Car Audio Thread #4353494

**oneworld** · 07-11-2005, 02:25 AM

that would be a nice system.. i have 2 15 inch punches in my new eclipse..

i think i would stay away from the MTX amp tho.. my friend here puts systems in for a TON of people.. and he says do not use MTX.. its expensive and cheap quality..

just my opinion tho..

**MrWallen** · 07-11-2005, 02:40 AM

Yeah, I'm mostly looking for advice on the amp, 'cause I especially have no idea when it comes to those.

**Miscue** · 07-11-2005, 05:01 AM

Skip those subs. Get a good single sub before you get two entry level or mediocre ones. You do not need two subs unless you are competing or you just have to have it... otherwise just get one. Most dual setups (which are popular with the kiddies) you see in people's cars use POS subs with cheap arse enclosure, amp, etc. that will get destroyed by a solid single sub.

Something like this is better - http://www.onlinecarstereo.com/CarAu...roductID=12513 - Audiobahn is good... as are others.

What are your goals? SPL? SQ? Your goals will determine what equipment you should get.

You might not like my opinions on car audio... but personally I think you should worry about your front stage first... subs last. Midbass comes before low end bass! Get a kick arse class-A amp for your fronts... and some Focal PolyKevlars or something along those lines.

Most of the music comes from the front stage!

**Miscue** · 07-11-2005, 05:28 AM

Originally posted by MrWallen

Yeah, I'm mostly looking for advice on the amp, 'cause I especially have no idea when it comes to those.

xTant... Mmm...

Let's put it this way. If you see a 200W amp for $500 and a 1000W amp for $250... the 200W amp is more than likely better.

Do your research on the amps - I spend more time reseaching these than the rest of the system. I replace HUs... speakers... after they wear out or something better comes out... but I don't replace amps when I change cars. I've had the same ESX-Quantums (made by ZedAudio/xTant) for a while now. If it's good today, it will be good 10 years from now as long as it still works.

Don't be fooled by the specs on an amp... there's more to it than wattage. (And there's more than one kind of wattage with different meanings) In fact, ignore the wattage entirely. The really good amps are often purposely underrated anyway... and the crappy ones do not offer clean wattage and/or are deceptively rated too high... or maybe have crappy X-Overs.

**MrWallen** · 07-11-2005, 01:21 PM

Originally posted by Miscue

Skip those subs. Get a good single sub before you get two entry level or mediocre ones. You do not need two subs unless you are competing or you just have to have it... otherwise just get one. Most dual setups (which are popular with the kiddies) you see in people's cars use POS subs with cheap arse enclosure, amp, etc. that will get destroyed by a solid single sub.

Something like this is better - http://www.onlinecarstereo.com/CarAu...roductID=12513 - Audiobahn is good... as are others.

What are your goals? SPL? SQ? Your goals will determine what equipment you should get.

You might not like my opinions on car audio... but personally I think you should worry about your front stage first... subs last. Midbass comes before low end bass! Get a kick arse class-A amp for your fronts... and some Focal PolyKevlars or something along those lines.

Most of the music comes from the front stage!

LoL, so, remember the part where I said I had a budget? Thanks for the advice on the sub though, it looks good. As for the Focals, I doubt I'll be able to use those.

I've been trying to research amps...but it's hard for some reason. I'll be needing a multi-channel amp, right? To power all the speakers and the sub?
EDIT: Also, would it be advisable for me to get a Capacitor?

**Miscue** · 07-11-2005, 03:28 PM

Originally posted by MrWallen

LoL, so, remember the part where I said I had a budget? Thanks for the advice on the sub though, it looks good. As for the Focals, I doubt I'll be able to use those.

I've been trying to research amps...but it's hard for some reason. I'll be needing a multi-channel amp, right? To power all the speakers and the sub?
EDIT: Also, would it be advisable for me to get a Capacitor?

What are your goals?

I was kidding about the Focals. But you can get some good fronts for around $250-350. You might want to see what CDT offers...

It appears that you picked out 3.5" coaxials for your front? NOOO NO NOO! That's inexcusable man! Get 6.5" unless they physically do not fit in your car !!!

Eh... if I were you, I'd do about three months of research and learning about car audio before you buy anything. Believe me, if you do that... with the new knowledge you have - you will choose something entirely different than what you might end up with the way you are going about it (and end up happier with your system). It seriously takes a while to figure out what's going on... and believe me, most of your friends or whoever you talk to probably don't really know jack about car audio... it's deceptively simple, but is actually fairly complicated to do it right.

Well... you "can" use a multi-channel amp and run everything off it... typically only budget systems are setup this way. I personally would not do this - I'd use a class-A amp (or equivalent) for your fronts, and a class-D mono amp for your sub - but then again my car audio goals may be different from yours. There are some solid 3-channel amps that were intended to be run this way, and you can bridge a 4-channel amp if you want... most of them just require the flip of a switch or button press.

