New superbolt Material?

[Minimag4me]

ok a few things, the concave bolt is sharper so it would be more prone to chopping. The double nubbin thing would be bad because when the bolt actually hits the ball it would slap the ball and possibly cause more barrel breaks.

Also i think the concave face doesnt push the ball into the barrel far enough causing barrel breaks. I think thats why they put foamies on the newer superbolts.

I have a superbolt that i wont use in fear of it breaking and i would like to get this resolved. I dont like 50 dollars of mine just sitting. Aluminum or something else would be fine with me just get it fixed soon please.

[tomcat]

Et Al!

The bolt is sharper but I don't think it would increase ball breakage at all. In the same way that it has a sharp nose, the flat nose bolt has a greater surface area to smash the ball at any angle. The IMPORTANT thing to remember is that any ball that is NOT in correct postion when ANY bolt type comes forward is probably going to break.

I doubt that the ball would break with the double nubbin system because the concave shape and very short distance from the ball to the bolt head would absorb a great deal of the shock induced. i.e Throw an egg into the air and hit it with a flat palm. The egg will break. Do the same thing but cup your hand. The egg has a much better chance of surviving because the impact is absorbed over a greater area of the surface of the egg and your palm.

I think a foamie or softer surface does help. I am not sure how much though.
An important thing to remember is that the automag/RT worked fine with the regular bolt for a long time. The only thing that has been introduced is an electronic trigger and I think, a longer breach (in the SFL anyway).
Not to mention that so many manufacturers are making the paint more brittle (don't even get me started on that!).
Using a long nose foamie is probably still too short for my SFL causing blowback (I shoot fast!) and hence ball breakage in my gun. I think the solution will come from a longer bolt of whatever material and architecture.
In the mean time I will continue to hypothasize because I can't shoot my gun yet so what else is there to do! :) :)

A big issue in my mind is the speed that the bolt comes forward. It looks like it is going MUCH faster than my Angel or Autococker bolt. Maybe I should direct my attention to reducing the speed of that! Now we will REALLY have to reduce the weight of the bolt hehe!

I do think a metal (aluminum) rather than delrin is better though because the inside of the ring inside the body that the bolt head goes through into the breech has a sharp inside edge that rubs against the delrin, shaving it, weakening it, and eventually wearing it tilll it cracks.

I could get frustrated and yell why doesn't my new $1400 dollar gun work, or I can try to help do something to fix it(even if I have no clue what i am doing) ! If nothing else, its good therapy :)

[ts1spoc]

1. The O-ring on the front of the bolt won't make any diference in whether the ball is cut.
2. The lighter bolt beng driven forward by the same force as a heavier bolt is going to accelerate quicker and is going to strike the ball at a greater speed, albeit over a short distance. So a foamie might help.
3. I do think the double nubbin system would keep the distance the ball rolls around in the chamber to a minimum.
4. A UHMW plastic is going to decrease friction and would be less likley to produce a sharp ball destroying burr than aluminum. The rear of the chamber can be radiused to prevent hangups. And with the plastic several sizes could be manufactured to fit the barrel chamber. (Increase gas eficiency.)
5. Chamber shape (the area in which the ball sits when the bolt is closed and the ball begins its forward movement) should be the guiding factor in redesigning the bolt. It should provide the most advantagous pressure wave behind the ball possible.
6. We are still limited by the ballistic coefficient of the paintballs. Until ball quality improves to the point all balls are perfect spheres we will still have inaccuracy no matter what type of system we use.

[tomcat]

Reply

1. You are right. the o-ring won't make a difference if the ball is not in position. I thought I clarified that :)
2. Maybe. If the bolt is lighter then it has a harder time pushing against the bolt spring. That is why I figured it could slow down. Heavier bolt = greater inertia. Reducing gas pressure might help as well.
3. maybe :)
4. I am not sure we sould have to worry about too many ball breaking sharp burrs. I agree with you that the chamber edge could be smoothed to prevent faster wear. I am still trying to think of a solution that changes just the bolt though. Not the whole gun as that would be cost prohibitive and everyone would have to send their gun back in that has a problem...yuck!
5. I will take your word for it :)
6. I think balls are accurate enough now and am not worried about that. I think going back to old school shell is the way to go. I think we have becoome to extreme with this breakable shell thing. I would rather bounce a paintball off of someone then have to clean my gun and not be able to shoot at all!
7. Yes I know you did not make a point 7 :) Just wanted to say...my that is a big dog! Meet my little Kitty!

[BlackVCG]

The purpose of the cupped face design is to eliminate the gap inbetween the bolt face and the ball on the front of it. This prevents damage to the next ball inline. Unfortunately, with a cupped face you misalign the ball stack and this allows the next ball inline to drop down in farther and get hit by the bolt face and bounce back up.

As for the double nubbin idea, there just isn't enough room in the nubbin slot in the barrel to make two contact points on the ball.

[tomcat]

SFL

I have the SFL e-mag so keep forgetting that most people with an e-mag are using the AGD type barrel rather than the autococker thread.
A friend and I filmed my e-mag firing last night. We found that sometimes the ball in the breech was going past the detent (SFL remember!). This allowed the next ball in line to move down and get hit by the bolt!
I mentioned something about this in the tech forum the other day but only proved it last night. Friday night we are going to try again with a detent in the other side at the same time and really rip on the paint!