paint magnet]

Why? Oh, maybe because Smart Parts has already killed the Emag, Viking, Excalibur and jacked the price on Bushmasters even though they have no right to do so, and have no grounds to justify their patent?

[deathstalker]

IBC!

Smart Parts does not make the E-Mag, Viking, or Excalibur, nor do they set prices on Bushmasters. Smart Parts did not discontinue those products, the manufacturers chose to do so rather than fight SP in court or license from them. What has been the price increase on Bushies, anyway?

I think the fact that no company has been able to successfully defend itself is a pretty good sign that SP has the upper hand.

Light your money on fire. You will get the same result with a lot less effort, headaches, and time.

[Ityl]

Originally posted by paint magnet
even though they have no right to do so, and have no grounds to justify their patent

Actually you are totally wrong here. Smart Parts owns the patent, they have full rights to enforce it. Yes it sucks, but that's how business works, can't fault Smart Parts for making money.

There is one thing that can be done about it, build a better mousetrap. There is already talk about a mechanical marker with a trigger like an electro. Developing this, imo, is the best thing to do.

[InexactMelissa]

I think it's great that you're willing to put your money where your mouth is, but I doubt that you will get anywhere with any of those options.

1) run ads in PB mags telling the average player what SP's lawsuits are doing including showing prior art, one of the brothers legal run ins with the patant office, and the harm they cause other businesses (i dont like this so much, i fear the ads will backfire and end up selling more schockers)

Personally, I think this is exactly what needs to be done: educate the community at large. However, SP also buys lots of big shiny ads in all the magazines, and if they threaten to pull their expensive ads because of an Anti-SP ad, who do you think the publisher will have to listen to?

2) activly litigate aginst SP and their BS, i know my $$ isnt near enough but i would love to see others support this and maybe make a dam differance

Obvious problem here is money, but also, what grounds does John Q Public have to bring suit?

3) support companys like AKA who are activly litigating aginst the Satan Brothers, while i also like ICD and other companys that payed the royaltys i dont like that they caved in (i know its business and what was needed to survive, but i personally believe morals before profit)

Support them how? There was an AKA defense fund set up already, if I'm not mistaken. Besides, it's up to the companies themselves, not us, to make their business decisions.


IMO, if you would like to campaign against SP, print up and give out shirts, stickers, whatnot (there's already some out there). Talk to the kid at your local shop who's asking Mom to buy him a shocker, and everyone else there, for that matter. Unfortunately, though what they are doing is pretty sucky, the average consumer doesn't have much of a voice.

[Rigster_TBB]

Originally posted by deathstalker
IBC!

Smart Parts does not make the E-Mag, Viking, or Excalibur, nor do they set prices on Bushmasters. Smart Parts did not discontinue those products, the manufacturers chose to do so rather than fight SP in court or license from them. What has been the price increase on Bushies, anyway?

I think the fact that no company has been able to successfully defend itself is a pretty good sign that SP has the upper hand.

Light your money on fire. You will get the same result with a lot less effort, headaches, and time.

--------------------------------------------------------
Very well said, I couldn't agree more. But to hardr0ck68, don't really light your money on fire, send it to me. I need some more paint and air...
Rigster...

[paint magnet]

Originally posted by deathstalker
IBC!

Smart Parts does not make the E-Mag, Viking, or Excalibur, nor do they set prices on Bushmasters. Smart Parts did not discontinue those products, the manufacturers chose to do so rather than fight SP in court or license from them. What has been the price increase on Bushies, anyway?

I think the fact that no company has been able to successfully defend itself is a pretty good sign that SP has the upper hand.

Light your money on fire. You will get the same result with a lot less effort, headaches, and time.

I said Smart Parts killed the Emag, Viking, and Excalibur. I don't know where you get the part about Smart Parts making them... And yes they did kill them, do you think AGD and AKA would just stop producing their best selling markers for no reason? No, it's because of the Smart Parts lawsuit (or threat of) that they were discontinued.

And the price increase on Bushmasters? A BKO is $359 on PBGear.com. They weren't even that high when they first came out! It wasn't more than a couple months ago that they were below 300!

