...EVERYONE should see this.

**oldsoldier** · 10-27-2002, 03:27 AM

First, everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Now that I got that out of the way....
The Green Party, as well as liberals, have a very skewed view of the world. Diplomacy for Iraq didnt work. We cant hug these nations that cause the world problems. Sometimes, you need to kick them in the pants. Bush's deal with Iraq is a long time coming. In case anyone missed this; Hussein lost the war. He doesnt get to make the rules. Yet, for the entire time Clinton was in office we had 3 terrorist attacks that were linked, on some way, to hussein, numerous hostile fire incidents while patrolling the "no fly" zone, many ,any anti American demonstrations, threats (direct, no less) to our country, and the President himself (including at least one death threat). And now, where has that gotten us? And now, he agreed to UN inspections, then, AGAIN, started making up rules. This guy needs to be removed. Period. He has kept his people in ruin for the past 15 years. He started out nobly; hell, WE supported his fight with Iran! His health care and progressive thinking were far ahead of the rest of the middle east in the late 70s-early 80s. Then, after Iran, he went nuts. He is not right in the head. He has turned into the same thing Hitler was; win the people and the world over, gain absolute power, then do what you want.
As far as N Korea goes; I think this situation is salvageable. Only time will tell on this one. Also, if you didnt know, we have suspected them of having nukes for like 15 years now; there was a detonation a few years back that they vehemently denied; we couldnt prove it, and that was the end of it.
The world's problem's will not be solved with "group hugs and love". Sorry, thats just the way it is. Sometimes, force is needed to make things right. As far as the rest of the world's gun violence; all those countries have outlawed firearms outright, or a person is limited to a breechloader. Therefore, the only firearms are in the hands of police and military. We, on the other hand, allow our citizens to posess firearms. It is a protectedright. Something which CANNOT be taken away. Firearm violence is committed with stolen or illegal firearms. Check the FBI stats; something like 97-97 percent are stolen. Laws arent created for law abiding citizens; they are created to punish criminals. To think otherwise is futile. I have never aimed a personal firearm at anyone. I was almost mugged once; opened my jacket, they saw my pistol; end of incident. Would I have used it? I dont know. But, if I did, would I be labelled a criminal? here in MA, probably. They would have done a sob story on him, then go through my life; all my firearms training, etc, and told me I should have known better. Skewed judgement again.
Ok, I am off the soapbox now.

**-J�ker-** · 10-27-2002, 02:27 PM

the documentary has good points but i feal like its bashing white southern men (like myself) that really offends me it basically puts down the US and thats isnt right... our right as US citizens (well one of many) is to 'bear arms' that means anything from a knife to a firearm atleast legal ones... and out of all the legal guns owned i bet not even half of them are the ones used to kill like oldsoldier said.... and i just thought of this.... why didnt it list countries in the middle east that have the 'cival wars' goin on how the violence there? yea got the movie there.... i mean there could be like 200 ppl a day getting killed there but no the movie has to pick on us..... like so many ppl and countries do.... it still has a few good points but some of its facts dont show the WHOLE truth

**Restola** · 10-27-2002, 03:06 PM

it basically puts down the US and thats isnt right...

Welcome to how liberals view the world (I'm not talking about normal democrats, I mean true left-wing nuts, environmentalist groups, the Green party, etc).

I hate politics. Why can't I just be in charge of the world?

**Restola** · 10-27-2002, 03:07 PM

Re: ...EVERYONE should see this.

Originally posted by Chance_K_J
And remeber people, please take this all with an open mind.

Oh and I dont have an open mind when it comes to the liberal view of the world.

Sorry.

**FactsOfLife** · 10-27-2002, 03:42 PM

Michael Moore is a schmuck.

**FordPrefect** · 10-27-2002, 03:56 PM

Restola, I love your quote so much, it is in my sig!

