Introducing the Micromag 2009

[Engus]

Where did all the "if you didn't buy a body you can't comment" talk come from? This is an online forum and if someone is registered to AO and feels like chiming in with their .02 they can do that.

This is true, but a generic thread devoted to discussing the state of preorder/custom projects on AO would be a much better place to do so.

[Ratt]

Well, I guess if someone wants to complain about PTP (even though they have gone out of their way to accomodate us), they will have to do it here. The 'PTP MicroMag 2009 complaint thread' is locked. Let the unnecessary posting of b.s. on this thread continue...

By the way, when you get banned, do you receive an email saying you are banned, or do you find out the hard way by trying to log on a few times? I don't want to get banned, but I kinda feel it coming...

[Beemer]

Quick observation:

Why is it that PTP pulls the same stuff as other mag "dealers" with a preorder that stretches far far too long with no end in sight... but they have to be treated "like a lady" and everybody just accepts it?

Why, do you have a problem with that. It is out of Tracys hands. You need to talk to Zoom OR Forest. All the contact info is here. To harass, attack and be RUDE toTRACY will accomplish nothing.

YOU need to talk with FOREST or ZOOM. You are doing it all wrong. I would think if you are not on the order it is not your concern.

Well, I guess if someone wants to complain about PTP (even though they have gone out of their way to accomodate us), they will have to do it here. The 'PTP MicroMag 2009 complaint thread' is locked. Let the unnecessary posting of b.s. on this thread continue...

Looks like that thread got locked because this thread is here. No need for another unnecessary thread in Talk. Complain ALL you want here.

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[sslecyk03]

This is true, but a generic thread devoted to discussing the state of preorder/custom projects on AO would be a much better place to do so.

But why? This may be a pre-order thread but the pre-orders are done with. There really is nothing else that is worthwhile discussing in this thread besides the current state of affairs, which is piss poor if you ask me. I'm not trying to call any of you guys out or rub it in your face that you made a bad decision but when is AO going to stand up for themselves? If a year is an acceptable deadline when the initial wait time was "around" 4-6 weeks then where do we draw the line? What is going to stop another company from taking 1.5 years....2 years.....5 years. It sounds silly but when would you guys honestly get fed up and say something?

Also, I am in no way, nor have I ever told anyone on here how to spend their money. Giving my opinion should not be taken as an instructional on that at all. All I have said was that if I was in on this pre-order (which was tempting at first, props to Engus on the design influence) I would have jumped ship a while ago. This is nothing new to AO as I said, it happens ALLLL the time and it is really getting pathetic.

One more thing, to Ando and going home,

I hope your words weren't directed towards me with the "troll" and "ignorant" statements. I by no means joined this forum to troll anybody, in fact, I joined before either of you two. I also never insulted anybody here, directly or indirectly, and yet that is what I'm receiving for stating my opinion on the way pre-orders are treated around here. Does that seem fair? Did you get a golden ticket with a password to post in this thread just because you bought one of these bodies?

This can be discussed in a mature way guys. Nobody threw out insults, neither me nor teufelhunden, and yet people are calling for bans on someone with an alternate opinion? Gimme a break. I want what is best for the forum and right now all these pushed-back pre-orders are making us look like pushovers.

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[Chris]

The difference in this pre-order, and most others, is that PTP allowed all of the users to have substantial input in the design of the body. Including a couple of major redesigns. In my mind, that is the big downfall to the schedule. The product will be good, but the timeline went out the door a couple of days into the order.

It's a good demonstration of why a Democracy does not work. And, if you look hard enough, you will understand why a Republic is much more effective.

Also, for those of you who believe that all custom orders happen immediately; think again. Whether you are ordering a custom hot-rod, motorcycle or house; or if you are ordering a custom piece of jewelry, clothing or circuit board...anything that hasn't been done and tested before will have problems. The issues need to be sorted out before the product is delivered. Sometimes this happens quickly, and other times it will take a bit of time.

I've got my money into this project, as do a number of the other posters in this thread. If you have an issue with the way PTP ran this pre-order, then sell your spot or shut the up.
If you dont have your money tied up...and you are upset about the way this was run, you just got a free lesson on not doing business with PTP.

For the rest of us who realize that problems happen, and who knew that this project was never going to be done in a few months; Ill still deal with PTP in the future. I still see them as a good company that made an error in estimating the time required to complete a project. I have no worries about the quality of the new Micromag, and I know that I'll eventually get it and be quite happy with it.

Edit......Dont circumvent the filter. Use this

[going_home]

Yep, I think Its Dead Now

Keep trying heheh














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Courage is the conquest of fear, not the absence of it.

