Cocker Accuracy

[MagmanLee]

Why do ppl think that cocker are so accurate? i never notice more accuracy of mine or any other of my friends cockers w/ the same kinda barrel as my mag. Do the fact that it was a pump and a closed bolt gun make ppl automatically think it's more accurate even when it's not? Is it because it's got 2 regs on the gun(xcluding the n2 tank reg)?

[AcemanPB]

HYPE

some of my friends are CERTIAN that autocockers shoot more accuratley than any other gun but of course they are wrong

here is what i think


pump marker closed bolt = accurate (only because with a pump marker you AIM)

autocoker closed bolt like pump so it must be accurate (yeah if you AIM)

[RT_Luver]

propaganda. if Tom wanted to sell more mags and was going to stoop to WGP's and WDP's lvl he might say something like the RT PRO was FULLY capable of firing 26bps which ISN'T tru, but would it sell the gun. YES. a log time ago the rumor was started that cocker shot farther and straighter, now I'm not a cocker fanatic and I dont keep track of everything that Bud Orr says, and to MY knowledge I dont believe he has ever straintened this rumor out and him. why, who knows. but it ISN'T TRUE and does it sell the gun more YES. I bet you that if you ask some of the ppl that JUST got cockers why they got it, they'll say 'because it shoots farther and more accurate then any other gun". I betcha

[davidb]

I have one friend who owns a Cocker. Very level-headed, and can't stand it when people give the whole "range and accuracy" spiel.

I think that it comes from people carrying over principles of firearms that simply don't apply to paintball. Does closed-bolt generally mean increased range and accuracy? Absolutely! UNLESS you're talking about paintball guns. For obvious reasons, closed bolt guns (as in... guns, not markers) generally get higher velocity than open bolt ones firing similar rounds, resulting, naturally, in more accuracy and range. Now, if you had an Automag firing at 300 fps and a Cocker at 500 fps (scary thought) then of course the myths would come true. However, the speed limit that has thankfully been placed on paintballs sets a definite range and accuracy limit that is pretty well set in stone until something drastic changes.

The same thing applies for long barrels. A long barreled gun gets higher velocity, therefore better performance.

The problem lies in the fact that people make the association directly from closed bolt to accurate, or longer barrel to accurate, forgetting the crucial third part of the equation, increased velocity.

[Brian68mag]

once at a chrono area people were seeing how high there guns could go(of course we werent playing after this lol" and a guy got his cocker up to 480 without probs.
holy cow could it shoot far.

[DarkRipper]

I'm more accurate with my cocker than I was with my emag.

Is it the gun? I dunno. I know what I shoot now though.

Doesn't mean that a cocker will shoot farther for you, but it does for me.

It's the player, guys. Shoot what you're comfortable with and skip the hype.

DR

[Evil Bob]

Guys and Gals...

Hate to bust your theories, but all markers fire from a closed bolt position whether the firing process starts from open or closed bolt.

Just like real world weapons, all fire from a closed bolt chamber position. The resulting pressure from expanding air or expanding explosives requires that the chamber be closed in order to propel the projectile toward it's intended target. If the chamber is not closed when the gas is released or the explosive detonated, will result in the energy generated to drive the projectile down the barrel being mostly wasted out the back end of the marker.

The whole open bolt/closed bolt debate has to deal with the ammount of time required to fire the marker (what's a few miliseconds anyway?) as well as accuracy issues from the bolt having to slam forward (recoil) prior to firing. Today's markers cycle so quickly that the whole open/closed bolt debate is simply pointless.

-Evil Bob

[TRIAD]

It makes you look dumb when you say things like stooping to WGP and WDP's level. This just shows how ignorant you are, thinking your gun and company are the best while everything else it crap. And open bolt and closed bolt does matter. Sure, both fire from a closed position, but there is a difference. The open bolt needs a loose bore size, the closed bolt needs a tight so the ball won't roll out when the bolt is closed and ready to fire. And, the open bolt must "slam" into the ball to fire it, which can break more balls, decrease accuracy, increased recoil, and with the open bolt, the ball detent pushes the ball against the gun, which can decrease accuracy. Now, they are both fine methods, but I would prefer a closed bolt to open bolt any day. Also, IMO, 'cockers (which of course are closed bolt), have the neatest way of firing which can make any person say "wow". Sure, you say performance is what I'm looking for, but also everyone anno's their gun or makes everything one color, so this just adds to that "neat" look.

[AcemanPB]

Originally posted by TRIAD
And, the open bolt must "slam" into the ball to fire it, which can break more balls, decrease accuracy, increased recoil, and with the open bolt, the ball detent pushes the ball against the gun, which can decrease accuracy. Now, they are both fine methods, but I would prefer a closed bolt to open bolt any day.

how does it decrease accuracy i'm confused? my physics books says same paint to barrel batch same FPS = SAME trajectoty

no flame just seeing if i'm missing something

[mykroft]

Simply put, it's very consistent out of the box, and teh configuration of the marker tricks your eye to think it's shooting flatter.

For the $$ a stock cocker is just about the most consistent marker you can buy, +/- 5fps isn't uncommon out of the box with a preset, +/- 10 with CO2.

Consistency & paint/barrel match=accuracy, as long as the player has decent aim.

[RRfireblade]

Holy Crap !

I'm getting out of here before it starts again.

Wait.......There's no difference in accuracy between open and closed bolt firing mechanisms!

(lights fuse and runs for the door)

YEEE HAAAAA ! ! ! ! ...................

[AcemanPB]

i had to run my mag off co2 once and got +/- 4 on the chrono and it was stock besides the drop foward and x chamber , i'm trying to start a flame war just saying i have yet to seen proof that closed bolt has any performance advantages

[nutz]

people can think what they want to think. i suggest reading this article. It may sway some of your views.

Overview Of Fluid Dynamics Applied To The Ballistic Characteristics

[blackmag3]

so if i take a stingray 2 and rig it to shoot in a closed bolt style it will magically shoot farther and more accurately? i don't think so. check warpig they used a stingray 2 modified to be closed bolt and it preformed the exact same as when it was open bolt. and don't go and say oh thats just a stingray it sucks to begin with. do the same with a syder or model 98 and the results will be the same.

[RRfireblade]

That article does nothing but make huge broad assumptions on everything that happens inside a marker.For instance laminar flow in a garden hose is only sustained because of continious force behind the stream which is not a function of a marker regardless of operation pressure.Also any porting or stepping of the bore will also destroy any theory of air airflow after the exit of the paintball.It's not really that complicated.I have as have others simply fired different markers with identical barrels and paint over a crono and so far have found there to be no measerable differnce in range or accuracy for a given velocity.It's not like it's a difficult test,if there was any reason to believe otherwise don't you think it would have been proven like 15 or 20 years ago?

For all dis-believers out there, go try it and come back when you have any documentable proof,I'm sure the whole paintball world will gladly pay billions a dollars to see any scientific fact to prove otherwise.

Jay.