Religion vs. Paranoia vs. Technology

[Wolfen]

Alright, before I even go any further, I don't want this to become some religious debate. No conversions or flames, please.

I was watching a program on the History Channel talking about the wonders of inventions, especially with electricity. One invention was a mechanical "computer," able to do computations. This was back around the 15th century (don't qoute me on it), and it never caught on because people thought it would make them obsolete.

Also, I don't know for sure if it was Ben Franklin or another who used his studies, created the first lightning rods. The clergy, however, denounced it, saying lightning was from God, and therefore should not be tamed or used in such a way.

Then there's the whole Galileo thing, and probably countless others over the years.

Now the question is, what would the world be like had technology had the freedom to trully develop seperate of religion and paranoia?

I think it would be one sweet place to live!

[MagmanLee]

Maybe

...I wouldn't say it'd be a great place/situation to live/be in. For one thing, religion partly gives us morals and values. We'd probally put less worth on lives than we do now. Too much technology also weakens us physically. We've evolved because of obstacles presented to us, an example of this is us moving from the trees to the ground and developing the ablilty to walk with two legs. Remeber the novel the Time Machine? Ya, I know it's fiction, but still it gives a farfeched vision of what too much unrestrained technology could do.

But I think your right in believing that religion often times limits technology.

Back in the Middle Ages the Islamic Empire was more advanced in medicine, learning, mathmatics, metalurgy, and etc. than the Europeans. But they turned to religious fundamentalism after the Mongols ravaged them and they still haven't recovered.

In Tenessee, one of the "Bible Belt States", they didn't teach evolution until 1967.

And don't forget that Georgia is considering on banning the word "evolution" and replace it with "life changes over time" because in some parts of the state, it's offensive to parents who are diehard believes of creation by God.

[TransMan]

Well just think of how much more advanced right nbow if the Dark Ages had never happened where not much of anything was created.

[sharpshooter1286]

well correct me if im wrong but wasnt the dark ages centered all around the church? how corrupt it was and stuff like that? but i have to say without the church then the world would be a pretty chaotic place right now.

[MagmanLee]

Ya your right, life during the Dark Ages was centered around the church. In many places the local bishop or other clergymen became more affluent and powerful than local kings or rulers.

A people without religion(aka Communist scum) would be a pretty harsh place to live. Take for example the USSR, look at what methods they had to employ to keep the people under control, I'm willing to bet that the lack of any form of religion had drastic effects in their mindset.

[Rooster]

Religion represents man's morallity, and technology created without regard for morality leaves us with Frankstien's monster.

[Wolfen]

You guys are correct, I forgot to add in the morality that religion introduces. Good call on that one.

[Konigballer]

all religions give man SELECTIVE morality, many horrible events in history were commited by individuals and the masses in the name of one god or another.

[Konigballer]

I dont think morality is the sole creation of religion.

I think some religions just did a better job at codifying morality for humanity by actually including morality as a fundamental aspect of their belief system.

I dont follow any religion, but I consider myself a "moral" person simply because its how I choose to live. I'm not out smoking crack somewhere or mugging people because I don't roll with JC:)

[Wolfen]

Alright, before this gets too off track and gets closed; we're not talking about religions and their morals. This thread is supposed to be about technology and certain actions that have shaped, stunted, or progressed it.

Religious morality is it's own discussion, and one that would get closed quite fast

[Jack_Dubious]

I believe that the Creators(God) greatest gift to mankind is the ability to reason. Our intellect and ability to reason is what truly sets us apart from the animals.
Religion, in particular revealed religion, asks us to suspend all thoughts of reason, and to believe in "faith". So I feel that religion is a slap in the Creators face...blasphemy if you will.
History shows that religion only serves to enslave mankind. Magmanlee brings up a very good example with the Islamics.

As for morality...morality is defined by the present society, it is changeable. e.g. What is appropiate content on TV or how we view sex, are examples of morality. What was immoral 30 years ago may be fine today.
Ethics on the other hand are always constant, and never change. Things like killing or stealing, these are always wrong, and will always be wrong.
So with those definitions I will agree that religion plays apart in "morals" but not "ethics". A group of humans raised without "religion" are still going to know that certain things are wrong.

