ULT eMag problem solved?

[lamby]

Originally posted by athomas


I have to agree with some of your concerns.

The HES of the mag is a good way to activate the firing sequence. There is no trigger bounce issues with this setup. There have been issues with interference of some sort that can cause multiple activations. This should and can be addressed once the exact source of the problem is found.

I disagree. If you push a certain way on mine it will mutlifire. It looks like many people can do this. An interupt curcuit is FAR superior to this system

I still don't know why chrono judges pull an emag because of no trigger rod. Using this methodology they should also pull any gun with a WAS board unless it can be chronoed at a high rate of fire because of the potential for "programmed shootup".

Because it is easy to do. By the way, WAS boards are banned in tourneys for the same reason

[athomas]

Originally posted by lamby

Qhote" The HES of the mag is a good way to activate the firing sequence. There is no trigger bounce issues with this setup. There have been issues with interference of some sort that can cause multiple activations. This should and can be addressed once the exact source of the problem is found. "



I disagree. If you push a certain way on mine it will mutlifire. It looks like many people can do this. An interupt curcuit is FAR superior to this system


Because it is easy to do. By the way, WAS boards are banned in tourneys for the same reason

Yes the HES will multifire right now, but I mentioned that there is a source of interference that must be identified and eliminated. Its not the fault of the device but rather the implementation of the device in this case.

WAS boards aren't banned. They can be tourney locked and are considered legal.

[314159]

Originally posted by lamby
3) more power to adjust the circuit board timing and control. Expecially the second control output for the warp. WAS is going to fix this on the warp side though.

at present time, it sounds like the was warp board will only be able to be adjusted by an equalizer board.

[lamby]

Originally posted by 314159


at present time, it sounds like the was warp board will only be able to be adjusted by an equalizer board.

NOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!
that means I am back to modifing my own boards and warps again. The board will be much sweeter. When did you hear this? last I heard is beta 2 is being tested and almost complete. Also the board is configured via blinking LEDS, and the push button last I heard (about 2 weeks ago)

[athomas]

I think it was mentioned that the WAS warp board was to be adjusted like an equalizer board not by an equalizer board.

[314159]

Originally posted by lamby
last I heard (about 2 weeks ago)

i just recall jim saying that right after he announced that he was releasing it, so your news is probally more current. it almost sounded like on markers with a display (timmy), jim would probally update the equilizer software to allow the equilizer to setup the warp, and the settings to be visible on the timmy display.

but if that was only the place, i guess jim would not be pitching it to the mag folks hehehe.

[hitech]

Back to the original subject. A reason for using the ULT in the eMag is to allow the use of a much smaller solenoid. This in turn allows the use of a much smaller battery; maybe even a 9 volt. A side benefit (to me anyway) is the reduction/elimination of bounce. The problem with the ULT is that it slows down the return too much. A spring would speed up the return, but would require a larger solenoid. That is what we are trying to change. So, my idea to speed up the return is to reverse the polarity to the solenoid to increase the return speed. I am fairly certain that a solenoid can be made to do this. I don't know if there are any issues with some solenoids that preclude doing that. However, it seems quite likely that a solenoid could be used that would work in both directions.

[lamby]

Hitech,

I understand now. HUMMMMM reduced force HUMMMMMM. well your idea might work, but I have never seen a solenoid designed to push. They might work if wired backwards, but all pushing circuits I have ever seen use a pulling solenoid and a lever to push the item in question. (maybe not true)The only solenoid that I can think of ever seeing that push was used on 80s GM cars as an electronic "anti dieseling valve" This might have used that pushing technoligy that you refer to.

Anyway, I like the idea of a smaller solenoid, but the easiest way to get rid of it is with a purely electro marker and leverage on the standard on/off (a hyperframe)

[Wat]

Polarity

Solenoids do not have polarity. You can't just switch polarity and then have a solenoid that pulls now push. Most solenoids that return to its original position are spring loaded. It is possible to have a magnetic core such that the solenoid now pushes instead of pulls, but again, switching the polarity on the coils won't flip the direction of the force.

Solenoids work when you have a core thats partly inside the noid and partly outside (actually, you just need the magnetic differential, so you could be just outside the coil to work, but in this case, lets just say inside and outside the coil). With the core partially inside the coil, energizing it will draw it in, regardless of the polarity or which end of the coil you're using. Once fully inside the coil, it won't move afterwards. You could have a foot long coil but a 1 inch core will only go deep inside to be fully covered and not get pulled the entire length.

[hitech]

It appears you can:

Single-coil switch machines work on a somewhat different principal. They employ a pair of permanent magnets housed inside the solenoid coil. Single-coil machines must be driven using a D.C. source, which creates a magnetic field inside the coil that attracts one magnet and repels the other. Throw direction is determined by the polarity of the applied D.C. voltage.

Also, you chould build two solenoids in a single housing. It can be done...

[athomas]

There are solenoids that push and solenoids that pull.

Reversing the polarity of a solenoid should theoretically cause it to reverse direction. This is because of the north-south magnetic field that is created based on electron direction. The plunger of a solenoid is usually a permanent magnet. If you create the proper polarity it will be attracted to the magnetic field created by the solenoid coil. If you reverse the polarity, it will be repelled by the solenoid coil.

The problem with this situation in an emag or any gun is that we are creating an electrical reactive trigger effect instead of an air reactive effect. The bounce issue may still be there though.

[hitech]

Originally posted by athomas
Reversing the polarity of a solenoid should theoretically cause it to reverse direction.

Thanks, that is what I thought. I'm sure a solenoid could be built that would work in both directions.

Originally posted by athomas
The problem with this situation in an emag or any gun is that we are creating an electrical reactive trigger effect instead of an air reactive effect. The bounce issue may still be there though.

I never thought of that. I think we could eliminate that issue by controlling the "power" to the solenoid in the return direction. Thanks, I hadn't thought of that.

[paintballbeaver]

well Heres my solution Scrap the "electronic selinoid go w/ a pneumatic ram and electronic selinoid to actuate and move the ram. more or less pull the ram and electronics out of an angel or bushmaster and retro fit them into the emag grip frame then the battery and probs are solved.

i actualy think a good canidate for the ram electronics switch would be the timmy and w.a.s. board in theory you would have to replace the push w/a pull ram but not a hard concept, and would lead to great great things.


just my 2-3 cents

[hitech]

Originally posted by paintballbeaver
well Heres my solution Scrap the "electronic selinoid go w/ a pneumatic ram and electronic selinoid to actuate and move the ram.

That adds a huge amount of extra parts that I personally would not want.

[SlartyBartFast]

Originally posted by paintballbeaver
well Heres my solution Scrap the "electronic selinoid go w/ a pneumatic ram and electronic selinoid to actuate and move the ram.

Been done before. Look for Punishers pneumatic ram Automag on AO.