Level 10 degassing issue?

[rudy]

I have a QD on both my mags but I and many others like our lines to be short and to the point and on my micromag. you cant get either the qd or the macroline off very easily and the pressure doenst help. I will pull a qd at 100 psi but I dont like to at 2 or 300psi and it just wont happen on several of my guns.

[Arturus]

So... havnig 150-250 psi left isn't normal?

Eh, I assumed it was since the day I bought my RT Pro. I have a SS line and a quick disconnect. It's always been louder than a little 'hiss'. I remember my first time when I pulled my quick disconnect off, and jumped at the sound of the remaining pressure being released. I think I was conditioned rather quickly after that to be extra careful everytime I take off the quickdisconnect; after lowering the pressure on the tank and dry firing my marker.

I guess I'm used to it and so not too worried about it.

What I am worried about is..

"Low and behold, my on/off pin was sticking out of the body. YIKES! I took a pen cap lid and pushed the pin back into place."

That.

[oldsoldier]

Cphilip, thats what I had to do. My first QD male adapter no longer works, because I was unaware there was that much pressure left in the line. So, I put on a second one. I got it off a couple times by wiggling it, bleeding enough air to disconnect safely. Well, just got back from my pro shop, got a 32 degrees slide check valve...works fine now. Maybe Tom should put that into the installation instructions? Something along the lines of, before beginning installation, you need to have a system to allow bleeding off of gas in the lines. A slide check valve for steel, or a regulator that you can bleed off, whatever. Hopefully, people will read these comments before installing.

[mxracer33x]

After some testing in the last hour, This is what I have found. No matter what spring I used I had pressure in the line after turning it off and firing out what I could. The pressure was proportionate to the spring used. Longer the Spring, the more pressure left in the line.

Shims made no difference in this test. The only time it didnt have any air left after a degassing, was if it had a shim leak to start with.

Without a screw in bottle I found 2 ways to relieve the pressure. Turn out the reg on my flatline till it bled off, or disconnect the quick disconnect using a little force.

I then put in my standarve classic 68 valve and tried the same thing. After turning of the air I got 5 shots and a few small sputters. (with the level 10 I got 1 and occasionally 2) But the pressure was unreadable on the gauge. Upon disconnection the quick disconnect I did get the normal..psst. but not the resounding POW that I got with the level 10.

Here is a pic of the gauge after degassing the mag with my Level 10 ReTro. And the one following is a pic of the male end of my quick disconnect after several 300-400 psi bleedings. Still functionable but not desirable.

[mxracer33x]

nipple after degassing

Notice the bumps at the right end of the nipple. The left side is smooth. When disconnecting under pressure it mars the nipple.

[cphilip]

Ok well its all workable realy. Something we have contributed to then. Sounds like a degassing slide check might be handy now.

I will say that since moving it over to the Rt Pro the level retained is lower than it was in the emag. 200 twice and 250 once. Seems also the rt pro leaks down faster than the emag. I can wait 10 minutes and it will be down to zero where as on the emag if seemed never to move but perhaps I was impatient and of course that one was like 300 or so.

Anyway I did go down to the one carrier from the 1.5 and still it is working and now I am on the middle cut spring and working waiting to try the longest one (pressure to go on down) but nothing I have done has change retention of air in the line. That seems to be gun specific.

Anyway its not a show stopper its an adjsutment to use this fine mod its great! well worth the trouble of a degas slide check it that turns out to be the best thing to do.

[FatMan]

Not jumping you here dude, but you should edit that with a short explanation of what we're looking at. I know its the male of a QD, but I don't see the damage you are talking about.

On another note, there are high-end QDs designed to not only be a QD, but to hold pressure when disconnected. They are more on the $50-$60 a set range, they are not cheap, but they are probably better built to disconnect under pressure. I've seen folks disconnect them while connected to a bottle under full pressure. They are also a little larger.

Just another data point.

FatMan

[nerobro]

This is the nature of the level 10.... in old mags all you needed was 1-200psi to pop the bolt forward. in the level 10 you need MOST of the shooting pressure psi to push the bolt forward. This is how you get the low force for the bolt... So.. either you need to pull the bolt forward to degass it, or some up with some way of dumping the gas in the lines. Hmmm how would one release spring pressure on the bolt?

And to think i used to complain about he 150 or so psi that used to be left in my mag ;-)

As for you damaging your nipple... here's the trick to that. Push on the hose so that it is no longer locking on the berrings in the quick disconnect. then you can push the ring back just like the gun was degassed, then just be carefull about backing off on the hose. :-)

[cphilip]

Well Skaline makes a degasing slide check for like $15 that is designed to degas the gun side...and since that side would be less than 400 psi should serve the purpose alright.

Interesting last thing I did was go to the longest spring in the rtpro and am getting a little bolt stick now need to play more with it but when I degassed this time it stopped at 400 psi and no amount of urging from the rod on the bolt will make it cycle one more time. So it kinda seems random in a way. But higher at lighter setting. Fortunatly the Pro will leak down in like 15 minutes or so.

[cphilip]

Yes nero it most likely is a side byproduct of the thing. Makes sense and we probably should have anticipated it. But the point that needs to be made is people need to be aware of it. And prepare for it... so...I wanted to report it. Seems now people noticed it but failed to report that. It is kind of important.

[nerobro]

I knew this would be a side effect, given that we're running a heavier spring and a smaller piston in the bolt... that just means that spring can hold the bolt shut at hight pressures. This is why I didn't report it as anything unusal.. It was a given in my mind......

This is really only a big deal for those without screw in n2 systems. if you're running a screw in n2 system, it'll clear itself. If you're running co2, it'll solve itself too.

I suppose it woudl be a good warning to put into the manual..........

[cphilip]

Originally posted by nerobro
I suppose it would be a good warning to put into the manual..........

Yep! Exactly! Least you break your on off pin learning the hard way!!!

But it's not a problem...It's an opportunity! How about some AGD level 10 slide checks!!!!!

[BlackVCG]

Re: nipple after degassing

Originally posted by mxracer33x
Notice the bumps at the right end of the nipple. The left side is smooth. When disconnecting under pressure it mars the nipple.

You get what you pay for. Cheap nickel plated QD's like that will wear out. They're too soft.

[CTG]

I have a solution that has been working for me. Use a stick squeegee's other end to push on the bolt and it will bleed off the last of the pressure.

[EnW]

Haha...CTG, you beat me to the post. That is the solution that I found to work also!
It is a bit uncustomary...but it beats taking a chance on marring your gun using a wrench to hold in your macroline fitting.