Did you have to believe in Santa Claus so you wouldnt be naughty?

JDub

[ShortStrokeTX]

I was watching that show earlier today. Ben Franklin invented the lightning rod but the Catholic Church said that lightning was the wrath of god and that we aren't supposed to mess with the will of god, lest we piss him off and he smite us with yonder tornado hehe.

The world would be a vastly different place if the catholic church basically had never exsisted. Their purging of anything that went against their word drove the old world into a veritable stone age. Nobody dared publish or even express their ideas about how things work, lest they be killed for heresey. Witch hunts and the like went on for centuries because people weren't brough up to think freely but to be zealots. The church basically ran the known world at that time, because if you didn't do what the church wanted, BAM, you're excommincated and since every person for the most part in this time are mindless drones, people do nothing but follow the church. I mean people weren't allowed to read and write, instead the church read people the bible, or their interpretations of the bible. Some of, what could have been, the greatest minds of all time were killed off in droves by the church. If these people got their ideas out, the church might lose face infront of the illiterate masses who take everything for face value.

Oh well, sorry about the rant, it's just one of the things that's always pissed me off, even if it did happen hundreds of years ago.

[ubooze]

I doubt Franklin had anything to do with the Catholic Church. Catholics were not looked upon happily back then as they are now. It would be better to say Christianity and not Catholicism because there were many different groups back then, and not just the Catholics.

And remember, if it weren't for one religion, then there would be another religion there. So, instead of the Catholics, there would be Muslims or Jews or some other religion might have flourished. I don't recall Catholics actively killing heretics, but I do remember them excommunicating. I might be wrong on the killing. It would be rather hard one way or another for people to express ideas in a world where knowledge and education was not easily attainable to the general public.

Like I said, if it Catholics weren't there, then it would be the Muslims growing farther into Europe or maybe some Oriental religion gaining more popularity.

My best suggestion is A] People are afraid of change. B] SOmething revolutionary will scary the authorities of any governing organization C] The world couldn't be a very good place without religion.

Religion instills a value on human life. Without it, we might have had many massacres happening throughout history. I mean like TOTAL annihilation. Of course all technology wouldn't be bad, but most of it would be implemented to promote survival of the fitess, that is, killing your enemy or somehow render his assualts useless. Now of course humans could have taken a peaceful course, but I do not believe its in our instincts. One dominates the other.

Just think if humans didn't have religion. There would be few people with the morals and values instilled in them to attack unjust war and killing. Who would stand in the way of others from nuking or H-bombing the known world? Who knows if we would even be here. This is all in a highly theoretical and modern sense.

What I would see happening in the past if technology flourished unwarranted is a socciety more obsessed with bettering stuff and failing to focus on the person. I could just imagine groups of people with each having his own idea, some of them being true and others false. Basically, it would be a world based strictly on theories and hypothesis.

[Restola]

Seems like those who believe in a religion think the world would be a horrible place without it...and those who choose not to follow any religions think the world would be fine without it.

Who would have seen that comming?

[Konigballer]

ubooze, strong religious convictions or the pretense of morals has never stopped human beings from massacreing each other throughout history.

your point about nuking each other is kind of moot since strong christian "morality" and values never stopped the US government from developing and ordering the use of nuclear weapons on other people at hiroshima and nagasaki, nor did it prevent the crews of those
B-29 bombers from dropping the bombs themselves and killing thousands of men, women, and children.

I dont think religion instills a morality in people that helps quell violent human emotions towards each other. The hisory of all major religions will show that religion is actually excellent at doing just the opposite, it HELPS people justify violent action towards each other and often can be used to insight it. All organized religions impair an inherently "selective morality" in their followers anyways so I dont think we would do much worse without it.

For the record, I am not against faith in a "god" persay, I'm just not a fan of organized religions.
I also have no problem with the our use of atomic weapons in WW2.

However, I hate it when people act like just because their religion gives them a strict moral code to live by that we as a species would be lost without that religion when they only abide by that code when it suits them anyhow.