Imagine how great it would be...

[tech-chan]

If we are going to change something, how about we make the technology work for the game, and not against it.

So what if a series came out, or a rule put in place that took advantage of bluetooth technology.

Let us say there was a secure encrypted frequency that the markers worked on for each individual player on the field.

Let us say, just for the sake of argument, that there were enough refs, or some other way to watch each individual player, or to be able to tell proof positive that they had in fact been hit and marked with paint. No, I do not have the answer for that, but work with me here.

So let us suppose that we knew for fact, w/o even having to question that player 2 on side B had been hit and through the bluetooth the marker in his hand was turned off.

Now obviously there would be a bit of thought and planning in how to implement such an idea, but the technology is there. It is absolutely possible to make it happen. Can't cheat if you can't fire any more.

So what happens when it bounces?

[punkncat]

So what happens when it bounces?

I am not pretending I have all the answers or all the bugs worked out. It is an idea. It is a doable idea. Things like that would have to be thought about and worked on.

[tech-chan]

I am not pretending I have all the answers or all the bugs worked out. It is an idea. It is a doable idea. Things like that would have to be thought about and worked on.

Yes, but it would cost so much more money than just playing paintball the way it was intended. For fun.

[michbich]

How about a suit that reacts with paint. When paint splatter is senced on the suit, fire works go off.

Ok, forget the fireworks. But paint sensitive material isn't that far fetched though.

[BigEvil]

What advantage do you see to the players, when you tell paint suppliers and promoters that you are going to cut their profit substancially by limiting paint?

I thought that pro paintball was a showcase for paintball companies to market their products? The profits should not specifically be coming directly from tournament play, but indirectly from the marketing and publicity aspects.

We have already seen what a very small cut in cap did for paint price. Then you cut that number down even more?

I see higher prices for paint, and another way to push people out of the game in general.

I think that might be a coincidence with nationwide inflation and price increases due to a variety or marketing forces, most directly the increased cost of fuel which needed to be passed down to consumers.

My thoughts are that if the ramping, high ROF games are a problem for so many, and if limited paint is such a good idea...where is the series that supports it?

That is a great question. The game has gone directly in the opposite direction. Maybe it will be possible to reverse that trend the worst the financial situation in the game gets. "Maybe"

I have seen two recent series fail. One was limited tech, which allowed only mech markers, and the other was a limited paint series. No one showed up to play them, and they fell flat on their face.

Most players who are drawn to the limited paint, mech only games are largely rec ballers who would not normally play tournaments anyhow. Most of these people are repelled by the very idea of tournament ball. On the other side, most tournament players would not want to play a limited paint or mech game either. What was the incentive to play? Were there big prizes? The format will change when the industry leaders and event promoters say so. Then it will trickle down to the local level.

I see once again a prime example of people talking about things that sound nice in theory, but simply not knowing what they really want, and proving it through lack of support.

We are not ever going to be able to go back to the way things were. Fast markers are here. The face of the game has been changed forever. We can all sit and look through our rose colored glasses and wish wish wish for things to be like they were in the golden days, and watch that green grass grow......

Exactly. The big mistake is thinking that the change will come from the top. It will not. It must come from the bottom and work its way up. The types of changes that must be made need to focus on making the game fun again for new players. The list is long, so I wont reiterate it.

[punkncat]

Dang Big E.....there are a lot of points to make in that "argument".

I am not sure that I wish to get into all that, one because it would be very detail oriented, and two just cause I am a guy who only has a small piece of the picture. I do not want to put myslef in a position where I could be picked apart about some many things that for me and many others here is merely speculation.

There are obviously a lot of factors that have brought us to the place we are in the sport. If I had all the answers I sure would not be sharing my ideas with all of you to make happen, lol.

This is all just my two cents. If any, all, or none of it applies so be it.

[Lohman446]

Are we discussing tournament format or rec format. To me we too often intertwine the two. There should be some difference - consider the differences between "tournament (pro / college / HS)" football and the recreational back yard thing we play.

Somehow some paintball players seem to exhibit a thought process that all paintball should be played on tournament level / rules / intensity, even when playing rec ball.

PS - bounces would count in the "vest (or whatever)" scenario - a failure to break is not a failure of the player to achieve the objective, its a failure of the equipment to deliver

[tech-chan]

PS - bounces would count in the "vest (or whatever)" scenario - a failure to break is not a failure of the player to achieve the objective, its a failure of the equipment to deliver

Your right. Sorry, I was nitpicking.

[AGD]

Guys,

First off I am not saying limit the paint. Make the paint UNLIMITED and now you have to decide how much your going to pony out onto the field. The more gas you have to haul, the slower you go etc.