Now, if you run dual subs off this multi-channel amp... tell yourself this: "I am a freakin' retard."

As for a capacitor... generally you use 0.5 Farads/500W. Don't forget your cabling and power distribution - that can cost about $100 roughly.

I personally do not agree with setting up entry-level fronts and subs for the sake of having both. Sure, you might get the whole frequency range - but it will be mediocre or crappy. Instead I would prefer to have a high end front stage with excellent mid-bass. Throwing in a sub does not make your system sound any better - it can be worse, really.

Do it right or you are wasting money!

**MrWallen** · 07-11-2005, 05:11 PM

Originally posted by Miscue

What are your goals?

I was kidding about the Focals. But you can get some good fronts for around $250-350. You might want to see what CDT offers...

Is that $250-350 for 4 speakers or for a set of 2? I'm guessing it's for a pair.

Originally posted by Miscue

It appears that you picked out 3.5" coaxials for your front? NOOO NO NOO! That's inexcusable man! Get 6.5" unless they physically do not fit in your car !!!

No, they were 6.5"s, I don't know why it said 3.5 there in the title, but under the specs it listed 6.5. I think I'm going to move up to the next level of KAPPAs.

Originally posted by Miscue

Well... you "can" use a multi-channel amp and run everything off it... typically only budget systems are setup this way. I personally would not do this - I'd use a class-A amp (or equivalent) for your fronts, and a class-D mono amp for your sub - but then again my car audio goals may be different from yours. There are some solid 3-channel amps that were intended to be run this way, and you can bridge a 4-channel amp if you want... most of them just require the flip of a switch or button press.

What is a Class-A amp versus Class-D? I've heard it mentioned before but I don't see anything about it in the specs of the amps I look at.

Originally posted by Miscue

Now, if you run dual subs off this multi-channel amp... tell yourself this: "I am a freakin' retard."

Haha, yeah, figured that part out.

Revised Setup (I know it's more than $1k, shhh):

JL Audio 12W6v2
JL Audio 500-1
Same Deck
Infinity KAPPA63.5I
Infinity KAPPA693.5I

So I need an amp for the front speakers and a capacitor.
I guess I've come to the conclusion that I'm willing to wait a little while to spend a little more.

**Miscue** · 07-11-2005, 11:21 PM

Originally posted by MrWallen

Revised Setup (I know it's more than $1k, shhh):

JL Audio 12W6v2
JL Audio 500-1
Same Deck
Infinity KAPPA63.5I
Infinity KAPPA693.5I

So I need an amp for the front speakers and a capacitor.
I guess I've come to the conclusion that I'm willing to wait a little while to spend a little more.

The stuff you picked out = much better. Thumbs up for your choice of subs. (Edit: Ha! I just remembered that... that was a sub I suggested! Except you opted for the 12" which is fine... boomier bass vs. tight bass... matter of taste) However...

You should be able to get a good mono-amp that is plenty for you... for around $250... especially since you're only pushing one driver. I think what you picked out is overkill... although probably very nice. If you're going to drop $400+ on an amp... put that into your front stage amp first.

Unfortunately there isn't a particular one that I can recommend for you at the moment, I haven't done my homework on this stuff in a while and don't know what is currently available.

Then there are those 6x9s... you 'might' want to hold off on those. Rear speakers are for... rear fill, and you are supposed to (well, I guess that depends on your perspective) fade them out so that they supply ambience... they should not stand out. You don't need anything stellar, especially for a budget system. Unless your stock rears are total garbage, my suggestion is to run your stock rears off your deck - or at least give it a shot for a while.

Also keep in mind that you have to get a sub enclosure (roughly $100 unless you get a POS... don't do this!), and cabling/power distribution (about $100).

Are you absolutely stuck on Infinity? And especially... coaxials instead of components? Infinity is okay for entry level I suppose, but I personally would not buy them (assuming that they have not substantially changed last I checked)... and especially not coaxials.

Check out the CDT Braxial CL-63's... they are very nice budget fronts. They have the advantages of components+crossover, and are easy to install like coaxials. They cost about $100 more than the Infinitys you were looking at... if you save on the rears and the amp... you have the difference covered + some extra cash for your front stage amp. There are other speakers in this price range that are better than the Infinity's you picked out... these CDTs are just a suggestion.

http://www.mmxpress.com/cdtaudio/classic.html

<img src="http://www.carstereoworld.com/Images/cd%20tech/CL-53.gif">

BTW... audition your fronts first if you can. And make sure they fit in your car!

Oh yeah... and then there's sound deadening and bass reflex pads and stuff...

$$$

Rattling is not cool!

