Barrel test----- I have a few more questions/ need paint suggestions

[MANN]

Alright so I am tring to do this barrel test to find what barrel is "the best". I was wanting to do the test this weekend, but my sm1 kit is ??mia?? So far I have these barrels

(will include a list later, but heres a pic)


I am using both a red chrono(the big one that most fields have), and a yellow handheld one (Im sorta wanting to see the accuracy of the 2). I will have the xmag set up in a vice to insure that it does not move.

I need oppinions on what length I should do the test. I am thinking ~ 50-60 ft? What is the lenght of a speedball course from back to back?

A decibalmeter will be stationed to record the differences in sound peeks between the different barrels. (I havent decided where yet tho. Probally halfway between the barrel and the target) This will show the percent of muffle that each barrel provides (for those woodsballers that want a "sniper barrel" ). It should also tell if there are any balls that are smaller or larger than normal.

I am using paper for the target so that I will be able to see where the ball breaks through, and hopefully it wont make that much of a mess. The paper will be changed out after each barrel. It will measure 36"X~24"-30"

I am thinking that ~25 of each ball per barrel should give decent results.

I think I am going to use 3 different types of balls. I am needing suggestions for what to use. Whatever it is it needs to be ~ 40 a case (this test is being sponsored by my back pocket, and its running low). I am thinking PMI stingers, draxxus recsport, and xball bronze. All of these are what I would consider affordable for the average middle of the road player (either speed or woods ball).

I need a little help on identifying some of the barrels above. There are 2 sceptor kits. One has a tapered end, and the other is similar to the empire revolver kit (basicly a long version of the 2007 one).

Also one of the ul barrels has a dust front on it. I think its a proto front. Is that correct?

If anyone wants to have their barrel/s tested I would be more than happy to do it. I will pay return shipping on any barrel that is sent to me.



