Caliing NORCAL truce with MODS!!

[cockerkiller68]

Well, I hope verything gets worked out. I know if all Norcal went to a different forum, AO would be in bad shape. I really hope the mods will take leadership now and move first. I know as a busniess leader, one of the first things you have to do is be humble. Second, you must be self sacrificial. If you're not humble, you will appear cocky, if you're not self-sacrificial, no one will follow. Please mods, lets get this taken care of in a pleasant manner. Thank you.

Jason

[Lohman446]

You know, if I owned a forum, and my mods (read "employees", don't go kidding yourselves) treated my members (read "customers") this way, I'd be rethinking their affiliation with the community. But, hey, what do I know.

Look at it from this way. To TK this forum likely represents something in his past. Depending on his affiliation with AGD (which I think is up in the air on this one) and the advantage to him of its continued success AO may or may not have anything to do with continuing business. He may just be here out of interest (the same as us) or as a kindness to us. Zupe shows little interest in AO (publically). As such, the value of the customer base that AO represents, to either of them, may be minimal. If you look at it from this way, if AO becomes a problem, an nuisance, or just plain annoying support of it may wane - and like it or not, support of members is important, but so is paying the bills.

Though, see my above statements, I do think that, regardless of who is right initially (and I still side with the mods on that one) this whole thing has tumbled so far out of hand that everyone's hands are getting dirtier and dirtier. Its time to step back from pushing (by both sides), settle down, talk, and come to some end of all of this.

The problem I see, is it is hard to set things back to status quo without setting one particularly vocal group up to look like its whining overrode a mod decision that may have very well been pursuant to the rules.
Step 1: A week, ten days of reasonable calm by N Cal (those complaining I know thats not all of you) and not looking for problems or something may be the first step to an agreement with the moderators - prove that you want to be part of a productive AO.
Step 2: Appoint a leader so that the mods are not trying to deal with everyone at once, ditto that from the mods side. If need be find a third party to help negotiations from stalling over key issues.
Step 3: Seems how this battle was fought in public be prepared to apologize in public, everyone... maybe not for starting it but for the general actions that continued and escalated it.
Work something out and lets move on....

[Eatem Alive]

I know if all Norcal went to a different forum, AO would be in bad shape.

again, i'm not trying to disassociate myself with norcal but honestly, do you really think that the loss of 20 +/- members out of 23,780 is going to make a difference?

I know as a busniess leader, one of the first things you have to do is be humble. Second, you must be self sacrificial. If you're not humble, you will appear cocky

humble wouldn't have made the statement in the first quote. it comes off as cocky to me. i think ao norcal probably looks like a bunch of whiners right about now. we need to just suck it up and move on .

[Boski51]

My 2 cents:

The members ARE the forum. Without the foundation or core of your forum (which I am not one), the forum turns into everyother forum on the net-not worth the time.

What makes AO a great forum is it's members AND it's mods.

It's good to have constructive conflict sometimes. The key is constructive not destructive. It can be hard to tell the difference sometime and thats the problem.

Proud NORCAL PB'er and AO'er.....love live BOTH!

[cockerkiller68]

again, i'm not trying to disassociate myself with norcal but honestly, do you really think that the loss of 20 +/- members out of 23,780 is going to make a difference?
humble wouldn't have made the statement in the first quote. it comes off as cocky to me. i think ao norcal probably looks like a bunch of whiners right about now. we need to just suck it up and move on .

How many of the 20 + members are VERY active on AO....ALL

How many of the 23780 are active...NOT MANY

You say it's cocky to me to call myself a business leader...do you know what I do or where I work? I didn't say I was the greatest leader in the world. However, to qualify myself to make a statement about leadership, you need to know I'm not a 16 year old that lives at home. Would you take leadership advice from a 16 year old with no life experience? I wouldn't. I would take advice from someone who has experienced the joys and sorrows of actually being a leader. Most of the time, it is NOT fun.

Hope this helps.

BTW: Please don't judge my character before you read ALL my posts on this thread.

[Blennidae]

do you really think that the loss of 20 +/- members out of 23,780 is going to make a difference?.

I would have to agree with this statement. While its true some of the banned are active and productive members, AO has a lot of just as active and productive members. It might not have the same flavor without them, but as long as AO can maintain its more mature informative nature, it will still be a worthwhile place to have your questions answered.

i think ao norcal probably looks like a bunch of whiners right about now. we need to just suck it up and move on .

While that statement probably sums up what a lot of people are feeling, I really hope the original issue (and it does not revolve entirely around a certain 13yr old) does not get swept under the rug.

I'm hoping that even with all the drama that has happened, EVERYONE will do their best to make AO the fun and informative place everyone enjoys being part of.

[Ole Unka Phil]

Hey NorCal... we don't like you guys... never have never will...


Just kidding... where did the idea come from that we were regionaly prejudiced? Someone is paranoid or something. No one here has ever looked upon each and every one of you as anything more than individuals from internet land. Seriously... never. Don't stress WHERE your from... stress WHO you are. No need for fighting amongst yourselves.

[Miscue]

All the 30 day bans have been removed - per the chief.

[bofh]

Would you take leadership advice from a 16 year old with no life experience? I wouldn't.

Hell, I hardly listen to my VP at work. What the hell do they know about hardship and work?

[Lohman446]

All the 30 day bans have been removed - per the chief.

Thats the first sign of good will in ending all of this nonsense, regardless of what started it.

Now... be productive members for a short while, a week or so, decide who your ringleader is, and try to (speaking as one group through one person rather than a bunch of annoying people) privately start a discussion with the moderators, or a single mod, to dicuss your greivances... lets not have a open forum free for all again. Please

[Eatem Alive]

BTW: Please don't judge my character before you read ALL my posts on this thread.

you need to read my quote more carefully. i said "the statement in the first quote". also, i never judged your character, i said it comes off as cocky to me.

[Blennidae]

No need for fighting amongst yourselves.

But he shot me out way too many times last NorCal AO day...

[Steelrat]

Alright, AO has now banned some of its most productive members. Everyone needs to mend relationships and move on w/o all the drama. How bout the "banned" get togther with the "mods" and talk in a civilized manner. Mods take it easy and don't get a power trip. Banned don't be jerks about the rules, just follow them. There's a reason for them. If everyone would be humble in their oppinions of themselves we would all get along better. Pride comes before the fall...how true this is!!

This forum is one of the best I've seen on the net. If it keeps going down this road however, it will become one of the worst.

How about we let the banned members deal with this themselves. And just let this subject die. The owner of the forum has made it clear exactly who he sides with in this matter, now its just up to individual members to decide if this is the sort of place they want to continue to participate in.

[Steelrat]

to keep going with something that has absolutely no bearing on anyone's lives is rediculous...this is a free forum for god's sake. i am proud to be part of ao norcal and i am not disassociating myself from them but all of this has gotten nobody nowhere and it should just end. i get the feeling that some of us think it's now cool to be banned, i personally don't. that's not how i show my support...but to each his own i guess. hate me, don't invite me, whatever...just my opinion.

Judas

[Aegis]

How about we let the banned members deal with this themselves. And just let this subject die. The owner of the forum has made it clear exactly who he sides with in this matter, now its just up to individual members to decide if this is the sort of place they want to continue to participate in.

Exactly. It's history, folks. Let's move on.