Tell me what ya think of my Automag......

[heath]

well it makes the trigger lighter, but not really shorter. And some people claim that it doesnt work at all, saying it is just as good as the stock valve. It worked in mine, and made the trigger faster.


Oh yeah, i also run my RT on anti-siphon CO2. It never freezes up.

[gimp]

Originally posted by heath
it has good accuracy with just about eveyr paint. the bore is .689. The reason it is modified to shoot just once is because these frames didnt work well with every mag, and my mag was one of them. It shot fine on the first. but had less velocity on the second. The trigger stop is internal, and makes it very short. The trigger is spring loaded, as well as reactive, and it very nice and fast.

Now... the z-vavlve actually did lighten the pull up a little, and it does not restrict flow. The reg is turned up all the way, so i have a input of about 800 psi. The gun does not have any flow problems. It performs great.

You think the Z-valve, and reg may be causing your velocity problems?

[Magsrule3]

You use your ReTro on C02?? That is the stupidest thing I've ever heard, maybe that along with the Z-valve and WGP reg would cause inconsistencies.

[heath]

First of all i had the frame modified to shoot just once because the fields here dont allow anything but semi. the reason it had a bad second shot is because the frames were known not shoot properly on all gun. My gun is one of them. Now that it is just one shot per trigger pull, it shoots perfect. basically the second shot caused the trigger to short stroke on my gun, but i put it on another friend's mag and it shot twice per pull flawlessly. So the slight difference in tolerences on each gun affects how it works. the z valve makes the gun better, and the reg is basically there for looks. These things do not make the gun work worse, if anything they work better. The gun never freezes up or has velocity problems. I like it.

[GallagherAtWar]

im thinking a bout getting a z valve are they worth it and where u get yours?

have u every shot it with out the retro and witht the zvalve?

and what does it replace? i thought i knew but now im confused can u tell me what part exatly it replaces?

[heath]

The z-valve replaces the on-off valve inside of the retro valve. I like mine. i could definately tell the trigger was light with it.

[GallagherAtWar]

ok this is the first time ive pulled out my on off thing do i oild it?

[Butterfingers]

Bad idea.

Thats a really bad idea heath. There is a reason other than "freezing" that the Retro is HPA only. The RT valve is a full charge type regulator. If you do get liquid into the valve and chamber you will get REALLY hot shots. Depending on how much you get into the valve your velocity can spike to more than 600fps. This is more than enough to break goggle lenses and cause profuse bleeding. It becomes a safety issue.

A $150 screw in HPA tank is a lot cheaper than a lawsuit...

I can think of plenty of scenarios in which your gun can go liquid... and lead to injuries. Antisiphon tanks only work one way, upright, if you tilt it at odd angles it becomes a syphon tank.

The z-valve does lighten trigger pull but once you shoot over 10 bps you start getting shootdown, to me this is a downgrade.

The WGP reg is useless. But somehow it lucked its way onto your gun. That is probably the only thing that kept the liquid out of your gun. But don't count on it keeping co2 out again. Sereously though what you are doing is EXTREMELY dangerous I cant stress that enough.

Oh its a dangerous game you play.

[heath]

Butterfingers-

i have never had a problem with hot shots. The velocity never creeps up. But what you are saying could possibly happen.

now about the z-valve. how does it cause shoot down after 10 bps? I know i have shot over 10 bps with no drop off. Why would it decrease performance?

I just use the reg because when i used to have a hyperframe i had it set to about 650 psi, but now that i have the autoresponse i want to have a more reactive trigger, i let it go full flow. I have to have a problem, but things could still go wrong.

Galliger- i oil mine, so you could do the same if you like.

[Butterfingers]

The z-valve causes shootdown because of the way it is designed. I had one. RobAGD a factory tech has a bag of these that he pulled out of customer guns becuase they were complaining about shootdown and consistency problems.

Do you know that the fastest guy ever clocked on an electronic gun at the world cup only shoots 13 bps. Ask tom about this one. Those ball timers are misleading the ones you see on the angel takes the 2 fastest shots and calculates BPS from there, it does not take a full second time frame. To make a long story short I am not doubting you but it is extremely hard to shoot over 10 BPS for one second.

When you chrono your gun the bottle is almost always nearly vertical. When you are playing that situation changes. Perhaps this is why you dont realize spikes. Play it safe.

Why not get a cheap nitro system? It will improve performance and be safer.

[heath]

Butterfingers-

if i probably cant shoot over 10 bps it wouldnt matter if it has shoot down. I think it works fine though.

As for the nitro system, I have a System X 47 cu. in. tank. But it is sometimes hard to get compressed air here in eastern ky. So i just use what i have. But it works good.

I understand your concerns.

[Drizit]

the wgp reg isn't bad at keeping liqid out of your gun. hell i used one on a mag clasic with the anti-syphen tank screwed in upside down (the asa was on wrong) and it almost never froze. however the retro is a bit different if you get any liquid in there it's bad news. you could put a side mount stablizer on there as well for a bit of extra insuance. the only other time i've seen co2 on an rt the guy had a remote /w a 6 stage xpantion and 2 more 6 stage expantions on the gun. and that worked. also Butterfingers, are you sure your talking about a z-valve on an RT getting shootdown or on a clasic AIR valve? if it's the AIR then the reg is what causes shoot down at 10bps not the valve. if you are talking about an RT then it could be posible i don't know, it sure won't be the rest of the valve since it's good till 26+bps.

[heath]

Yeah i dont think the z-valve would cause shoot down. The WGP reg works well, so as long i keep the liquid out i should be ok.

[Butterfingers]

Its actually both. You get horrible shootdown on a classic mag valve with the z-installed, enough to see. However, the RT valve compensates quite a bit. Definately not enough to see but noticable on the chrono.

If you have a perfect trigger stroke the stock AIR wont show any visible shootdown even at 16 bps. There is a halo video floating around that shows a stock 93 automag shooting 16 BPS w/hyperframe with NO problems.

[Drizit]

i've never seen a z-valve cause shootdown, infact the part of an air valve that causes the most restriction in airflow is the reg pin, and spring. also the air valve is rated for 6bps before it "technicaly" gets shootdown, however you won't see it until 10+bps. and realy how do you know it's not getting shoot down, it's not fireing over a chorny.