just picked up my first cocker!! now what?

[PissedGodzilla]

And these answers are why i came here to you good people to ask this question. thanks for the input!!! I won't touch any of the timing or change the board until I try it out to see how it is running. Many thanks to you fine folks for the info!

[PissedGodzilla]

Same here. Had 3 cockers, none of them ever worked. Though I would like a Karni some day. Sold them all for mags. We need some pics.

Pics will come as soon as it arrives!

[kwood]

i will second the get a nice tight bore barrel
other than that, dont do much because you will just mess it up
i would recommend getting a better on/off asa for them since the WGP on/offs dont bleed out air very well

but yeah keep all the stock parts for when you resell it in the future and have fun in the mean time

[runningboar]

I bought my first cocker in 92 and have been shooting one since, I also love my mags. I don't do electros but the guys over at customcockers will help you with anything you need. Chris

[Ando]

Once the timing goes. Turn it into a pump

[Frizzle Fry]

i would recommend getting a better on/off asa for them since the WGP on/offs dont bleed out air very well

They tend to blow that stupid little O-ring on the pin assembly... Good call.

[garbageman705]

Nail polish wedgits.

[Destructo6]

There are some excellent cocker tuning guides on the net. With such a guide, I took my clicking mess of a pre-1995 cocker and tuned it into the most reliable muppet mower around. I still have and use it often.

Then, I ebay'd a boatload of parts and built a sweet post-2000 cocker, which I later electro'd (kinda wish I'd left it mech).

Really, don't be afraid of all the adjustments. Each does one thing and knowing in what order they should be adjusted makes logic and order out of what once appeared to be black magic.

That's when the fun of tuning for perfection begins.

[Hexis]

The first thing I did was take my Orracle apart down to individual parts. Didn't remove the valve since I didn't have that tool. Then figured out how it all worked and put it back together. Best way to learn about a cocker. Just make sure you have another gun ready if you need to play, that way you are not rushed to put it back together.

[Newt]

Sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

[nerobro]

wooow. What a reaction.

First off, it's an e-cocker, so timing isn't really an issue. As per usual, do not just "upgrade" unless there's a reason to. what do you think needs upgrading? and what do you imagine the benifits will be?

Now on the timing thing... Just to put it in perspective, mags have timing too. and mags can get out of time.

Timing a cocker is easy. However if you don't know exactly what is wrong, don't try fixing it. They aren't even hard to time. :-)

[Frizzle Fry]

First off, it's an e-cocker, so timing isn't really an issue.

No? You still have to set the dwell and calibrate the ram and adjust the LPR accordingly.

As per usual, do not just "upgrade" unless there's a reason to. what do you think needs upgrading? and what do you imagine the benifits will be?

People have been VERY clear about the benefits...

A tight bore barrel prevents rollouts with closed-bolt markers, a new board will provide modern tourney-legal modes and the option of creating your own, a new reg and LPR can offer higher recharge rates and easier adjustment, and the stock WGP on/off ASA tends to blow O-rings...

Now on the timing thing... Just to put it in perspective, mags have timing too. and mags can get out of time.

Que? Once you've got the right carrier and shim they shoot perfectly, but even with a poor match it'll still cycle and fire fine... Do you mean adjusting the sear pin is like timing a cocker? That's not really the same idea.

[nerobro]

No? You still have to set the dwell and calibrate the ram and adjust the LPR accordingly.

Calibrate the ram? You mean adjust pump rod length? Meh, it just takes the "clack" out. It doesn't change performance. And the clack means you're not abusing the bumpstops in the ram, IF you have bumpstops in your ram. Adjusting the LPR is simple. And most people with cockers shouldn't be adjusting that anyway. I liked sledges, they made for less headaches for me.

People have been VERY clear about the benefits...

really I wasn't asking you, I was trying to ask the OP. He came in asking "what should I upgrade" which is really not the way to do this sort of thing. On any gun. Ever. That's how you end up with smart boxes, expansion chambers after regulators, triple regged mags, aftermarket mag back halfs, ANS regs on ANYTHING..... I could keep going :-)

A tight bore barrel prevents rollouts with closed-bolt markers, a new board will provide modern tourney-legal modes and the option of creating your own, a new reg and LPR can offer higher recharge rates and easier adjustment, and the stock WGP on/off ASA tends to blow O-rings...

I'm apt to say most of the advice given was pretty good. Nobody has recommended regs yet. And to recommend regs, you need to get really stinking specific, as the WGP reg designs are really, really good. And given this is a cocker noob, I'd stick with the stock regs as WGP didn't miss by much.

But that still goes back to the "Hey, what do you want to upgrade for?"

Que? Once you've got the right carrier and shim they shoot perfectly, but even with a poor match it'll still cycle and fire fine... Do you mean adjusting the sear pin is like timing a cocker? That's not really the same idea.

I wasn't talking LX timing. But that's timing too. Yes, mag timing and cocker timing are not all that different. If the timing is short, the sear won't catch, or won't catch fully, if the timing is long, you make the gun easy to short stroke.

As mags get older, and the chances of a multiply annoed gun go up, the more likely you'll run into that situation. ;-)

Back to the main contentions of my post. "What's so scary about timing a cocker?" The contentions that you should just never time it. And you should give up if it malfunctions, are patently absurd.

And "what do you think needs upgrading?"

I"m just trying to keep sanity in the equation here. I've seen to many good cockers blown up by upgradeitis. or more importantly "But I think it needs X." When it really needed a new ram, or half a turn on the LPR.

Adjustable LPR's make me cry half the time. :-) Knobs are cool and all, but most of the MFG's did it right when they made their LPR's tool adjust only. It stops tools from adjusting their lprs.

I say get it running first. The only "for sure" change (i'm not gonna call it an upgrade) is a board to make it tourny legal. The rest... time will tell.

[Dayspring]

One thing I go with when I have an upgradeable marker:

Regulator - I've had REALLY good experiences with the AKA 2 Litre reg. It's an Xvalve for other guns for all intents and purposes. Why wouldn't you want something like that? I've put one on every gun I could put it on.


As for the 'cocker, getting an MQ valve made sense. I've known the inventor for years and sooner or later, he'd kidnap the gun and put one in anyway. Plus, I like the way it shoots.

I do agree with the board upgrade idea. Though, the E2/ZeroB are tourney legal for Millenium & PSP. Not sure if there are any other modes out there. If so, then the Tadao board is the way to go (i know I'm getting one.)

[randall "ace"]

i recently grabbed up a trilogy, and added a pump kit , any way to stop the roll-outs ?