Electro-Pneumatic Kit UPDATE!

[p8ntbal4me]

Hey Guys;


Just got off the phone with Clippard Pneumatics about my EP Kit and parts I can use.

Clippard, as you know is a leader in pneumatics for the paintball industry and has been for a great many years in other markets as well.

Clippard sees the investment in the paintball industry and would like to help us build parts that can be used for us,.. the players.

Basically, this project relies on YOUR input so you really MUST help me out here.

Not only does your information help me get the EP Kit out sooner, but it allows Clippard to offer MORE products we can use than what we currently have now.

How would you like the MPA3 to come in a smaller, no machining package with a built in QEV, all one unit?????? Well you need to help!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What they need is sizes, input pressure, force needed, etc.

I have given them all the information I have and cross referenced my data with other parts not their own such as SMC.

A good start would be to post the dimentions of the trigger frames we all own.
The Intelli, Airwalk, Chimera, Logic, etc.

This is the real deal. We all have ideas and concepts for parts they make now, but need a minor tweek,.... so if thats how you feel then your voice needs to be heard here!

I have already given them the layout for a ram w/ built in solenoid months ago,... they are all over it.

I really think we should jump on this chance to make the parts we need!

[Skywalker]

Sounds cool man. I'm not really interested, but I just wanted to say good luck with the project.

[etjoyride]

there are a few things (although not highly formulated) in the back of the mind that i might come up with completely, but i won't be able to do much until my airwalk frame arrives...

[FARMER00]

i think more people would buy a plain pnue kit instead of a epnue kit

[Apple_Pie]

Did you decide on a name?

I have a mag with chimera frame. I could get the dimension, if Rogue couldn't give them to you.

[p8ntbal4me]

Did you decide on a name?

I have a mag with chimera frame. I could get the dimension, if Rogue couldn't give them to you.

No.

I have not decided on the name yet. Its actually going to go to vote on the AO when the time comes.

I emaild Rogue about getting an 2007 Chimera frame but the pre-order was closed already.

I'll have to note to ask him when I get a moment.

If you can send the measurements (with a picture would be helpful too) that would be a help.

I gave Clippard a base measurement of 13mm wide for the top of internal slot for the Intelli-frame. They hav produced a ram for me to try but it is now on hold as the engineer assigned to me would like to merge the ram and the noid in the same package (estimated size is 13mm wide by 22mm tall x 19mm plus stroke. Its going to be very small.

LOL,... you guys might find this funny. I spent some 4 hours today talking to a model to do the poster ad for me!

Im freezing up here in NH right now. It takes alot to get me to stay inside,.. and boy was it cold last night!!! -32 degrees, ugh

Ive been contacted by a fellow AO'er for recording a video, and at this point I think you guys need some proof that this thing will actually come into the light some time in the next 10 years!

Lots to do, so little time. Bad weather, Tunaball in 2 months (guys u better pre-register!), new ventures for the boards (possibly), etc.

If I cant get all my finish parts back to me for an install due on the date of Tunaball (still missing the solenoid/ram combo), I will at the LEAST slap the kit back into the "HACK-O-INTELLI-FRAME" and run it durring the game so you guys can get to really see it up close.

I posted a message about Rob Clippard of Clippard Pneumatics contacting me today in regurds to custom made self install parts for the paintball industry.

Seriously,.. you guys that tinker with Pneumags, and other custom installs that you feel the parts could use a bit of something more from the factory, post it up and I will forward all designs to Clippard. (Makes sure EVERYTHING is labeled with your name on it! If you dream it, they build it, you deserve credit.)

Thats it for now. Im going to look at some more Solenoids for a few hours and then its off to the field in the morning to check out the new setup!

~ P8nt

[Chaos_Theory!]

A poster ad model for this?

No offense but whats the point? The mag community is fairly small, theres no point in spending money on something like that.

I suggest just getting input and keeping people up to date. Get the product out and things will go great.

[�?�� �m���]

Sweetness, I am willing to wait for something to eventually come out of this thread

[p8ntbal4me]

A poster ad model for this?

No offense but whats the point? The mag community is fairly small, theres no point in spending money on something like that.

I suggest just getting input and keeping people up to date. Get the product out and things will go great.

[p8ntbal4me]

Well I figured since I have been busy, no news as of late and I just poured another Jack n' Coke I figured why not post some news for you guys.

Electrical Stuff:

Made some progress with the dual ram/solenoid combo as you know. Clippard is now "in the bed" with this project and has commited to it. I expect good things to come from this end of the deal.