[tony3]

SP did not "kill" the emag, viking and excal, the manufacters did. AKA killed the viking. Aka could of signed with sp I'm assuming, but it was probably a lot of money and remember aka before the viking and excal? They were doing fine, the viking seemed like a big hassle and they couldn't keep them in stock, I bet aka is in a way glad to be back to the original aka selling regs, lprs and lp gun parts. SP did not "kill" the emag. Yes, sp would of went after agd, couldn't of agd waited until they went after them and signed with them? Yes, but Tom made a smart move. The emag is 4 years old and needs to be revamped so why not take it off the market right now and try to avoid sp? The xmag was not taken off the market because of sp. AGD-E is now the NPS Europe distributor. They got other things to do besides make xmag bodies and deal with the hassle of them. They would of kept making the bodies, but not as first priority. So Tom, knowing the hassle that they are, just took them off the market. Thank you, and good night.

[Matches]

Hopefully once the Federal laws change this year in Australia, it will be legal to import & sell semi-auto markers.
and the best part is that the S.P. patents dont stack to sh_t in this country.
Hopefully AGD or another company will relise this and expand our market.

[paint magnet]

Yes, but if SP was going to go after Emags, they would have gone after Xmags as well.

[MayAMonkeyBeYourPinata]

Originally posted by Matches
Hopefully once the Federal laws change this year in Australia, it will be legal to import & sell semi-auto markers.
and the best part is that the S.P. patents dont stack to sh_t in this country.
Hopefully AGD or another company will relise this and expand our market.

yes that would be nice for you

and nobody besides possibly kingman.

And BE will be able to touch SP, so dont waste your money

[cledford]

Re: Im Sick of all the talk, i will pay for action!

Originally posted by hardr0ck68
3) support companys like AKA who are activly litigating aginst the Satan Brothers, while i also like ICD and other companys that payed the royaltys i dont like that they caved in (i know its business and what was needed to survive, but i personally believe morals before profit)

AKA rolled over like a, um well the cuss filter would censure me. At least ICD mounted an EFFORT - one that lasted more then a 3 months. And ICD didn't even have scores of owners and well wishers contributing to their legal defense.

AKA would like you to think that you're a special member of their "family" but in the end their family "values" were "$$$$'s" and nothing more. There will be the AKA owners who say AKA stood up to SP by not paying the blood money - but be for real, if they really cared about the "family" why wouldn't they do what needed to be done? The truth is that they've produced something along the lines of 7000 TOTAL markers since the excal and Viking came out. That's over 4 years, which equals roughly 1750 markers per year. They simply rolled over because paintball business is a hobby that augments their real business (Leads Metal Products) and they weren't willing to pay any more for it. Sorry to all the AKA orphans - you get what you paid for, a marker, not a foster family.

-Calvin

[Lethargic]

If you want to get super-duper technical, Smart Parts didn't do anything to anyone. They didn't make anyone stop making markers, because it was an active decision by AGD/AKA/whomever to do so. It's not like smart parts went over and physically halted production, right? The fact that SP came along and litigated everyone couldn't POSSIBLY cause companies to pull their markers out of production!!

Using this same sort of warped logic, the bombs hitting Pearl Harbor weren't dropped by the Japanese planes flying overhead. The fact that the planes might have dropped the bombs is negated by the fact that we cannot prove it beyond a shadow of a doubt. Therefore IT MUST NOT HAVE HAPPENED!! This is of course rediculous. It is obvious that Japanese planes dropped bombs on Pearl Harbor, even though I cannot go back there and bring you back evidence of the fact.

Claiming that SP is not forcing companies to cease producing markers in absurd. Even if the connection isn't marked by signs, one should be able to perform the logical leap from "SP sues companies for patent infringment" and "Companies begin to halt electric paintball marker production." To deny that this relationship exists is like trying to argue that Microsoft controlling 90+% of the software in computers does not force other companies to bend to their wishes.

I, for one, do not see why so many people are choosing to stand up and say that we should not fight SP's patent because it was legally obtained, or because it is a smart business move. WHO CARES IF IT IS SMART OR LEGAL!?! If it hurts me personally (and it does) then I'm going to stand up against it. I don't bend over to the large gas companies, or the large power comanies, so why would I want to let SP take things over? If GM somehow got a patent on all vehicles with 4 wheels and an electronic ignition, and tried to enforce it, would you let that one roll right over you too? What makes SP any different?Disent is just as much the American way as being greedy, and it is only though dissenting that we keep greed in check.

[GT]

This thread sux!

You want to support the GOOD in pb? Buy AGD!