great minds of AO, who knows about water pumps?

[MoeMag]

Alright so here is the trick.

I have a fluid carrying small micro algae. They cannot be compressed or squished otherwise it will kill them.

I have most of the system worked out to run with gravity, but at the bottom it has to go back up.

the only thing I can think of is an archemedies screw. any other ideas?

[MANN]

how high are you taking them? What compression is allowed (nothing can move in the Y direction without some form of pressure)? What fluid are you using?

[thahouse]

Does this have to be a continuous flow? Or can it be to one holding tank with an overflow timer?

[thahouse]

Essentially im thinking that you would be best off to use a vaccum pump. Have dump valves in selected places, will create a vaccum cycle drawing from the vertical lines to cause the water to rise via the least vaccum pressure into the top chamber which then would flow into the main holding tank.

[MoeMag]

Its a continuous flow. I really want to avoid any "holding" as they need to be in constant suspension and not settling out. Imagine trying to keep gold fish with no fins moving and alive.

They are tiny little single cells... so they are strong, but not strong enough to be run thru a normal pump.

I shouldnt be taking them more than about 2 or 3 ft. but if it could be done to higher levels... that could be good.

As for the fluid... just water with a relative high concentration of these little algae guys. as long as they are in motion it acts just like water, but if they stand still it can become as viscous as thick shampoo.

What compression is allowed (nothing can move in the Y direction without some form of pressure)?

That is a very good question. I will have to look into this more... currently their enviroment is a long tube about 8ft tall. so just some quick math thats about 1.24 ATM (18.22psi) at max at the bottom. I know they can handle that just fine. so if a perfect vac -14.6959488 psi that should be within limits to suck them up.

[skife]

umm, you could use a water wheel.

[Hilltop Customs]

umm, you could use a water wheel.

I was thinking the same thing, but a water wheel would require a pool at the bottom....MoeMag said if the water stops moving, it becomes viscous. Maybe you could figure out how much flow your getting and have it fill directly into the wheel....basically not needing the pool at the bottom.

How fast do they become viscous? Is it just the algae settling? Because you could have an agitator in the pool at the bottom or just keep the pool aerated(spelling?) with lots of bubbles to keep the buggers in motion.

Is there any way for the rest of the system to be level so that you dont have to deal with the big height difference?

[neppo1345]

Diaphram pump?

[MoeMag]

I was thinking the same thing, but a water wheel would require a pool at the bottom....MoeMag said if the water stops moving, it becomes viscous. Maybe you could figure out how much flow your getting and have it fill directly into the wheel....basically not needing the pool at the bottom.

How fast do they become viscous? Is it just the algae settling? Because you could have an agitator in the pool at the bottom or just keep the pool aerated(spelling?) with lots of bubbles to keep the buggers in motion.

Is there any way for the rest of the system to be level so that you dont have to deal with the big height difference?

Ha. I had thought the same thing. The thing with this is that the whole system has to be sealed. there is a big problem with the algae bugs getting contaminated with local strains. last summer we had a dust storm roll thru the site and there was some sort of local organism that demolished the entire stock. The wheel is such a great simple Idea one of the other guys on the team has been talking about making an entire system that is basically a water wheel. but that would be $$$. The concept is def on our mind tho.


you all caught on about them turning viscous. We do use bubbles to keep them in motion currently. its also how we feed them with their CO2 gas. (who woulda thought paintball would help with my job).

The diaphram pump is good. one of our older designs used a diaphram "waste" pump that was able to pump them in their viscous state for harvest. I hadnt thought about using one while they are still growing tho. I suppose there would be one out there that doesnt have too high of pressure. I will have to look into it.

What else ya got guys?

[Lohman446]

Possible to turn the entire container to cause water movement rather than having to pump water up. THink a big circular container turning slowly (perhaps with ridges to cause the lowest water to move) to cause movement rather than a pump?

[rkjunior303]

and dare i ask WHY you are playing with micro-algae?

[MoeMag]

Possible to turn the entire container to cause water movement rather than having to pump water up. THink a big circular container turning slowly (perhaps with ridges to cause the lowest water to move) to cause movement rather than a pump?

When I said

The wheel is such a great simple Idea one of the other guys on the team has been talking about making an entire system that is basically a water wheel.

Thats basically what they are thinking.

At least everyone is on the right track.

But the question about why im playing with micro algae...

http://blog.wired.com/cars/2007/08/pond-scum-makes.html

and this one...

http://www.asuwebdevil.com/issues/2008/04/10/news/704674

(I built the unit in the photo last summer)

This is my project. Dr. Hu is who I work for. Him and his team are the biologist behind the project. Mr. Gintz is no longer on the project and that basically put me in the lead of the team this summer being the senior designer. We are gearing up for new funding coming up with the new fiscal year in july and we are planning to build a completley new system based off what we learned last summer with the panel reactors.

Its a really great project, and im really proud to be working on it. Im actually doing something that is good for everyone.


So since the cat is outta the bag, I want to be able to circulate the algae out of their panels and cool them at a central plant. this way I can keep down the cost of having cooling coils in each reactor. eventually I will have to get them back from the cooling plant into the reactors... and thats where this "gentle" pump is needed. its a small problem overall... but its an annoying one.

[Lohman446]

Mini conveyer belt?

[Hilltop Customs]

how about building your own pump? Imagine 2 tubes with plungers, connect them to either a motor, or linear actuators so they alturnate cycles(as one is extending, the other is contracting) They would work along the same lines as a bicycle air pump, except for pumping fluid(or imagine a shot needle). If you have the output of each one have a check valve so the liquid doesnt syphon back down.(you also need a check vavle build into the face of the plunger so you dont build up a vaccum as the pump retracts.

These 2 tubes would sit below your entire system, so they are filled by gravity and then each time the pluger goes up fluid is passed through the check valve and cannot return. You could even have more than 2 tubes, or make them a large diameter for more flow.

They could be mounted horizontal or vertical. Horizontal you would deal with slightly less pressures, but vertical you could add a co2 bubbler at the bottom of the tube to keep them fed and moving.

This idea can be 100% sealed too.

Hope it helps.

[Hilltop Customs]

this reminds me of an episode of dirty jobs where they used a type algae to make some medication....