** Official Level 10 Problems Thread **

[Doobie]

Keep going down in size with the carriers until it does not leak. It sounds like you are using a big carrier and the air is venting around the bolt stem.

[sliknik]

Hello,
It's been a while since I've posted, but I just recently recieved my level ten. I first installed it with 2.0 carrier, 2 shims and long spring. It leaked bad. So I put in the 1.5 carrier and it didn't leak, but it wouldn't shoot either. I decided maybe it was the spring, so I went down to the medium spring and it leaked down the barrel, and still wouldn't shoot. I will keep trying different combos but I just thought that maybe someone has had the same problem, can offer advice and save me some time and air. Thanx

BlackVCG: Are you turning up the velocity to get it to shoot with the longer springs? You have to turn it up at least one to two full turns to get it working with the long gray springs.

[Gijim]

strange problem

I can't seem to fire the mag when the barrel is on but if I take off the barrel the mag fires fine. I tried different springs but that hasn't helped then I checked to see if the bolt is too tight in the barrel but it fits fine outside of the gun. I'm stumped why the bolt seems to get stuck on the barrel. Need some serious help, thanks. Setup is old valve in a minimag with 1.0 carrier and currently long spring.

[sliknik]

Well I got it working, thanks blackVCG. Kind of weird though I am having the exact same problem as Gijim. It shoots great with the barrel off. When the barrel is on though, it seems as if the barrel is in the way of the bolt. What should I do???

Oh by the way I am using the 1.0 carrier, 2 shims, and the long spring.

BlackVCG: What kind of barrel are you using? I've seen this problem happen with a 32 Degrees Carbon Fiber barrel. It can happen with any barrel if it's drilled off center.

[tylerdurden1803]

Re: leakin

Originally posted by tylerdurden1803
Just installed my Level 10 and I've gotta problem. I've got the middle spring in with two shims in and the carrier with 3 rings, NO dots. When I turn the air on (Maxflow), it will leak(not alot, not a little) then when I pull the trigger it shoots but then it starts leaking ALOT. Any suggestions? Thanks for any replies.

BlackVCG: Using the same white carrier o-ring put it in the 2.5 spacer (Two rings and three dots) and try that. Put the o-ring on the carrier and slide it onto the bolt stem to get a feel for the fit of the o-ring on the stem. It should be fairly snug. If it leaks no matter what carrier you use, remove shims until it stops leaking.

I did as you said and now its leakin out the back. It was leakin from the front a little too. Take shims out? Change carrier? I took out one shim already so theres only one in there. Thanks for any replies.

BlackVCG: Okay, so you went to the 2.5 carrier right? If it started leaking out the back then turn it down to the point that it stops leaking and check the velocity. Be sure to fire it a few times while you're turning down the velocity. If you can't get the velocity you want and it's not leaking down the barrel, then get a new piston and it will be fine.

[grEnAlEins]

installing

ok, i posted this on tech, but i doin it here to. there is metal in my power tube, it looks like a washer, but i cant get it out. it is about 1/2 inch down the tube. it is not the spacer, or spring, i took those out. is this thing suposed to stay in?

BlackVCG: Yes, that's a washer that is part of the PT and is suppose to be in there to keep the o-ring from being shoved all the way down in. With LVL 10 it keeps the white washer from dropping down into the air chamber.

[Magaholic]

Intermittent issue

Hello all,

I've been running Lvl 10 in my 'mag for about a month now. I've put somewhere in the neighborhood of 3 cases through it in that time, playing woodsball. I've scanned most of this thread and I didn't see anyone else having the same issue as I seem to be encounterring.

Setup: 68 classic with standard valve. 2.0 carrier, middle spring, 3 shims. 'Mag is running on HPA and shooting around 280 FPS with this configuration. I'm running a J&J ceramic for larger bore paints (mine seems to have about the same bore size as a crown point barrel) and a Lapco Autospirit or Bigshot for smaller bore paints. As for oiling the valve, I put in 5-6 drops before every day of play.

Problem: During my initial setup of lvl 10, I installed the 1.5 carrier, middle spring and 2 shims. This seemed to work fine...for a bit...At some point, I started shooting small bore paint thru the J&J. Actually, it was mixed bore paint...some small, some medium. Occassionally, the marker would act as though it had pinched a ball, giving the 'pfffttt' sound and resting. After it reset, however, I could not get the thing to actually fire...It would just vent and reset. Pulling the barrel off revealed it had actually pushed 2 balls into the barrel. After clearing the barrel of balls, most times, I could get the marker to fire again but sometimes it would just vent/reset, even when there wasn't an extra ball in the barrel. So I'm thinking to myself, "Ok, I guess we'll just make sure we have proper barrel/paint match at all times." As it turns out, I still have this problem intermittently, even when running with a decent barrel/paint match. It seems to happen later in the day, after about 1/2 case of shooting, rather than early in the morning/at start of play.