Board firmware code is almost done. I have found a little feature I definately DO NOT like in the code so I am chaging things around to make it worthy of a real player.
Heres the deal. This code is simple, it fires the gun. I had it changed around a bit because in the AGD world of things, 90% of us are not going to be using eyes (you seriously do not need them with this kit but if you want them, it will be on the board). With that said, the board comes set to turn on and fire with no eyes but does an eye check just in case on the first shot. The thing I have been finding is that this board and code is smart. So smart that in the event of when I was ramping one day set to 20bps to bench it agaisnt a Shocker, I found that there was a loop hole in the boards code where there are no eyes. Basically, a player can set the gun into a fire mode (anything they want), and then do a little tap and dance on the trigger (has to be specific), then rip another string at basically anything they can fire. Sounds fine right? Well remember I told you that the board was smart, this board does very strange things while you fire it. If you put this thing in ramp, set the start ramp to 6bps, then set the max ramp to 20bps, it learns the ROF of fire you are pulling the trigger. I can reach a max ROF on an E-Mag of 17bps fanning the hell out of it. This thing sees me reaching the ROF, figures the average ROF in the string of balls (50), checks to see what the ROF is for the ramp start bps, cuts the 6bps off my average (17-6=11bps), then adds it to my max ROF for the mode im locked into. Ill give you a hint,... Im hitting over 29bps in the first quarter of the loader. I have to have the largest stack possible on the loader or it will fire blanks CONSISTANTLY! Its out of control fast.

How do I know it does all that? If you single tap the trigger as your fanning the trigger and your ROF drops, it checks, does the little math problems real slick like,.. then slow the ROF in the mode your locked into. I have filtered the trigger electrically so ZERO e-bounce, ZERO Mech bounce. (videos will proove that)

The boards comming to Tunaball will be unlocked to show you guys just what I mean. The shipped models WILL NOT have this in the code. It will be shjown so you guys have heard it hear first, see it an Tunaball, then when the boards ship you may try, but it will not be on there.

Solenoids:

I have been testing a new solenoid out as far as power goes in the kit. I am trying to see what it does for fire rates as far as voltage from the board.
So far the new noid is a go. If the combo unit from Clippard is delayed way too long for my taste, I will ship the kit with a single ram and solenoid. (it wont be as tight of a package, but still very small)

Rob of Clippard Pneumatics was very interested and he knows paintball very well. If he makes a part, he knows it will sell and move just as much as any industry. As with any custom product, it takes time to make and test. When I know something, you will know something!

Batteries: (Yes I tested these too!)

Rayovac: is a NO GO! You should be shot if you use these in this kit!
If I could detect what brand of 9volts you used and you plugged one it these kits, I would void your warrenty! Seriously,... dont use these.

Energizer = okay

Duracel = okay

High Ends (Panasonics, Energizer Ultra Cells): If you can get them to fit in the setup, they are worth it.

AGD = working on it.


Mechanica Stuff:

Frames:

Well,.. I got some bad news to report on this front.
Seems that a late night/early morning idea that came to brew with my new noids and an intelli frame I had didnt want to work out. End result, the CNC bit took a bit more material than I wanted it to.

So if any one wants an intelli framw with a window along the right side of the trigger, let me know!

Good news is that I am confident to say that without machining,.. the intelli is out. Good news is, that I could supply a machinist with files to plug into a CNC and cut it for the kit with no issues at hand.

Z-Grips are out. Only because they have no room to begin with and the kit wont "drop" into the top due to the small opening. Can it be machinesd to fit? Hell Yeah!!! I play on doing it. Well,... I DID play on doing it till I jacked up my Z-Grip I had for another project.
I'll have to experiment later when I get a chance.

Airwalk: I ordered an Airwalk and as soon as it comes in I will tell you if it fits. I talked with Jay and I have seen the pictures. From the video Pneumagger made,.. I think it will fit without issues. But I'll confirm later.

Logicframe (45ish one): It fits so far. Working on some moving of parts to see what I like as far as wiring. But it works as it comes.

Chimera: Dont know. I dont have one and I dont have files on it, measurements, etc.

Other frames not listed: If you dont see it here,... then its a no. If I get a hard copy or files on it I could tell you.

Rails and Bodies: Doesnt matter. If you have a working frame that it fits in,... your good to go!

Valves: OKay. This is what I have found.

Classic Valves: NO CO2! I havent had time to play with my classic valves as of yet and I personally think that paying for a kit like this, running co2 in it, trying to achive nice, hig ROFs is a COMPLETE waste of time. IMHO!!!!!!!

AGD X-valve (R/T on-off installed, accepts ULT, Level 10 installed, (stock): I got one of these, fresh out of the box. Tuned it in a mech. Micro Mag so it ripped. Placed it into the test gun, and let it fly. INSAIN ROF! No bounce! You will get bagged for full auto on the field if a ref doesnt know what you have! (more on that story later )

Micro E-Mag Valve (R/T on-off installed, non-ULT): Same results as above

Micro E-Mag Valve (R/T on-off installed, accepts ULT): Same results as above

E-Mag Valve (SS, R/T on-off installed, accepts ULT, no ULT installed): Same results as above

E-Mag Valve (SS, R/T on-off installed, non-ULT): Same results as above

Level 10: As far as I can tell, the level 10 doesnt effect the ROF ast all. I havent ventured into the Level 7 I have yet. Personally, if the X-valves come with the level 10 with it, you guys are probley using that anyways.