[Ratt]

The difference in this pre-order, and most others, is that PTP allowed all of the users to have substantial input in the design of the body. Including a couple of major redesigns. In my mind, that is the big downfall to the schedule. The product will be good, but the timeline went out the door a couple of days into the order.

It's a good demonstration of why a Democracy does not work. And, if you look hard enough, you will understand why a Republic is much more effective.

Also, for those of you who believe that all custom orders happen immediately; think again. Whether you are ordering a custom hot-rod, motorcycle or house; or if you are ordering a custom piece of jewelry, clothing or circuit board...anything that hasn't been done and tested before will have problems. The issues need to be sorted out before the product is delivered. Sometimes this happens quickly, and other times it will take a bit of time.

I've got my money into this project, as do a number of the other posters in this thread. If you have an issue with the way PTP ran this pre-order, then sell your spot or shut the up.
If you dont have your money tied up...and you are upset about the way this was run, you just got a free lesson on not doing business with PTP.


For the rest of us who realize that problems happen, and who knew that this project was never going to be done in a few months; Ill still deal with PTP in the future. I still see them as a good company that made an error in estimating the time required to complete a project. I have no worries about the quality of the new Micromag, and I know that I'll eventually get it and be quite happy with it.

Thank you, Chris, for saying everything I have been wanting to say, but lacked the words to do so.

[zondo]

Thank you, Chris, for saying everything I have been wanting to say, but lacked the words to do so.

I vote for tabling discussion until after the Christmas weekend. Nothing can be done until after then anyway.


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[secretweaponevan]

As far as I am concerned, PTP can take as much time as they need.

I'd rather wait and have it look good and work properly, than get it tomorrow and have it be a piece of crap.

[Storminnorman]

It is easier to do a job right than to explain why you didn't.

[wetwrks]

I hope your words weren't directed towards me with the "troll" and "ignorant" statements. I by no means joined this forum to troll anybody, in fact, I joined before either of you two. I also never insulted anybody here, directly or indirectly, and yet that is what I'm receiving for stating my opinion on the way pre-orders are treated around here. Does that seem fair? Did you get a golden ticket with a password to post in this thread just because you bought one of these bodies?

No, I am not singling you out.

As for the reason I requested a time out for non purchasers who come here causing trouble...I don't see any difference between someone doing that and someone going in and bashing someones sale thread in the other areas. Here is the rule that applies there and should here too:

#12. No disruption of a users For Sale thread

I don't see any difference between people coming in here causing trouble and people going into the marker threads causing trouble.

[sslecyk03]

No, I am not singling you out.

As for the reason I requested a time out for non purchasers who come here causing trouble...I don't see any difference between someone doing that and someone going in and bashing someones sale thread in the other areas. Here is the rule that applies there and should here too:

#12. No disruption of a users For Sale thread

I don't see any difference between people coming in here causing trouble and people going into the marker threads causing trouble.

I agree with you and I am in no way trying to insult PTP or get in the way of their sales. I am all for paintball companies doing well especially ones that deal with the AGD line. All I'm saying is that this happens all the time and custom product or not...small company or not...design changes or not....there is no good reason that a deadline should be over 10x longer than expected, especially when factoring in that this was a pre-order sale. 10x is a HUGE number when the unit we are working with is 4-6 weeks.

To all of you that are waiting patiently I applaud you, all I'm saying is that if I was involved I would have jumped ship a long time ago. I can deal with deadlines being pushed back but all too often on this forum it seems dealers take it to the extreme.

For all you who are saying "Nobody cares about your opinion because you didn't buy one of these" you can simply ignore my posts and carry on with the thread.

Does this sale affect me directly? No. Why do I care? Because every pre-order product that comes out on this forum sets a certain standard, and right now that standard sucks.
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[robertsr1811]

it's not just here folks. It's not an AO only problem. I've been waiting for 3 years on a small batch gun based on the old vector design. I may or may not ever see it. But I don't put money down on something if I can't afford to have it tied up.

In any case, I think if you don't have skin in the game you have nothing to talk about here.

Thanks for your opinion. You can stop saying it over and over now.

[sslecyk03]

Thanks for your opinion. You can stop saying it over and over now.

And Again, I don't need your permission to post, but thank you as well.

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[going_home]

Agreed

I agree with mister Robert.
Life is full of chances, some you take, some you dont.


And Chris....... you sure got a Christmas gift from AOModerationTeam.
You didnt get time out in the corner for naughty words so merry Christmas.