**-J�ker-** · 10-27-2002, 04:59 PM

ok i just thought of this.... ok how many ppl have died in the US due to terrorism?! compare that # to shootings..... now who are the bad ppl? uh huh large dif. there.... yet again the US gets put down why? who knows? give people freedom they give the nation back.... nothing except BS opnions on how bad it is here when its the closest thing to a utopia on this planet it seems our presidents cant ever please everybody (i know that is imposible) but cmon the gut has on his site links to where protestsd are going on against Bush.... and this is what gets me Bush is from the south and is pro guns and is white.... mr. moore seems to dislike WHITE MEN from THE SOUTH isnt that discrimination? yes it is and in one of his little movies on his page it said descrimination was bad.... wow we habe a hipocrit..... the more i think about this the angrier i get... ok im done FOR NOW

EDIT

restola what did you mean by your post i dont have a full understanding of what a liberal is... becase i also hate politics so i dont bother to go into great detail with it

**Restola** · 10-27-2002, 05:06 PM

Something like 120 million people have been killed by their own governments this century alone.

I think the right to bear arms is a good one...

And joker, when I say "liberal" what I am describing are people who want big government (often bordering on socialism), more legislation, less rights for individuals, distribution of wealth, people who think big-buisness is destroying the world, people who say electricity was the downfall of society while staying in a 5 star hotel in an area where thousands of children die from containimated water, people who think killing a tree is as bad as killing a person.

Basicly a liberal is someone who thinks with their emotions, and not with common sense. A classic example is "lets pass a new gun law so less people die from guns." On the emotional level anyone would say "great, we'll be saving lives." But in reality all it does it prevent law-abiding people from owning guns, while any criminal still has easy access to one and now that criminal knows when he breaks into your house, he will always have the upper hand.

Thats my definition of a liberal, as I use the term in a derogatory way. The democrats on capital hill dont all fit that stereotype. Dems arent really liberals any more than republicans are conservatives (they are both nearly the same in reality).

You asked :) So there ya go.

**Jonno06** · 10-27-2002, 05:23 PM

blah..i really didnt feel like reading any of that..so I didn't..

but I think that most liberals ARE hypocrits..but then again...that is their job.
I think terrorism isnt such a problem as people think...School shooting,and other domestic problems are more important.We should stop americans from killing americans before we worry about some other 3rd country....thats just my opinion..

**-J�ker-** · 10-27-2002, 05:38 PM

yea jonno but whats more threating ONE mad man with a AK47 or a whole army with AKs? granted that one is here and the other is to poor to get here as a whole but still we need to take care of both

**FrAuStY** · 10-27-2002, 08:33 PM

Originally posted by Restola -
A classic example is "lets pass a new gun law so less people die from guns." On the emotional level anyone would say "great, we'll be saving lives." But in reality all it does it prevent law-abiding people from owning guns, while any criminal still has easy access to one and now that criminal knows when he breaks into your house, he will always have the upper hand.

AMEN! People don't understand that guns don't kill people. Criminals and STUPID people with GUNS kill people. I mean c'mon.. ever go to wal-mart? They have like 20 guns on the walls. Are THOSE guns killing anyone? NO. They're chillin. Now.. give that gun to a criminal.. yeah.. they may kill someone with it.. but is that the fault of the firearm? No, the firearm can't shoot unless someone makes it shoot.

When people lobby for gun control.. they don't realize they're lobbying for their own demise. Just as Restola stated.. it removes the guns from Law Abiding citizens, who SHOULD be able to use those in defense of their lives and property, while criminals/thugs/drug dealers/etc still get themon the black market. Whats that mean? YOU have no gun to defend your home and family when some crack head breaks in with an SKS, or pump shotgun. What can you do now? Nothing beg for your life. What could you have done? Put a bullet between his eyes.. then placed the gun on the floor.. called the authorities, explain what happened and possibly went to jail for a few days while everything gets straightened out.

I CAN'T STAND the idea of gun registration, did you know in almost every country that instated a "Firearm Registration law" withint 10 years over 95% of firearms were banned?! Wanna know how? They knew what types of guns people owned, then slowly but sureley they banned them one at a time. Until, all you're left with are 22's and muzzle loaders. Neither of which can you do any good against a criminal with a "black market" firearm... GRRRRRrRrrrr.... alright..I gotta stop..I could go onnn and onnnn and onnnnnnn.