The ULT: It works,.. but from the man himself Tom Kaye, the ULT wont reach high ROFs. Is he right,.. well yah! (Kinda ) It seems that input pressure, combined with dwell, bounce, etc. effect the ROF a valve will get when a ULT is installed. (If Tom wants to help me out here PAAAAAALEEEEASE post!!! School me please! )


The Ram: Okay,.. this little bastard is making me more and more happy every time I rip a loader off out back! So far it works with every noid I put on it in any hose footage combo I can think of. It mounts with machine screws, flat heads, or rounds. (I prefer rounds now for testing) Its a low pressure ram too! Runs between 50-100 for best results. One thing I think you guys are going to like is a little idea I got from Pneumagger.

You know how your suppsoed to install the MPA3 with Lukes ram, then use the sear to push the ram into place by finding the resting possision of the sear? So then you do all that, then you slide the ram back about a 32nd of an inch to make sure the ram doesnt touch the sear and it wont impead the sears travel?

Well that is no more. When you plug this bad boy in and push the sear down to find its resting possision, thats it. Bolt it down and go. The ram has a slight buffer built into it on the back stroke for the QEV (which is integrated into it BTW!!) to push the exhaust out. Its slight,.. but has worked on 3 different installs on 3 different frames so far. <---- who says over engineering is a BAD thing!!


Loaders:

Empire Reloader B2: I modded one of these by hand with some ideas I had. Results are pretty damn good if I say so myself. Can feed the kit ripping as fast as the solenoid installed will go (that means above 25bps is reached the second you hit your ramp BPS)
Serously,.. its stupid fast!

Q-Loader: I got one. Havent tried it yet.

Warp Feed: I posted a mod for this that I used to test it on the AO (lol, no one looked at it!) Modded to spin crazy fast, the warp will feed the kit set at 25BPS,... the higher you go in BPS, the faster the loader has to be on the warp. Anything under 25BPS (20-22bps) seemed to work fine with a warp and an unmodded B2 or a Egg2.

Egg2 (un-modded): 17bps consistantly on full auto. Crazy ramp was funny for the first 10 balls. After than the Egg jumped off the R/T and ran DIRECTLY into on comming traffic!

So after all that,.. the testing has stopped for now!

And now the thank you section

As of this morning, I have received ZERO requests for part information, board purchases, kit sales prices, etc. I seriously figured after telling you guys about this that poeple would slam me for more infor than posted here.

Clearly,.. this was a stupid assumtion on my part.

I wanted to say thank you to you, the AO, for respecing my needs and letting things fall into place as they have. So from me, I thank you!

And now some more wonderfull news you may already know!

I will be attending Tunaball for sure. Comming with me will be the beta test kits installed into some frames for player testing other than myself this time around. If you want some real field-driven results,.... come to Tunaball! The test subjects have been already selected (sorry!) but if you supply the paint, I will let you rip as much as you have on my setup.

The units being tested are not for sale. They will have the boards that sport the "cheater" software so you guys can see just what I am talking about (1 board will, the other wont). I like playing fair. I want you guys to see what I was ranting about and know that I stand for being fair and leveling the playing field. If someone cheats with my kits,.. it WILL NOT be due to my engineering!

I hope to answer your questions about it as much as I can. The kit may not be 100% in the shipping form when its tested, but you will see what my boards can do. That I can guarrenty.

Any more news I will post,... My Jack n' Cokes are almost gone so Im gonna finish up here.

Thanks!

~ P8nt

[BigEvil]

/reserving this space for a smart-*** remark later :-)

Have you ever thought about talking to Trina to do some glamour shots?

[p8ntbal4me]

/reserving this space for a smart-*** remark later :-)

Have you ever thought about talking to Trina to do some glamour shots?

Seriously,.. I slammed 7 drinks in the making of that post,... Im on #9 now.

Just keep the Trina post simple so I can understand it!!! (please Im begging you BE!)

Why does "Trina" mean something to me but I cant put the name with the sigfificance?

EDIT: So I re-read the "Tunaball" post and there is a AO member named "Trina" on here,...

,... amd I getting warmer!

[RvB Caboose]

This is definitely a great project. Best of luck to you and Clippard.

[BigEvil]

Seriously,.. I slammed 7 drinks in the making of that post,... Im on #9 now.

Just keep the Trina post simple so I can understand it!!! (please Im begging you BE!)

Why does "Trina" mean something to me but I cant put the name with the sigfificance?

EDIT: So I re-read the "Tunaball" post and there is a AO member named "Trina" on here,...

,... amd I getting warmer!

Trina was the last AGD spokesmodel. She was hired after Clare left and was only on the job a little while before Tom left and Dave eliminated the position IIRC.

Nine drinks? Practicing for the post-Tunaball festivities?

[neppo1345]

Sounds like a good thing.

If you need any help making anything work or solving problems shoot me a PM (strictly information, I don't really want to get hands on with anything; I don't have the time).

If not, then best of luck. Can't wait to see the finished product.

/off to a probabalistic engineering final
//LOVING control charts

Edited Because I Love Beemer