**MrWallen** · 07-12-2005, 02:14 AM

Originally posted by Miscue

You should be able to get a good mono-amp that is plenty for you... for around $250... especially since you're only pushing one driver. I think what you picked out is overkill... although probably very nice. If you're going to drop $400+ on an amp... put that into your front stage amp first.

Yeah, I'm going to the one that's one step down from that one. I might go with the 10" as well.

Originally posted by Miscue

Also keep in mind that you have to get a sub enclosure (roughly $100 unless you get a POS... don't do this!), and cabling/power distribution (about $100).

Originally posted by Miscue

Are you absolutely stuck on Infinity? And especially... coaxials instead of components? Infinity is okay for entry level I suppose, but I personally would not buy them (assuming that they have not substantially changed last I checked)... and especially not coaxials.

Not stuck on Infinity's; I guess the site I'm looking on just doesn't have quality fronts.
It doesn't say those are coaxials, how can you tell?

How necessary is it to run my fronts off an amp at all?

**Miscue** · 07-12-2005, 07:50 AM

Originally posted by MrWallen

Yeah, I'm going to the one that's one step down from that one. I might go with the 10" as well.

Not stuck on Infinity's; I guess the site I'm looking on just doesn't have quality fronts.
It doesn't say those are coaxials, how can you tell?

How necessary is it to run my fronts off an amp at all?

10" is a good choice... tighter bass... a bit more musical... needs less power. 12" is a great choice too... just a matter of personal taste and what kind of music you listen to.

I can tell that they are coaxials because they are 2-way or 3-way speakers with the smaller ones built onto the main speaker. They also do not have a crossover = do not sound as good.

Components are significantly superior to coaxials. You just have a 6.5" driver... with no speakers attached. However, it can be more of a pain because you have to mount the tweeter somewhere. The braxials I showed you... are actually components where they hooked up a bracket to the tweeter. So, it works the same way as component speakers... but you can mount it as though it was a coaxial and do not have to worry about separately mounting the tweeter. Also comes with good crossovers. You're typically supposed to mount the tweeter as close to the 6.5" driver as you can... this solves that too.

You do not 'have' to run your fronts off an amp. Personally I think this is car audio blasphemy. You simply do not run $300 speakers off a deck - it's kind of ridiculous to do that. It's like putting a 400lb fat man on a race horse... it's just wrong, and you don't do that. Running off your deck (any deck) severely limits your fronts in both SQ and SPL... Run it off a good amp and your SQ and SPL will be way better - and you'll be making use of those $300 speakers how they were intended.

**oneworld** · 07-12-2005, 11:41 PM

nice revised system..

actually.. i would go with some punches.. talk to

whydoineedausername

he just had 2 10s installed.. they sound better then the 1,000$$$ set up...

my 15's sound better then most systems here.

**MrWallen** · 07-13-2005, 08:47 PM

Just to verify, 2005 Honda Civic Coupe VP DOES take 6.5"s and 6x9s right?

**AcemanPB** · 07-14-2005, 07:01 PM

A little thread hi-jack here

What would yall (Miscue..) suggest for a sub system? I have already replaced my headunit and front speakers, I just want to get it on the lower frequencies I know I'm missing out on. I have a budget of around 300 (I know thats not a lot). And I'm looking for good bass to COMPLIMENT my nice speakers, not drown them... any ideas ... any brands to stay away from?

**Tobe2be** · 07-18-2005, 08:15 PM

Ok just my thoughts dont do all of your system at once you will go Nucking Futs. thats what i learned get things one at a time its easier and you dont see the hit all at once. honestly i would go with a new head unit first. then get an amp. either a 4 channel or a 2 channel. on average for a GOOD amp you should be spending roughly about a buck a watt. nest if you got the 4 channel amp get one or 2 nice set of components. dont overlook this because these will make your system. i personally LOVE alpine but Diamond Audio have nice sets of components and are honestly the best bang for the buck. the Hexes keep up with the high end Focal. after you get that find some subs. here there are plenty of choices. MMats make great subs honestly the 2.5 are good enough, Diamond TDX's are great, Alpine Type X's are great, Kicker Solobarics are great.there are a few more that im missing but you get the point. If you go cheap you will have to replace it later with something better dont spend the money on somthing cheap. After all that you can go with a nice zapco eq to control everything better. yes you will spend about 2-3k overall but do it in steps and you wont regret it. Also remember to give yourself some headroom because after a month of listening to music at a certain level you will want more and it wont be loud anymore happens to me all the time. Damn i gave you a long ars story. anyways if you need help in wiring, custom work, ect... feel free to pm me.

Tobe2be

P.S if you want i can make suggestions on a full blown system for you too look at.

Car Audio Thread #4353494

Car Audio Thread #4353494

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment