Why do people think paintball is dead or dying?

[chafnerjr]

Alright... every few months I keep seeing threads talking about what killed paintball... or why paintball is dying. I hear everything from high ROF markers, to cheating, to SMART Parts killed the radio star. Lack of NPPL or other such organization (adoption rate). I just don't get the idea... paintball is alive and strong. No it's not organized... it never was! "Back in the day" to me means me, my family and friends out in the woods... Screw having a governing body, we made it all up as we went. We covered all of our own reffing and the like and boy oh boy we played from 9am until we couldn't see any more every single weekend! Still can if we want to, but we play at local fields now.

Now I've played at many other fields that I have either liked or not... (mostly not) and seen plenty of paintball stores go out of business. (They tend not to last very long generally, depending on the area). But this has ALWAYS been the case. So here's the question... is it just that the ideal field or the ideal day of paintball has alluded some? Seriously there are more fields, markers, masks, etc. now-a-days then ever before. I guess that I just don't understand. Can you all help me here?

[afortuna]

Cost of paint and accessibility to a field for the occassional player.

[Miltonyz]

Paint is cheaper then it's ever been. At my local field RPS Stinger is 45 a case. Ask some of the old guys how much they paid for paint back in the day.

[JMD00]

To respond to Miltonyz's post, when I first started playing(almost 20 years ago), paint was $120 a case and the quality was usable at best and more usually it was bad(not round, varying size, and the seams were horrendous).

[chafnerjr]

Paint is cheaper then it's ever been. At my local field RPS Stinger is 45 a case. Ask some of the old guys how much they paid for paint back in the day.

I used to pay $40/case right from Taso in '97 and I pay $55/case now with a $10 discount from the field... byop days are back around $40/case. (I wish my field had marballizer... my favorite!) they run RPS something or other. I was running some cheap killer beez last season that played out pretty well.

Was everyone getting jacked back in the day?

[Zone Drifter]

chafnerjr, I think the only reason people say it's dying is because they don't want to spend money on it. I play with a team, and half of them play all the time while the other half just kinda show up when they feel like it, just them living their own lives taking the reigns. I've met you before actually, at Fox 4. At that time nobody wanted to play because of money, but i said screw it and went, knowing i'd meet some cool people there. (gotta love mag toters) My choice of paint that day was my undoing, so i left early, but I totally had fun with you guys.

We play in the woods all the time, and with any kind of gun from a Sheridan to the Ions. I think paintball is getting stronger, and I've even gotten a couple guys in my school into it.

[chafnerjr]

Alright... so paint is cheaper now-a-days. That's a good thing right? We're not trying to be elitist right? I'm still trying to understand the paintball is dead/dying theories. Know what I mean. I think it's doing great@!

[dave p]

it is dieing, and the sooner the better.

and there are less guns available than ever, not more. you can get a tippman, dye, smartparts, some K2 wgp crap or some chinese made POS. unless you want to go used.

people have had enough, of the high prices, the high stakes B.S., and the big business side of paintball. as soon as it collapses, we will start seeing:

american pb manufacturers again, who are small, and care.
small fields that are cool to play at
the game will go back to having fun instead of making money, it will be grass roots again, and sustain itself for the sake of playing. not competing. the way it used to be.

guaranteed, as soon as paintball stops becoming profitable, all the conglomerates like K2 will drop it like a hot potatoe.
and maybe smartparts will dissapear as well.

hopefully it will become too expensive for 13 y.o. kids moms to bankroll.
that means:
all the fashion crap will go away
the immaturity will decrease
maybe used gear prices will go back up
it will go back to being an adult game, like it used to be


please, please let it DIE
then all the front runners will go away. GOOD RIDDANCE

[Miltonyz]

and there are less guns available than ever, not more. you can get a tippman, dye, smartparts, some K2 wgp crap or some chinese made POS. unless you want to go used.

I think we tend to look at the past days of paintball with rose colored lenses. To say that there is less variety then ever would be wrong. In the days of the mechs there were to main tourny guns the autococker in all it's variations, and the mag. Now you can choose from a larger variety.

people have had enough, of the high prices, the high stakes B.S., and the big business side of paintball. as soon as it collapses,

1. prices are low for paint, and you can get good reliable guns for cheap if you want if you don't need to buy the newest gear. Pick up a couple years old DM or Ego they will have everything you need or could want at a substantial discount. Or you can find used Mini's on the nation for 200 bucks.

2. It's silly to complain about high prices and then want to get rid of big business. Big business is what makes things cheap. Economies of scale is why you can buy an orange shipped from Florida for a buck. And the fact they want to be in paintball is a good sign. It means that the consumer base is large enough to attract such business. I'm glad 13 year old kids play paintball. The sport isn't going to grow if we don't attract new people. 13 year old kids can be dorks and rough to deal with, but at their age they are moldable. It's up to us to provide an example to these kids. It's amazing how much positive feedback you can get by simply being nice to people, and helping them. While at the same time setting boundaries about what sort of behavior is acceptable. Sitting 50 yards away kvetching about how kids these days have no respect helps no one.