EDIT: First round of data
Given Diameters Actual Diameters Difference
Stainless steel Freak inserts 0.682 0.6820 0.0000
~5" control bore 0.6840 0.6850 0.0010
0.687 0.6870 0.0000
0.689 0.6900 0.0010
0.691 0.6915 0.0005
0.693 0.6935 0.0005
0.695 0.6960 0.0010
0.697 0.6980 0.0010
0.697 0.6975 0.0005
Aluminum Freak inserts 0.679 0.6795 0.0005
~5" control bore 0.679 0.6800 0.0010
0.682 0.6835 0.0015
0.684 0.6850 0.0010
0.687 0.6895 0.0025
0.689 0.6915 0.0025
0.691 0.6915 0.0005
0.693 0.6965 0.0035
0.695 0.6965 0.0015
Fronts 10" Black Freak 0.7015 N/A
12" Black Freak 0.7025 N/A
14" Black Freak 0.7020 N/A
11" Purple AA 0.7035 N/A
16" Purple Freak 0.7030 N/A
---------------
Redz Pepperstick 0.687 0.6885 0.0015
~6.5" control bore 0.689 0.6890 0.0000
0.691 0.6915 0.0005
0.693 0.6920 0.0010
Fronts 14" Black Redz 0.7100 N/A
16" Black Redz 0.7100 N/A
---------------
Evil Pipe 0.683 0.6830 0.0000
~6" control bore 0.686 0.6855 0.0005
0.689 0.6890 0.0000
0.692 0.6925 0.0005
0.695 0.6950 0.0000
Fronts 14" Black Evil 0.7055 N/A
14" Black Evil 0.7065 N/A
---------------
Empire Revolver Aluminum inserts 0.684 0.6865 0.6860 0.0025
~4" control bore 0.688 0.6935 0.6900 0.0055
back of insert / front of insert 0.690 0.6920 0.6900 0.0020
0.692 0.6940 0.6935 0.0020
0.696 0.6985 0.6960 0.0025
Fronts 14" Black Empire 0.7050 N/A
---------------
BT Apex 10" one piece 0.7005 N/A
---------------
Empire 7 pc set 0.681 0.6845 0.0035
~6" control bore 0.684 0.6850 0.0010
All have tapered back 0.687 0.6895 0.0025
0.690 0.6915 0.0015
0.693 0.6930 0.0000
0.696 0.6965 0.0005
Fronts 14" Black Empire 0.7040 N/A
---------------
Mcdev Matchstik 0.685 0.6870 0.0020
~5.5" control bore 0.689 0.6905 0.0015
0.693 0.6955 0.0025
Fronts 12" Black Matchstik 0.6950 N/A
14" Black Matchstik 0.6950 N/A
---------------
CCM 0.681 0.6810 0.0000
~1.25 control bore 0.684 0.6850 0.0010
0.687 0.6875 0.0005
0.690 0.6915 0.0015
0.693 0.6940 0.0010
Fronts 14" CF CCM (tapered) 0.6960 - .7100 N/A
---------------
Stiffi Switch 0.685 0.6855 0.0005
~1.25" control bore 0.687 0.6885 0.0015
0.689 0.6910 0.0020
0.691 0.6915 0.0005
Fronts 12" CF Switch (tapered) 0.6950 - .7010 N/A
---------------
Hammerhead 0.688 0.6890 0.0010
~1.25 control bore 0.690 0.6910 0.0010
0.693 0.6935 0.0005
Front 14" Black Hammerhead N/A N/A
12" Black Hammerhead N/A N/A
---------------
J&J Edge Dust Black 0.682 0.6835 0.0015
~4" control bore 0.685 0.6860 0.0010
0.688 0.6890 0.0010
0.691 0.6910 0.0000
0.693 0.6940 0.0010
Front 10" Dust Black Edge 0.7090 N/A
12" Dust Black Edge 0.7090 N/A
14" Dust Black Edge 0.7060 N/A
---------------
Custom Products 5 piece 0.682 (tapered back) 0.6810 N/A
~5" control bore 0.685 0.6850 0.0000
0.689 0.6885 0.0005
0.693 0.6955 0.0025
0.696 0.6970 0.0010
Front 14" Red CP 0.7005 N/A
---------------
Powerlite Scepter (tapered insert) 0.684 0.6850 0.0010
~6" control bore 0.686 0.6865 0.0005
0.688 0.6870 0.0010
0.690 0.6910 0.0010
0.692 0.6940 0.0020
Front 14" Black PL 0.6990 N/A
---------------
Powerlite Scepter (revolver insert) 0.684 0.6850 0.0010
~6" control bore 0.686 0.6870 0.0010
0.688 0.6900 0.0020
0.690 0.6925 0.0025
0.692 0.6950 0.0030
Front 12" Black PL 0.7000 N/A
---------------
J&J Edge Gloss Black 0.685 0.6860 0.0010
~4" control bore 0.688 0.6900 0.0020
0.691 0.6920 0.0010
0.693 0.6945 0.0015
Front 12" Gloss Edge 0.7055 N/A
---------------
WGP Kaner 0.682 0.6830 0.0010
~6.5" control bore 0.684 0.6850 0.0010
0.687 0.6880 0.0010
0.689 0.6895 0.0005
0.691 0.6915 0.0005
12" Pweter Kaner 0.7005 N/A
14" Pweter Kaner 0.7030 N/A
16" Pweter Kaner 0.7005 N/A
---------------
Dye Ultralite White (?.689) 0.6925 N/A
~6" control bore Yellow (?.689) 0.6925 N/A
Red (?.685) 0.6895 N/A
0.692 Blue 0.6950 N/A
Fronts 12" dust black proto 0.7020 N/A
14" Blue UL 0.7010 N/A
14" dust black UL 0.7010 N/A
---------------
SM Race ~5.5" control bore 0.686 0.6860 0.0000
Front 14" blue Race 0.7015 N/A
---------------
Lucky Un1tec 14" bore 0.685 0.6850 0.0000
0.693 0.6930 0.0000
0.696 0.6960 0.0000
---------------
Dye Xcel 12" one piece 0.6910 N/A
---------------
Xmag stock 12" one piece 0.6920 N/A
---------------
WGP Trilogy stock 14" one piece 0.6890 N/A
---------------
Tear Drop 14" one piece 0.6890 N/A
---------------
Misc 11" one piece 0.6885 N/A
---------------
Stock RT Pro J&J Dust Black ~5.5" control bore 0.6935 N/A
Front 12" Dust Black ?? 0.7150 N/A
---------------

[hmudd13]

I think the best one is the one there in the middle, slightly to the left.


LOL

Actually you can test barrels all day, and then test the same barrels the next day with the same paint and get totally different results,

Depending on temp, humity, barometric pressure,,,,, you get the point.

I usually bring several barrels and a kit or two when i play and pick the best at the time of the game. And a lot of times it's the stock barrel that performs the best. go figure

[MANN]

Actually you can test barrels all day, and then test the same barrels the next day with the same paint and get totally different results,

Depending on temp, humity, barometric pressure,,,,, you get the point.

The test will be preformed indoors with the temp ~ 70 degrees. There will be no external forces on the paintball other than the barrel and our friend gravity. There are a few stock barrels in the mix. My xmag one, a trilogy stock, and a misc non ported one.

[�?�� �m���]

thats gonna be a lot of paint and a lot of screwing in and out the barrels gl!

