for those wanting a new self defense pistol

[Lohman446]

what is that chambered for ? , how many of those little bullets will it hold in a mag ??

5.7MM and 20 IIRC

[malJohann]

5.7MM and 20 IIRC

Correct. It's the same ammo used in the FN Herstal P90. Made to penetrate body armour and de-stabilise straight after that. Leaves a bigger permanent cavity than a .45, yet doesn't over-penetrate and kill people behind the one you were aiming for. Also, after 200m of free flight you can catch the bullet out of the air with your hand. Designed exclusively for personal defense and urban use.

[Lohman446]

Correct. It's the same ammo used in the FN Herstal P90. Made to penetrate body armour and de-stabilise straight after that. Leaves a bigger permanent cavity than a .45, yet doesn't over-penetrate and kill people behind the one you were aiming for. Also, after 200m of free flight you can catch the bullet out of the air with your hand. Designed exclusively for personal defense and urban use.

I was under the impression overpenetration was a MAJOR concern on these. After that point I didn't look into them too much as they struck me as gimmicky, I might have to look a little harder now,.

[Steelrat]

They don't sell that ammo anymore due to concerns about it's ability to penetrate police body armor.

[LegumeOfTerror]

Correct. It's the same ammo used in the FN Herstal P90. Made to penetrate body armour and de-stabilise straight after that. Leaves a bigger permanent cavity than a .45, yet doesn't over-penetrate and kill people behind the one you were aiming for. Also, after 200m of free flight you can catch the bullet out of the air with your hand. Designed exclusively for personal defense and urban use.

that ammo you have has no armor penetrating capabilities, and you certainly would not be able to catch it at 200 meters. the ammo available to you does not meet the FBI standard of 12" penetration into ballistics gel. the advantage of the cartridge is, out of an automatic carbine with proper ammunition, its ability to penetrate and low recoil. the low recoil allows multiple hits to make up for each rounds poor ballistics. to a civilian, who is for the most part restricted to semi-auto carbines and handguns with fmj and ballistic tip ammunition, the cartridge does not serve its intended purpose.

[Lohman446]

That palm pistol thing, as a deep backup gun, is not looking that bad. Something is better than nothing (though out of a short barrel I would like to see a larger diameter round, that 9 just can't have much velocity).

[michbich]

I have one of those at home, didn't know what kind of gun it went with. Now only missing the second part of the equation lol

[LegumeOfTerror]

I have one of those at home, didn't know what kind of gun it went with. Now only missing the second part of the equation lol

that looks like .17 HMR. its not a 5.7 because the rim extends past the case and lacks the recess before the rim. I'm willing to bet it does not have a visible primer.

[Dend78]

i believe LOT is right that looks like a 17, the FN five seven will hold 20rnds in a standard mag, in penetration tests the 9mm out penetrated it due to the yaw effect of the 5.7x28 rnd, meaning when this hit soft tissue (including the hollow point rnds) the bullet wouldnt fragment but it would tummble causeing major internal damage without blowing out the other side to harm others. thats why i said if i have my choice in another thread this would be my round of choice. super light recoil, less blow back enabeling you to keep both eyes open and on target and depending on which model you have the trigger is very nice and crisp, and jarvis makes a threaded barrel for em so you can mount sil....errr ummm muzzle breaks on em

I don't know, if I pull the trigger I want to at least have reasonable faith that its going to work... and in a gun that size there are a lot more effective options I would think.

also if you pop someone with anything basically at 30 yards and closer it will work, you are right it may not kill them but the energy alone body armor or not should cause some damage. again though you are right why carry that hog leg when you can get a 1911 or something smaller yet and do the same thing

[maxama10]

They don't sell that ammo anymore due to concerns about it's ability to penetrate police body armor.

From what I understood you could still get a hold of it, and it was not illegal to buy.

I may be mistaken though.

[Lohman446]

also if you pop someone with anything basically at 30 yards and closer it will work, you are right it may not kill them but the energy alone body armor or not should cause some damage. again though you are right why carry that hog leg when you can get a 1911 or something smaller yet and do the same thing

I'll admit to not being up to speed on the 5.7 but I doubt that 410 shell (assuming its a shot shell) out of that little barrel is effective to 10 yards and the spread likely makes it unlikely to get hit with enough pieces of shot to really matter, not to mention the ultra light weight of a single piece doesn't carry enough force to do much

I would honestly like to see the same range test against soemthing other than the high visibility target, like a t-shirt, and some other common "heavier" clothing (denim, leather, carhart, etc.)

[Dend78]

From what I understood you could still get a hold of it, and it was not illegal to buy.

I may be mistaken though.

i believe you are correct just some of the ammo is not for civi use, you can get ss-195, 196 & 197 and i believe thats about it there, although how hard is it to get a 223 AP round? pull those and reload em if you want AP, same round just not as fast only about 1500fps IIRC

I'll admit to not being up to speed on the 5.7 but I doubt that 410 shell (assuming its a shot shell) out of that little barrel is effective to 10 yards and the spread likely makes it unlikely to get hit with enough pieces of shot to really matter, not to mention the ultra light weight of a single piece doesn't carry enough force to do much

I would honestly like to see the same range test against soemthing other than the high visibility target, like a t-shirt, and some other common "heavier" clothing (denim, leather, carhart, etc.)

yeah i wouldnt use shot in em i would put a slug in it those russian stell cased slugs if they arent to long would be ideal in there, granted a spray to the face with shot would cause some issues

[druid]

I like mine...



and what a bad boy would see...

[grEnAlEins]

Late to the party... LOL!

I have been toying with getting a judge for quite some time. The same goes for the five-seven. I might get one of the two for Christmas this year, but it depends on what's readily available and my spending cash at the time.

[maxama10]

i believe you are correct just some of the ammo is not for civi use, you can get ss-195, 196 & 197 and i believe thats about it there, although how hard is it to get a 223 AP round? pull those and reload em if you want AP, same round just not as fast only about 1500fps IIRC

Edit: Closest I've seen to AP is the m855 ball, steel cored, I've seen it a few times on different sites.