[dave p]

2. It's silly to complain about high prices and then want to get rid of big business. Big business is what makes things cheap. Economies of scale is why you can buy an orange shipped from Florida for a buck. And the fact they want to be in paintball is a good sign. It means that the consumer base is large enough to attract such business. I'm glad 13 year old kids play paintball. The sport isn't going to grow if we don't attract new people. 13 year old kids can be dorks and rough to deal with, but at their age they are moldable. It's up to us to provide an example to these kids. It's amazing how much positive feedback you can get by simply being nice to people, and helping them. While at the same time setting boundaries about what sort of behavior is acceptable. Sitting 50 yards away kvetching about how kids these days have no respect helps no one.

big business is what makes things suck quality wise also. big business doesnt care if you live or die, someone will buy their cheap crap.

im not complaining about high prices. i want kids priced out of the game, plain and simple.

and there is a difference between rose colored glasses and reality.

one of us here sees the reality.

[chafnerjr]

I see a lot of opinions on how the game should be played, who should be allowed, what should be supported... but that has always been the individual preference of the player, and it has always been as varied. That's why there are different fields, and home pick up woods games. Maybe the real question is whether or not pro play is dying, but that's not what really what I mean. Are people not lining up in droves to play? I see players everywhere in my area (New England / NH, ME, MA). Is anyone seeing the opposite? Are whole area drying up? Is it being looked down upon? I just can't agree with the "It's too expensive" argument simply because it isn't... well at least in the US.

[Miltonyz]

big business is what makes things suck quality wise also. big business doesnt care if you live or die, someone will buy their cheap crap.

Big business doesn't decide what to make, the consumer decides. If the consumer wants price over quality business supplies that. If they want quality over price then it will make quality products. You can see that in the spectrum of products offered. You can get cheap low-quality spyders or very expensive but quality Dye guns. Or from what I've read the Mini is a quality gun and cheap.
I would have to ask you when quality was better then it was now. Was it when we all shot autocockers that we pumped tons of money into and had to time. Or mags which are very quality but many shoddy upgrades were sold to us.

im not complaining about high prices. i want kids priced out of the game, plain and simple.

Awesome, then in twenty years paintball will really die.

[dave p]

Or mags which are very quality but many shoddy upgrades were sold to us.



Awesome, then in twenty years paintball will really die.

because quality wasnt enough obviously, you can blame that on ignorance.once AGD started taking the opinions of 13 y/o kids seriously, on a public forum to boot, it started going downhill for them, because no matter what they did(and it went far beyond what anyone could hope for, we got intelliframes, lvl 10 and ult. we got a company owner that would talk to his customers, subsidised upgrade programs, and no stone left unturned as far as research and facts are concerned) still, no one was satisfied, it wasnt enough. if you cant please that, then its a lost cause. no small wonder tom left. any adult would see the reality in that. the children could not. enter the ion, a cheap piece of crap, that everyone loved. and bought tons of (im sure sub grade) aftermarket upgrades for. because having it right the first time was not enough.
you are f-ing delusional.

paintball will never die, the current state of paintball hopefully will. and like a phoenix it will rise again to be something good.

[chafnerjr]

Personally I hope that the 13 year olds will never stop playing. A good ref staff and skilled players are all you need to curb the bad habits and teach them. I started playing when I was 14 (12 years ago) and played with a lot of younger kids (one of which is a ref @ OSG now). I'm sure you don't like playing with the kids in your area, but I am sure that there is a particular reason... i.e. too many people at that field? Bad ref staff? or a poor core of players.

[dark blade]

i think paintball is like a roadtrip... it started out with people in a van saying "ok, what now?" and so it just started going... and going... and going. And then it came to an exit and they all said "nah, lets keep going this way"

Then after a while of driving they got adventurous and a bit tired and said "lets turn off here and see where it takes us" so they did and then they took a rest and started driving again.

Instead of getting back on the highway they kept going on backroads and eventually got lost and didnt know exactly what to do or what was going.




Thats where paintball is now... its "lost" in my eyes. Its not dieing, it just needs to find the right path again. With all of the kids out there thinking that the better the marker the better the player its no wonder that everyone gets pissy at the field when they lose with an ego 8 or a sl8r. They instantly blame the marker and trade it off for some other "highend" and dont spend the time to learn how to play and get good sportsmanship habits.

With children growing up playing video games by themselves they dont need to learn good sportsmanship, they can swear and freak out all the time and think nothing of it.

Im not blaming the higher companies for makign highend markers, i am blaming the parents for not teaching them respect to others when playing sports and to follow the rules.

Between the little electrosuckers out there, the lack of good reffing, and the lack of good sportsmanship... it seems like paintball is dead because everyone who plays eventually gives up due to having enough of those 3 things.

Now-a-days though, for every 1 person who gives up their gear, there are 2 more joining the sport. So i wouldnt so much say that paintball is dieing as i would say that it is a short lived hobby for most. Now-a-days if someone plays paintball for more than 4 years of their life it becomes a surprise.


But paintball is not dead, its just not what it use to be... even 5 years ago when i started playing it was a totally different sport and everyone was very inviting, and now... not so much.