Things I've tried: Since it would still vent/reset at inappropriate times, I tried to tune in my lvl 10 a little better. I first switched to the shortest spring. This seemed to work at first, but later in the day, I had the same problem. The next thing I tried was adding a shim since I had read that adding shims causes the bolt to vent earlier on in the cycle. I figured that might cause the bolt to vent and not push 2 balls into the barrel. This didn't seem to help with the middle or the short springs. Just recently, I moved to the 2.0 carrier from the 1.5 carrier. The 2.0 doesn't leak, so I figured I'd have reduced friction, making things run a little smoother. I haven't tried the 2.0 carrier with the short spring but when used with the middle spring, I made it thru most of the day yesterday without any problems...I did, however, loan my 'mag out to a friend at the end of the day and it started acting up again. This time it was with an Autospirit barrel running Blaze paint. This leads me to believe that it is not a problem with a specific barrel, i.e. the J&J. I've also read that some people are having problems getting their 'mags to fire at the chrono due to loose barrels. When I was cleaning my 'mag after yesterday's outing, I did tighten the twist lock assembly slightly. My barrels fit slightly more tightly now. I didn't, however, consider the play they had before to be excessive. I have not had a chance to play since I screwed in the twist lock, so I'm not sure if that solved the problem.

Does anyone have any ideas on what the issue is? I'm sure I've missed something obvious...

Thanks for the help!

[BlackVCG]

Magaholic-

Thanks for the detailed information. It really helps me to figure out your problem.

The first thing I noticed is that all of your barrels are a bit on the small side. The JJ Ceramic usually runs about .687" and the Autospirits are about .686-7". I know you said the JJ seems to be the size of a Crownpoint, but have you actually measured the bore? Try sliding the bolt into the barrel. If you feel resistance, you need to smooth out the tip of the bolt since it's a bit oversized to prevent blowback.

If you have dial calipers, measure the distance from the tip of the bolt to the stem sticking out the back of the valve. The overall length should be 2.010".

Also, what kind of gripframe are you using on the gun and what is your input pressure?

Just give me that info and I should be able to figure out the problem for you.

[Magaholic]

More info

I will check the bolt/barrel fit when I can.

As for the other info, I'm using an intelliframe (blade) and for air, I've got a 45ci/4500 ACI bulldog II with 800psi fixed output pressure.

As for actually measuring the bore of my barrels...I haven't done that. (And I'm pretty sure I don't have access to the proper tools to do it.) I do know the paint that fits the J&J nicely (properly) also fits the crown point nicely. That's why I feel they are about the same size. As for the Autospirit...I haven't used that barrel much since I picked it up. I've been running the Bigshot primarily since the paint I've been using was a little big for the Autospirit.

Thanks again and I'll post later with the bolt/barrel fit...

[Magaholic]

Bolt/barrel fit and bolt length

I checked the length of the bolt and it is indeed 2.010".

The bolt slid easily, without any resistance, into the J&J ceramic barrel. When I tried the Autospirit, I did feel a surprising amount of resistance. My question is, then:

If I need to sand down the tip of the bolt slightly, what is the best way to go about doing that?

Your help is very much appreciated!

[BlackVCG]

Don't use your Autospirit unless you sand down the outer casing of the bolt up towards the tip. You'll see the seam about 1/4" back from the tip and just in front of the seam you'll see the bolt is has a slightly raised area. Sand down that part all around the circumference of the bolt to reduce the O.D. and make it fit your AS better.

I'll bet your problem was due to having too tight of a carrier and it worked better when you switched it out, but since it was in the Autospirit when you made the switch, it still had a problem with the bore being too tight.

Also, what kind of oil are you using?

[Magaholic]

I'm currently using Gold Cup oil. I'll take a look at sanding the bolt down a little before I use the Autospirit again. (Shouldn't be for a few weeks, anyway....The paint I have now is too large for the Autospirit and it'll take some time to use it up...)

Thanks for all the help!

[BlackVCG]

Try using the blue KC Oil if you can get it. With a high performance setup like LX, you really can see the benefit from using a high performance oil like KC.

[ogre55]

Originally posted by BlackVCG
Try using the blue KC Oil if you can get it. With a high performance setup like LX, you really can see the benefit from using a high performance oil like KC.

I'm surprised you would reccomend KC Oil when AGD's own Autolube is just Gold Cup repackaged.

Ogre

[BlackVCG]

I'm well aware of that. Just because AGD puts it with there guns doesn't mean I like it or it's actually a good oil. The way I see it, it's a decent oil, but it drys out o-rings and discolors them. KC is the superior oil. RobAGD and I both use nothing but KC and I know Rob has yet to replace any o-rings in his RT, which he's had since 1996. We're working on getting Tom to switch to KC oils, but there is a big price difference.