Trouble with UThomas

[mostpeople]

*edit looks like thomas offered a refund, looks like it is closed.

[Smoothice]

*edit looks like thomas offered a refund, looks like it is closed.

learn to read.

[Ando]

1) Army was not expected to take a two word description of the marker (excellent condition - which is obviously relative and does not refer specifically to the anno) as his only data point. His excellent appears to be my "LNIB" - especially as it relates to a 5+ year old marker.

I believe anyone on AO, PBL, PBN, CC, TPB, MCB would expect the "excellent condition" remark to include EVERY part of the marker not just the electronics or the valve or the barrel. When giving a description, everything is lumped in the condition of the marker. I'm sorry UThomas but he asked specifics about the marker that you specifically stated was in all sorts of awesome conditions....

Anno is fantastic...It is in SWEET condition...looks almost new...but excellent with zero to very minimal scratches and scuffs

Your pics look great, at a distance . All your pics were at a distance, nothing up close and at an angle that masked the issues you had stated numerous times was not there. I wouldn't have asked about any specifics if I got the answers you gave, he was just being over cautious because like most of us, i'm 100% sure he's been burned before. What you did was unsat and he had no reason to question your answers because you gave him no reason too.

And it's more than just a 1.5x1.5 area. It goes all the way from the front of the marker to the breach to include the CF breach. I have a 15 yr old pVI Shocker that's in better shape than that X-Mag.

EDIT:

[mostpeople]

learn to read.

sweet burn! -_-

[CatoRockwell]

All arguments aside about what constitutes Excellent vs Good condition. UThomas should have immediately offered a refund minus shipping due to the miscommunication instead of having to be publicly called out.

That said, UThomas is attempting to make it right, so hopefully he and ArmyEngineer can find a way to resolve this where both parties are satisfied and this thread can hopefully be removed.

UThomas, I personally would define this as in Good Condition, I might even have gone as far to say "Function: Excellent. Cosmetic: Good" I work in an industry where customer service is #1 and we have a saying on my sales floor: Under-Promise, Over-Deliver. If you follow this mantra you will find that you are surrounded by satisfied customers. I do however, know that there are some customers that are impossible to satisfy. I don't think this is the case here though.

AE, never ever send money as a gift, I'd even go so far as to say, pay extra to make sure you don't. Any time someone wants me to send money as a gift I assume they are either going to scam me, or didn't calculate paypal fees into our agreed upon cost. Either way, I don't do it. I personally agree that I don't consider this marker to be in "Excellent condition" but I can see what the others mean by it being a used marker.

Still if I sold a marker, new or used and there was pitting from an anno job, I would let my buyer know.

I really hope the 2 of you can work this out, I think this can be done because you are both agreeing to come to the table. Hopefully you can work this out so that AE is willing to get this thread removed and move on.

One final comment, I read Beemer's post on your sale thread earlier, not knowing any of the underlying issues, and I really thought that was in poor taste. He should of just PMed you instead of publicly messing with you. Which would have pissed me off and probably made me less cooperative with the buyer. Beemer is a mod here, like a manager at any job, he needs to be careful what he says and where he says it as people will look at what he says with more weight.

[mostpeople]

Beemer is a mod here, like a manager at any job, he needs to be careful what he says and where he says it as people will look at what he says with more weight.

[zondo]

Nah...

[UThomas]

This marker has factory anno - no question.

[edit]The pics were high enough res and detailed enough that you can see my finger print on the exact area he is talking about (http://home.roadrunner.com/~thomas_m.../images/x1.JPG). These pics are in natural lighting or simulated natural lighting - aka: what the marker looks like.[edit]

Over delivery is something I definitely agree with and can appreciate. This principle is why included a surprise extra halo and level 10 parts kit. Having bought and sold a LOT of markers, I was obviously quite surprised by this situation.

Army now can certainly either sell this very nice marker (which, given the volume of requests I had after I sold it should not be an issue), return it to me at 90% of shipped price ($700; while keeping the "free" halo), or keep and enjoy it.

Thanks-

Thomas

[teufelhunden]

This marker has factory anno - no question.