Punkncat, old slow guys (like you AND me) are not competitive in this game at the tournament level. If you want a good show it has to be athletic. BUT to address your concern, here is what you can do. Reduce the velocity and lengthen the field so the balls barely if at all make the other end of the field. Now you have a partially safe area at the back to "move in the backfield" like in football.

The game is stale. You have to come up with something else players will get excited about. Shooting less is just not fun. Moving less is not fun. Interesting strategy that's different every game is fun. How boring would football be if every play was the long bomb? Thats what we have in paintball right now.

AGD

[Lohman446]

The game is stale. You have to come up with something else players will get excited about. Interesting strategy that's different every game is fun. How boring would football be if every play was the long bomb? Thats what we have in paintball right now.

I misread what you wrote on the limited paint - my bad. I agree with this point though, and think that limited paint may be one way to get there...

Regardless though most anything that involves moving is going to, in some way, favor the more athletic. While I agree with the idea of inclusion even playing a back stand up favors the person who can run the 40 in four seconds flat, it allows them to lane longer or to get there and shut down a lane quicker. Most people can do something about it, others are limited more through fate.

[punkncat]

I am not trying to be argumenative just for the sake of arguing, but I am not really sure I agree with you. That is one of the good things about having such a place to come and express what are opinions and attitudes.

The modern game IMO is fun and exciting. There is a lot more to it that just spraying and praying. The fact that every position on the field is in danger right from the start only adds to the excitement to me. However, I have not played competative ball outside what is very similar to the current format. I really may not know what I am missing, and therefore can only trust you on that one. You have been there, and perhaps as compared the modern day may be lacking.
And I hate to overuse a term, but are you sure that it is not just the golden memory that makes it seem like it was so much better?

I think older guys can be quite competative, and bring a lot to the sport. The experience we bring to the field, our calm during the storm, and other refined abilities allow us to play smarter and not harder. Now it is important to know your limitations. I am not going to go toe to toe in the snake with some youngin, but at the same time I love the challenge when one of them thinks I am going to be some easy target to come bunker as well. I love to watch them walk off the field dripping with my paint for their effort. What we lack in physical ability can be made up for many times in craftyness.

Like I said before, I do not have the answers only my opinion. And we all know what they are good for.

It is good to discuss with you Tom.

[AGD]

These types of arguments are a good thing. It gets all the cards on the table. No offense taken!

AGD

[BigEvil]

Let me do a partial thread-jack here -

IF you were to own and operate your own field, how would you do it, what would your rules be and why.

What types of fields would you want?

How would your establishment stand out as being 'better' than the next. How would you promote the growth of the game?

Ect, ect.

[Lohman446]

Let me do a partial thread-jack here -

IF you were to own and operate your own field, how would you do it, what would your rules be and why.

What types of fields would you want?

How would your establishment stand out as being 'better' than the next. How would you promote the growth of the game?

Ect, ect.

Good questions and an interesting slant to the idea. That being said what are my ROI figure goals. Am I looking for reasonable return on investment or am I going for as much profit as possible? Am I self financed or are there loans to consider? I remember reading some early articles about paintball thst spoke of the great business opportunities of owning a field - it appears, for the most part, they were wrong.

That being said I would niche things off and try to offer something different than others. Be it through modified tournaments, random draw tournaments, etc. I would not simply be another NPPL / PSP wannabe in regards to tournaments.

Ideally I would be looking for a relatively large wooded area for woodsball in addition to parking / speedball fields and an indoor arena (needed in the winter). I would likely get rid of the sponsored team idea and trade "memberships" for paint. I would consider highly forming a "club", and requiring membership (work days + yearly dues + field paint (a lot like many gun clubs)) with members being able to invite others and take responsibility for them.

[BigEvil]

Good questions and an interesting slant to the idea. That being said what are my ROI figure goals. Am I looking for reasonable return on investment or am I going for as much profit as possible? Am I self financed or are there loans to consider? I remember reading some early articles about paintball thst spoke of the great business opportunities of owning a field - it appears, for the most part, they were wrong.

That being said I would niche things off and try to offer something different than others. Be it through modified tournaments, random draw tournaments, etc. I would not simply be another NPPL / PSP wannabe in regards to tournaments.

Ideally I would be looking for a relatively large wooded area for woodsball in addition to parking / speedball fields and an indoor arena (needed in the winter). I would likely get rid of the sponsored team idea and trade "memberships" for paint. I would consider highly forming a "club", and requiring membership (work days + yearly dues + field paint (a lot like many gun clubs)) with members being able to invite others and take responsibility for them.

All good and valid thoughts. What about gaining and keeping new customers?