**-J�ker-** · 10-27-2002, 08:59 PM

this fits into this pretty well its from a while back

I'm a "Bad American"--this pretty much sums it up for me. I like big trucks, big boats, big houses, and naturally pretty women. I believe the money I make belongs to me and my family; not some mid-level, government flunky with a bad comb-over who wants to give it away to the crack addicts squirting out babies. I don't care about appearing compassionate.
I think playing with toy guns doesn't make you a killer. I believe ignoring your kids and giving them Prozac might. I think I'm doing better than the homeless. I don't think being a minority makes you noble or victimized. I have the right not to be tolerant of others because they aer different, weird, or make me mad. This is my life to live and not necessarily up to others expectations. I know what SEX is and there are not varying degrees of it. I don't celebrate Kwanzaa--but if you want to, thats fine. I just don't believe everyone else should have to.
I believe that if you're selling me a Dairy Queen milkshake, a pack of cigarettes, or a motel room, that you should do it in English. As a matter-of-fact, if you are an American Citizen, you should speak English. My uncles and forefathers should not have died in vain so that you can leave the countries you were born in, come here, disrespect ours, and make us bend to your will. Get over it.
I think the cops have every right to shoot your sorry-butt if you're running from them after they told you to stop. If you can't understand the word 'freeze' or 'stop' in English, see the previous line. I don't use the lame excuse, "It's for the children," as a shield for unpopular opinions or actions. I know how to count votes and I feel much safer letting a machine, wiht no political affiliations, do a recount when needed. I nkow what lying is, and it's never based on one's definition of the word 'is'. I don't think that just becuase you weren't born in this country, you should qualify for any special loan programs, government sponsored bank loans, etc., so that you can open a hotel, 7-Eleven, trinket shop, or anything else, while the indigenouse people can't even get a decent high school education.
I didn't take the inititive to invent the internet. I thought the taco bell dog was funny. I want to bring back safe and sane fireworks. I believe no one has ever died becuase of something Ozzy, Ice-T, or Marilyn Manson sang, but that doesn't mean I want to listen to that crap from someone elses car when I'm stopped at a red light--but I respect your right to do so. I think that being a student doesn't give you any more enlightenment that someone working at a Blockbuster or Jack in the box. I don't want to eat or drink anything with the words 'light', 'lite', or 'fat-free' on the package.
Our soldiers did not go overseas to risk there lives defending out Constitution so that decades later you can tell me that it's a 'living' docuemnt, ever changing, and open to interpretation. "The guys who wrote it were light-years ahead of their time and meant what they said. Now leave that sacred parchment alone or there's going to be trouble.
I don't hate the rich, I help the poor. I know professional wrestling is fake. I believe that a self-righteous, liberal Democrat with a cause, is more dangerous that a Hell's Angel with an attitude. I want to know exactly what church the "Reverend" Jessie Jackson preaches at, and what exactly his job function is.
I own a gun, you can own a gun to, any red blooded american should be allowed to own a gun; but if you use it in crime, then you should do the time.
I think Bill Gates has the right to keep every penny he made and continue to make more. If this makes you mad feel free to invent the next operation system and put your name on the building. Ask your buddy who invented the internet to help you.
I don't believe in 'Hate Crime' legislation. Even suggesting it makes me mad. You're telling me that someone who is a minority, gay, disabled, other nationality, or otherwise different from the mainstream of this country, has more value as a human being that I do as a white male. If someone kills anyone, I'd say that's a 'Hate' crime. We don't need anymore laws! Lets enforce the ones we already have. I think turkey bacon, turkey beef, turkey fake anything sucks. I believe that it doesn't take a village to raise a child--it takes a parent with the guts to stand up to their kid spank his little butt and say, "NO!" when it's necessary to do so.
I'll admit that the only movie that ever made my cry was "Ol' Yeller." I didn't realize that Dr. Suess was a genius until I had a kid.
I will not be frowned apon or looked down upon or be kept silent becuase I have these beliefs and opinions. I thought this country allowed me that right. I will not conform or compromise just to keep from hurting somebodys feelings.
I'm neither angry or disenfranchised, no matter how desperately the maninstream media wants the world to believe otherwise. Yes, I guess by some peoples definition, I may be a "Bad American."--But that's just tough.

**Restola** · 10-27-2002, 09:08 PM

:)

**joeyjoe367** · 10-27-2002, 09:12 PM

OK... Guess who Passed TOTAL Gun registration RIght before the beginning of WW2?

HITLER

...To make the streets safer for their children.

Joker, That last post you just made pretty much sums up my Oppinions also. There might be a s discrepency here and there, but for the most part, it's about right.

If guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns. That's a Fact. You couldn't possibly disarm this nation.

...EVERYONE should see this.

...EVERYONE should see this.

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