Over delivery is something I definitely agree with and can appreciate. This principle is why included a surprise extra halo and level 10 parts kit. Having bought and sold a LOT of markers, I was obviously quite surprised by this situation.

Army now can certainly either sell this very nice marker (which, given the volume of requests I had after I sold it should not be an issue), return it to me at 90% of shipped price ($700; while keeping the "free" halo), or keep and enjoy it.

Thanks-

Thomas

Factory anno or not, the buyer feels that there was undisclosed damage or flaws. That alone should be enough for you.

Sending the buyer crap you don't have any use for doesn't cut it if the principal item in the transaction is not as described. Different situation totally, but you aren't going to be happy with me if I nail your girl but while in the act, I give you Cowboys/Texans/Rangers/Mavericks/UT tickets.

[UThomas]

Cowboys/Texans/Rangers/Mavericks/UT tickets

LOL! You can drop the Cowboys and UT out of the equation this season!

Not going to back and forth with everybody on this - personally I feel like you guys seeing this marker in person would add a lot of clarity and context to the discussion - but as is everybody is welcome to form their opinion even if that doesn't align with my point of view.

Cheers-

Thomas

[teufelhunden]

Cowboys/Texans/Rangers/Mavericks/UT tickets

LOL! You can drop the Cowboys and UT out of the equation this season!

Texas is a big state with lots of teams, tried to hit as many as I could, ha. FYI, link you edited into your prior post is a 404.

[UThomas]

Texas is a big state with lots of teams, tried to hit as many as I could, ha. FYI, link you edited into your prior post is a 404.

Thanks- parser put in the parenthesis in the URL. Fixed. BTW- the UT in my handle is for UTexas.

[Tunaman]

I find your offer #5 very respectable. Now lets get it cleared up ok boys? We should make it a rule around here...If you want to sell here, state your refund policy in your ad. There should be no questions asked when someone wants a refund. It is standard business practice.

[Beemer]

All arguments aside about what constitutes Excellent vs Good condition. UThomas should have immediately offered a refund minus shipping due to the miscommunication instead of having to be publicly called out.

^^^^^^^^ this

One final comment, I read Beemer's post on your sale thread earlier, not knowing any of the underlying issues, and I really thought that was in poor taste. He should of just PMed you instead of publicly messing with you. Which would have pissed me off and probably made me less cooperative with the buyer. Beemer is a mod here, like a manager at any job, he needs to be careful what he says and where he says it as people will look at what he says with more weight.

This was taken care of by both AE and myself but I guess that wasnt good enough since he made a point to post about it. I have ALL the PMs. This Thread shouldnt have even needed to be posted but he didnt want to work it out so here we are. I could say and post more about the PMs but as stated above I have to be careful

Ok you are right. My apologies. Thread removed

Hey Thomas,
I am sorry you heard about my concerns through another avenue. I did not mean for this discussion to happen that way. I contacted a well respected member about this last night to be sure I was not just being overly picky about the marker's condition. I wasn't trying to arrive at this discussion indirectly. It looks like word spread to beemer and back to you without my knowing. I would have preferred to break this to you directly without external involvement. For that I do apologize. I know it is much better to keep this private, and I did not intend to involve anyone else. I am very sorry for that.

Another from AE to me.

I am sorry for all this trouble. I hope we can hash it out like men and without any further drama.

This was not an attitude Uthomas had.

It would seem you could not work this out with ArmyEngineer.

I was hoping you would work this out. Your sale thread is now back and locked.

EDIT:

I would pay the shipping back and thats all.

[ArmyEngineer]

Thomas, thank you for coming back to the discussion. I did not want things to come to this since there are no winners in threads like these.

I appreciate your proposal, however I do not believe that a $70 plus the cost of return shipping should be my responsibility.

The tag on the box says the postage cost $22.70. Your transaction costs were nil as there were no PayPal fees.

If you are willing to refund my payment of $770, I will gladly pay for the shipping back. I am willing to accept that responsibility on account of my particular tendencies. If you have already debited my payment, please just gift the same amount back and we will call this squashed. I will request deletion of this thread and I will edit your feedback thread stating that my issue was resolved fairly. I am even willing to use an intermediary if we can agree on someone to act as one.