law interpitation?

[skife]

Okay, i'm looking into getting a honda minitrail 50 to use as a moped.
now, michigan law says that to be classified as a moped it must have a driveline that does not require the driver to switch gears.

now, the thing is, it says "does not require" now, if you did have one of these bikes it doesn't require you to switch gears, (its got a 3-speed automatic clutch transmission)
now what gets me is, you dont have to switch gears to ride it.
what do you guys think?

[Target Practice]

Okay, i'm looking into getting a honda minitrail 50 to use as a moped.
now, michigan law says that to be classified as a moped it must have a driveline that does not require the driver to switch gears.

now, the thing is, it says "does not require" now, if you did have one of these bikes it doesn't require you to switch gears, (its got a 3-speed automatic clutch transmission)
now what gets me is, you dont have to switch gears to ride it.
what do you guys think?

No, you can't use it. It "requires" the switching of gears to operate. As such, the driver IS switching gears (by operating the moped). Just because he isn't manually switching them doesn't mean that he's not switching them at all.

That's how I see it.

[Jaan]

It seems like most states have the same very similar laws concerning mopeds. Some states word the requirement a little more clearly, like this example form Oregon:

"It is equipped with a power drive system that functions directly or automatically only and does not require clutching or shifting by the operator after the system is engaged."

That sounds to me like an automatic transmission is acceptable. Besides, many vehicles designed and sold as "mopeds" used 2 speed automatic transmissions as well.

Why don't you just get a moped (or a bicycle for that matter)? How "legal" you are depends on many factors, including what you look like and the intelligence of the harassing officer, which is often quite low. I know a lot of people who have been harassed by cops for riding bicycles legally for example, including a guy in his 40's who's an attorney specializing in bicycle law. Figure you'll be riding past a big dumb racist cop with nothing better to do but drive around all day mad at the world because he's hung like a pimple ... because you WILL be riding past that guy sooner or later. Can you convince pimple boy what you're riding is a legit moped? That's the bottom line, because the law doesn't mean a damned thing at 2am on the side of the road.

[skife]

It seems like most states have the same very similar laws concerning mopeds. Some states word the requirement a little more clearly, like this example form Oregon:

"It is equipped with a power drive system that functions directly or automatically only and does not require clutching or shifting by the operator after the system is engaged."

That sounds to me like an automatic transmission is acceptable. Besides, many vehicles designed and sold as "mopeds" used 2 speed automatic transmissions as well.

Why don't you just get a moped (or a bicycle for that matter)? How "legal" you are depends on many factors, including what you look like and the intelligence of the harassing officer, which is often quite low. I know a lot of people who have been harassed by cops for riding bicycles legally for example, including a guy in his 40's who's an attorney specializing in bicycle law. Figure you'll be riding past a big dumb racist cop with nothing better to do but drive around all day mad at the world because he's hung like a pimple ... because you WILL be riding past that guy sooner or later. Can you convince pimple boy what you're riding is a legit moped? That's the bottom line, because the law doesn't mean a damned thing at 2am on the side of the road.

i dont want a moped... just something about them looks nerdy.
just want something that rides nice and has good gas mileage that i can still hot rod on if i want to.

[Jaan]

i dont want a moped... just something about them looks nerdy.

I hate to break this to you, but you're 19 ... you're going to look just as nerdy on a mini bike as you would on a moped

just want something that rides nice and has good gas mileage that i can still hot rod on if i want to.

Why not a motorcycle? Motorcycles are good on gas, and personally I think they're WAY safer then mopeds.

[skife]

motorcycles are pretty expensive plus you need to have a motorcycle endorsement to ride one, they have to be plated and insured.

mopeds only need to have a moped sticker.

[Lohman446]

motorcycles are pretty expensive plus you need to have a motorcycle endorsement to ride one, they have to be plated and insured.

mopeds only need to have a moped sticker.

The motorcylce endorsement test is stupid simple from my understanding.

I don't think insurance is that much more assuming you already have primary vehicle insurance.

And plates are not that much if I recall.

A small motorcylce (even a 125 dirt bike or something) would be far better than looking like a geek on a 50... just my opinion

[Muzikman]

...including a guy in his 40's who's an attorney specializing in bicycle law.

What the hell is a "Bicycle Layer"? The law of a bicyle is the same as a car (atleast in PA). You are just not allowed on roads that are marked "Motor Vehicles Only". These usually are highways.

But back to the real question, what kind of cases does this guy handle?

[deathstalker]

What the hell is a "Bicycle Layer"? The law of a bicyle is the same as a car (atleast in PA). You are just not allowed on roads that are marked "Motor Vehicles Only". These usually are highways.

But back to the real question, what kind of cases does this guy handle?

My assumption is a "bicycle lawyer" specializes in cases involving bicyclists or advocates for the rights of bicyclists.

[skife]

The motorcylce endorsement test is stupid simple from my understanding.

I don't think insurance is that much more assuming you already have primary vehicle insurance.

And plates are not that much if I recall.

A small motorcylce (even a 125 dirt bike or something) would be far better than looking like a geek on a 50... just my opinion

yeah, but i used to have a honda 50 back in the day, it was the coolest bike i've ever owned.
it was like an '82. never broke down, ever.

[Jaan]

What the hell is a "Bicycle Layer"? The law of a bicyle is the same as a car (atleast in PA). You are just not allowed on roads that are marked "Motor Vehicles Only". These usually are highways.

But back to the real question, what kind of cases does this guy handle?

Well, here is his web site:

http://www.jasonandfischer.com/bikelaw.php

Here is one case involving a guy who got harassed, and arrested unlawfully, by an ignorant cop:

http://www.jasonandfischer.com/cases/rowinsky_v_police/complaint.html