Closed v. Open (Bolt)

[clockworkmiller]

Well, if you want, I might be able to arrange some sort of testing.

Just to make sure, if the a barrel is made for two different guns, it would still have the same bore size, like exact same for purpose of testing accuracy?

[Jonny05]

well..

Shure go ahead if you have a fancy dancy ballistics lab.

If you do it, do it right. Doing it the right way will cost money.

I don't have the money, connection, guns, money, or money to do it sooooo....

Anyone eles want to give it a try whos loaded?

-JONNY

[clockworkmiller]

Im not loaded, but I have friends who have different types of guns (Angel, Mag, Cocker, m98, and Spyder).

Im sure we can figure out a way to test it.

Tom, you've got the dyno, and the whole AGD ballistics lab, you want to try it out?

[Jonny05]

I have friends too but...

You would have to eliminate the other factors to test for each catorgy.

For ball jump you would have to use the same air system, paint, barrel (check with dial indicator), and clamp down the guns so the precoil doesn't count. Changing up bolts would help too. Like I said... It would take some connections and money.

The paint would have to be two coloured and place in so you may see if there is any spin. It would have to be indoors and with a lot of paint.

Tom want to give it a try?

[AGD]

In my experience no matter what facts you come up with everyone ends up saying "yea but it depends" and the argument goes on.

We spent the time and money years ago. If there was anything to be had for better accuracy it would be worth a million dollars to AGD. We would have gone in that direction.

If you want to think XYZ is better that's fine go ahead.

AGD

[clockworkmiller]

But I dont want to "think" something is better.

Any opinion that isnt based on factual evidence is an uninformed, and poorly supported opinion.

Im just saying, the easiest way to test it would be take two guns, give them the same barrel, the same paint, and same air system, same regulator, and then have at it.

If you put a case through each gun, then any small inbalances would be negated, and the only factor that should effect accuracy would be the bolt, whether it is closed or open.

Personally, I think there is a difference, but it is such a minimal difference that it would have no bearing in a fire fight. Thats based on the tests I've seen. I would like to see it between difference guns.

[Apocolypse]

somebody came out with a new electro kit for a cocker, which lets the marker operate in both open and closed bolt. it will be interesting to see how many people buy this upgrade just to see if closed bolt really is better.

[Vegeta]

The ppl that make the new electropnematic cocker upgrades also make the mayhem.. can't recall the company name. I am gonna post what I said in IRC earlier today.. doesnt have much to do with the discussion, but.. well.. :
"To me, Bud Orr isn't innovative.. *POOF*

[AGD]

There is another comparison to make with the barrel jump scenario. Real handguns kick like a mule and jump several inches, by the same thinking they should not be able to hit ANYTHING! So why ARE real handguns accurate? Good Deep Blue question, answer that and you will know the answer to paintball gun kick vs accuracy.

AGD

[Lord Vader]

Why handguns are accurate...

The reason that handgun jump has little effect on handgun accuracy is simple: the bullet is traveling so fast that it leaves the barrel before the barrel jumps due to recoil.

As far as open bolt versus closed bolt, there is only ONE reason the cocker is a closed bolt gun: it is based off the Sniper pump gun. So, instead of being a semi-auto in the traditional sense, it is in fact a pneumatically pumping pump gun. Also, any movement caused by the mag bolt loading the ball into the chamber is negated by the barrel. As far as accuracy goes, (barring spin), the barrel is the great equalizer of paintguns. Once into the breech(sp?), then it's fair game as far as the paintball is concerned.

Well, I'm tired. Good night.

[AGD]

Vader gets big points for that answer.

AGD

[Lord Vader]

Thanks Tom. I am just trying to bring a little rational thought to the often hyped world of paintball.

[steveg]

clockwork apparently your wish will be answered one day.
Billmi responded to a post a while ago stating that he
is going to do such a test.

If you think about it matching the barrels are easy

Extreme's,matrix,excaliburs and of course cockers all use
the same barrels. So just use the same barrel!

Second option is a freak system, same insert, same tip(front)
just the back changes Essentially the same barrel.

[kenshinkandon]

I have an idea about being able to swap the same barrel on to different guns what about a diablo matrix which is closed bolt and say an angel(the only reason I suggested that is because they don't make automag breeches)the only thing you have to do with a matrix is change the breech and you can put on just about any barrel you want from spyders to autocockers.

[liigod]

Well being a converted pump isnt the only reason for a cocker to be closed bolt. i personally have made an open bolt cocker. Switch the 3 way hoses then timed it differently. So there is a small advantage to having it closed i gaurentee it.