Interpret this Rule

[SlartyBartFast]

Continuing discussion from another thread to focus on one particular rule.

38.04 Assessment of the one-for-one penalty (the removal of the player committing the infraction and a teammate) will take place for the following infractions:
(3) continuing to play with a hit in an obvious location;

So, if you're hit anywhere but on your harness (the only unobvious hit)

The referee should not eliminate you but should instead call a one-for-one. The reality is that refs call eliminations for obvious and unobvious hits and players do not call themselves out.

Once again, if the rule is play until the ref calls you out, why aren't the rules writtne that way?

I've only watched local tournaments, is it the same a big tournaments?

How can a player justify the current status-quo of enforcement?

How can a promoter, judge, or ref justify the current status-quo of enforcement?

(and don't try to say that the rule only applies to playing-on after the ref calls you eliminated, because by the book it's not the ref's responsibility to eliminate players for obvious hits.)

[trains are bad]

Paintball is a joke, the end.

there's your answer.

[Lohman446]

Look at the rest of the rules, that if you think you might be hit you have to stop forward progress and check immediatly, other things such as that.

[Muzikman]

For the most part in major tournament (pro level being a slight exception) players do call themselves out with obvioius hits (that they can't wipe without getting caught). Refs are pretty on the ball so an obvious hit or un-obvious hit the player is usually pulled before they get the chance to call themselves out.

BTW: one of the advantages of a superman dive is that if you take a hit to the front of your tourso on the break, the hit gets wiped clean when you dive

[-=Squid=-]

Unobvious hits are for the most part, nonexistant.

Wanna know why I play on with a pack hit? Because the rules state it's "unobvious," yet, the truth is that I can't think of a single time I got hit and didn't know it.

[SlartyBartFast]

BTW: one of the advantages of a superman dive is that if you take a hit to the front of your tourso on the break, the hit gets wiped clean when you dive

and if paintball was a serious sport with legitimate rules, any ref wanting to cause a splash would watch for an sign of impact and call for a penalty because the player didn't check themselves.

I suspect the only ture and obvious answer has already been stated by Trains.

[SlartyBartFast]

Refs are pretty on the ball so an obvious hit or un-obvious hit the player is usually pulled before they get the chance to call themselves out.

But in such a case the refs are not doing their job correctly. They are not supposed to act in the players favour and are not required to call eliminations for obvious hits.

They SHOULD see the hit, do a two count in their head, and then call the one-for-one.

Indeed the rule book gives a referee no other option.

[temps]

Unobvious hits are for the most part, nonexistant.

Wanna know why I play on with a pack hit? Because the rules state it's "unobvious," yet, the truth is that I can't think of a single time I got hit and didn't know it.

I've been hit in the pack and didnt notice.. It was in a 2 on 1 situation where my team mate was pinning him down, so I ran accross the feild to the next bunker to get the guy from both angles.. Anyway I took a hit that almost went behind my pod, after the player was eliminated he came up to me and said he hit me. So while walking off the feild I asked a ref to check my pod pack and he said I was clean.. right after in the stageing area I took my pack off and found out that I was hit. This was just a rec game between friends so not much was lost. But just to prove a point that it is possible to be hit and not notice.

[Lohman446]

I was playing a tournament one day and took a hit to the left side of the pod back, towards the back. It could have only been the left side because I was on the right tape, and it was audible - then again maybe it hit the bunker I was next to. The rules say since it was an unobvious hit - in the pack (though I realize the the rules make reference to audible hits) that I am not required to ascertain for myself. I was breaking for a snake and slid in, perhaps conveniently on my left side and. Now I do not know to this day if that ball broke or not, the ref checked me as I went into the snake - for one I was calling for the check, as was the other team.. As the rules are written, was it cheating? It wasn't 100% honest, it wasn't in the spirit of the rules, but I think I was walking very close (to one side or the other take your pick) of the written rules. We lost the game, and it ended up not mattering.... but even to this day I worry that I should have done something slightly different there.

[Muzikman]

Basically this...you are trying to make an issue out of one of the only rules that has not had much of an issue. If you want to question rules, there plenty others out there that make less sense and people stretch them to the limit and some times over.

[SlartyBartFast]

Basically this...you are trying to make an issue out of one of the only rules that has not had much of an issue. If you want to question rules, there plenty others out there that make less sense and people stretch them to the limit and some times over.

Actually, no.

If there is no question about how the rule should be enforced and what the role of the referee is, it should be the absolute FIRST to be discussed and re-written so that the rule book reflects reality.

If you can't write and enforce rules as basic as who is eliminated, when, and by whom, how can anyone take complex rules on ramping, bps, and others seriously?

[Muzikman]

My point is I have never seen a problem with this rule and I have been to my share of tournaments.

I think the wording is fine. I think the people interpet it the way the organizers mean it to be.

EDIT: I guess the what I am saying is that if you are truely playing on the ref will pull a one of one. 90% of the time, when you get hit the ref reacts faster than you can and pulls your arm band.

[tyrion2323]

Goodness, there are plenty of ways to get hit without knowing it - pack, shoes...even some pant and jersey hits. With the baggy clothing nowadays, you can get hit on a run without knowing it.

[SlartyBartFast]

My point is I have never seen a problem with this rule and I have been to my share of tournaments.

I think the wording is fine. I think the people interpet it the way the organizers mean it to be.

EDIT: I guess the what I am saying is that if you are truely playing on the ref will pull a one of one. 90% of the time, when you get hit the ref reacts faster than you can and pulls your arm band.

But that's totally the wrong way to look at rules and rule books. They should never require the interpretation and benevolence of the enforcers to be effective (no matter how widespread the benevolence or misinterpretation).

Your position is similar to saying that a law saying all blue eyed babies should be drowned is alright as long as the police don't enforce it.

If your edit is the accepted interpretation then the rule about one-for-ones when playing with an obvious hoit should be moved to the elimination rule and the game play rules should include calls by judges after obvious and unobvious hits.

[White_Noise]

watch some more tourneys(larger, series tourneys). when refs pull people, they usually do it at just about the same time as the person calls themself out. most players are good about calling out when its obvious.

the truth is that alot of players know that they can get a few more shots in without a call of playing on. they are exploiting the fact that refs dont see an impact sometimes, and therefore the ref may look at them when they shoot again, and think they got shot just then, hopefully by that time the player has eliminated an opposing player.

is the system perfect? no. does it have to be? no. most tournament players know that its basically an unwritten rule that they can play on a bit without getting a 1 for 1 penalty. youre argueing about interpretation. the industry, refs, and players mostly choose a loose interpretation, while you want a strict interpretation. if every law was strictly enforced, there would be people that would get tickets for very small things(jaywalking for instance. never heard of it being enforced.)