[Paintchucker]

Here is a link to the test that Paintball Times did in 2001:

http://www.paintballtimes.com/2001test/index.htm

If you standardize with them on distances, FPS, etc, you can also use their numbers to backup/verify yours...



BTW, dang that is a ton of barrels!

[MANN]

yeah Ive read that. I wasnt too happy with the results. IMO they basicly said crap. They didnt show the shot varance, but said they were in a 10 or 12" radius. To me that means crap. I want to see the shot pattern. I also want pics of their setup. They didnt state where they were testing either. inside or out. etc, etc, etc. They also used little to no what I would consider popular barrels. They blamed it on barrel companies, but honestly if I were a barrel company I wouldnt send them anything either. IMO their report sucked.

warpig has also done alot of test with different barrels. the sm1 is one that i was reading last weekend

http://www.warpig.com/paintball/technical/barrels/sm1/index.shtml

I want to create similar data for all the barrels above. That way when someone ask me why I beleive that one barrel is better than another I can say because .

[Tao]

Wow!!!!................

Well good luck! I am currious to see if two (or more) peice barrels do worse than single piece barrels.

Hey do you have the Lucky 15" barrel or barrel kit in there? (its the kit I use so nice to know :P)

[nicad]

You seem to be missing a Fibur.

[Mike Smith]

Why don't you use reballs? They seem to be fairly consistant. And reusable.

And as an FYI, I would recommend using a 10" Hammerhead barrel, instead of what appears to be a 14" barrel

[MANN]

Hey do you have the Lucky 15" barrel or barrel kit in there? (its the kit I use so nice to know :P)

Ive got the .685, .693, and .696 (no .689 yet)

You seem to be missing a Fibur.

Yep. I will have a ccm, stiffi switch, and a sly kit tho

Why don't you use reballs? They seem to be fairly consistant. And reusable.

And as an FYI, I would recommend using a 10" Hammerhead barrel, instead of what appears to be a 14" barrel

Im not using reballs because I dont play reball, and dont have access to ~500-1000 of them.
Why would you recocomend a 10" over a 14"? (If you have a 10" I would be more than happy to try it)

[bryceeden]

For the $40 a case paint if you can find it I reccomend Archon Ink'd its the most consistant $40case paint I've ever found.

[Mike Smith]

Reball would give you the consistancy, ball to ball and barrel to barrel, and take the built-in imperfections of paintballs out of the equation. Just a suggestion.

I've shot a 14" and a 10" Hammerhead. The 10" seems more accurate, combined with the fin kit's 2" length. Maybe it has a better "sight" picture than the 14".

[georgeyew]

The beer can on top of the photo is a nice touch That is quite a collection that you got there. Are you going to be parting it out when you are done with your test? I can't wait to see the result. Thanks for taking the initiative to do this.

[MANN]

For the $40 a case paint if you can find it I reccomend Archon Ink'd its the most consistant $40case paint I've ever found.

Where do you order it from. Its not on paintball discounters or first call.

Mike. I have a pod of reballs I will try to test the differences between them and some of the paintball brands to see what happens.

The beer can on top of the photo is a nice touch That is quite a collection that you got there. Are you going to be parting it out when you are done with your test? I can't wait to see the result. Thanks for taking the initiative to do this.

After measuring the internal diameter of half of the barrels it was defiently miller time I will probally only keep 2-3 barrel kits for myself (the best ones of course). The rest are going to be sold to pay for school .

[DaFin]

MANN,

I love the experiment. I'd like to know how you are setting up the experiment and what data are you going to collect? Absolute deviation from the center of the shot pattern? Are you going to re-calibrate/re-chrono to each barrel as to maintain as near a constant velocity accross all barrels as possible?

I might recommend that you do a Design of Experiments(DOE) study with three variables, barrell, paint and velocity to determine how much input each variable has to the outcome and which variable is going to have the greatest impact on the outcome. Three of each variabe(barrell/paint/velocity) and five shots should be enough to give significant outcome.

Here is a link to some info on DOE ==> LINK

Here is a link to some software that might help you crunch the data ==> LINK

There is also a fairly good MS Excel add on that might be the easiest thing for you to use called SPC-XL that you can download a day trial version of here ==> LINK

I'm so curious because I am a manufacturing professional and I am currently doing "black belt" training which among other things deals with gathering and interpreting data just like this and also.. I'm just a rabid paintballer who digs stuff like this.

I've probably muddied the waters for you and I know you want to do this very soon but if I can offer any advise/help, I'll kibbitz where I can.

And if I can get a copy of the data when you are done that would rock!

Best,