Taiwan Paintguns, some look Strangely Familiar...

[spantol]

And while I'm at it, since you brought it up, in an overcrowded labor market, what parent in their right mind would *not* send their kids to college, assuming they were financially able to do so? If the college-educated are having problems finding work, I'd imagine it'd be even harder for the degreeless to find work.

[GT]

Originally posted by Star_Base_CGI


So who has to pay for all this. Well me for one. I went to college and got a 2 year degree but now Im out of work cause companies arent hiring.

well,
a 2 year degree or the associates isn't really worth what it used to. Whay you stopped at 2 years is your own buisness however I would encourage the younger members of the board at a minimum to seek either a BS or BA in a field that they enjoy. I am not sure if I agee with the US company hiring freeze. sure the economy has slowed a bit however if you have desirable skills finidng a job in any economy isnt w/o hope.

jb

[GT]

Originally posted by spantol
And while I'm at it, since you brought it up, in an overcrowded labor market, what parent in their right mind would *not* send their kids to college, assuming they were financially able to do so? If the college-educated are having problems finding work, I'd imagine it'd be even harder for the degreeless to find work.

Please please,
dont think that a college education is only for the well endowed. There are a great deal of loans availible and the payoff from BA/BS will well exceed the investment.

jb

[WARPED1]

Personally I don't care where my gun was made.Do I care about US jobs being gone,yes.But as far as shopping made in china is fine with me.

[Star_Base_CGI]

Copywrite, patent whatever. If they can make it in Hong Kong the Chinese Government doesnt care. They can ship em here for nothing and hire CHinese slaves to make them. If the cost isnt prohibitive they can manufacture 10 Emag clones for nutten. $100, $50 DIng. Yeah it doesnt hurt anythign to go Buy one.

Except when all the jobs are gone and they cant make anything in America. Not a bicycle, shaver, Pen, microchip. AS a good Catholic I get sad when I see something made in China, like a plastic Jesus or Virgin Mary. What value does Jesus or Mary have to the CHinese peopel. To them its just $20 an hour, molding and painting Plastic Jesuss. Are we compasionate Christians.

Look its as simple as this. If all the jobs goto China there will be no jobs here.

I can get a loan for $10,000 or $20,000 but what good is it if I dont have a job to pay it off. I have enough skills I could probably teach alot of computer clases. The teachers I had were so slow ten years ago it was pathetic. Now I build My Own PCs, Design websites, graphics. Even won some design contest but it does not matter because...

There are no jobs.

They said that the American people are hurting. If we pay an extra $15 dollars for gas it could bankrupt the whole country. So we are going to war, to get cheap gas, but it wont last for long.

A $1 increase in oil prices costs Americans Hundreds of Billions of dollars.

Sometings we pay to much for, like movies or music and some things we dont want to pay for. Like cheap goods from China. I wish things would change. I have to Agree with Tom on this one.

Even though I think hes a weenie.

[WARPED1]

We can't make anything here anyway.............

[Star_Base_CGI]

Baltimore is Good at Making Welfare Babies.

[spantol]

While the statement "If all of the jobs go to China, there will be none here" looks good on paper, it's a hell of a slippery slope. One of the results of globalism has been the emigration of manufacturing jobs--it's capitalism in action, love it or hate it. Due note, though, that manufacturing jobs != all jobs. The services industry isn't doing too badly (the occasional accounting scandal not withstanding), and I can assure you that there are jobs out there. My firm's constantly hiring qualified candidates. Dust off your resume, proofread it, drop the jingoism, and start looking harder.

I won't even touch the war = oil stuff. It's too late.

Originally posted by Star_Base_CGI
Copywrite, patent whatever. If they can make it in Hong Kong the Chinese Government doesnt care. They can ship em here for nothing and hire CHinese slaves to make them. If the cost isnt prohibitive they can manufacture 10 Emag clones for nutten. $100, $50 DIng. Yeah it doesnt hurt anythign to go Buy one.

Except when all the jobs are gone and they cant make anything in America. Not a bicycle, shaver, Pen, microchip. AS a good Catholic I get sad when I see something made in China, like a plastic Jesus or Virgin Mary. What value does Jesus or Mary have to the CHinese peopel. To them its just $20 an hour, molding and painting Plastic Jesuss. Are we compasionate Christians.

Look its as simple as this. If all the jobs goto China there will be no jobs here.

I can get a loan for $10,000 or $20,000 but what good is it if I dont have a job to pay it off. I have enough skills I could probably teach alot of computer clases. The teachers I had were so slow ten years ago it was pathetic. Now I build My Own PCs, Design websites, graphics. Even won some design contest but it does not matter because...

There are no jobs.

They said that the American people are hurting. If we pay an extra $15 dollars for gas it could bankrupt the whole country. So we are going to war, to get cheap gas, but it wont last for long.

A $1 increase in oil prices costs Americans Hundreds of Billions of dollars.

Sometings we pay to much for, like movies or music and some things we dont want to pay for. Like cheap goods from China. I wish things would change. I have to Agree with Tom on this one.

Even though I think hes a weenie.

[Star_Base_CGI]

The services industry isn't doing too badly

Would you like fries with that?

And than of course people will still be buying Cadilac SUVs.

[spantol]

Well, when the world's entire services and production capacity moves to China, no one here will be able to afford those $50k+ SUVs. That'll be one less thing for you to worry about.

[Webmaster]

Yeah - Im not sure if the auto-industry is a good example. Auto imports began to take hold in the late 70s because detriot couldnt build a decent car if they had god himself came down and worked the line. If you compared quality and reliability, the new imports just totally won out over domestic cars.

And you see that today. *I* will be buying an accord in the next 6 months. Why? Because they are great, reliable cars. My mechanic laments my purchase because in his words "they dont break". I am sure I will have to upkeep my honda and it may need repairs down the line - but Honda and Toyota are the top cars in america year after year BECAUSE thier products are good! They arent even really cheap. I could definately get a US made sedan cheaper than an accord - but I am buying it for its reliability and customer satisfaction levels.

So really - the automarket, in my opinion, is an example of the best product winning. Now you may cite disadvantages in export/import trade with countries - but thats not the consumers fault. Use some of our economic muscle if we arent being treated fairly. Of course - the US car makers seem focused on making things bigger and faster - which isnt as prudent in asian and european markets - as the gas is much higher there and the streets dont lend well to H2s lumbering down them.

OK - couple more things - we need to distinguish between KNOCK OFF and FARMING OUT. The warlord markers are not KNOCKOFSS - its WGP FARMING OUT work. In the example of the Cololnial in the UK, thats an example of AGDs mag being knocked off. I am not in support of knock offs - and most time knock offs are of low quality and people can distinguish between the two.

BUT - WGP is farming out the work to be able to compete. That means I am sure some machiests out of work in the US. BUT if all of buds competitors are pumping out knock offs of equal quality - he HAS to do something to cut cost. Why? SImple - the consumer doesnt care. The whole "buy american" thing just doesnt work. People are too busy and apathetic to look for the union label or what ever. You people (er paintballers in general) piss and moan CONSTANTLY at the high cost of this sport - I dont see you spending an extra $100 on a cocker just because its an original WGP. OH sure - SOME people will - but will it be enough to make a differnce?

One last thought and thats someone who commented on "greed". I encourage you if they re-run it sometime to watch John Stossels report on "greed". While true greed isnt a good thing - the strive to be bigger and more successful is GOOD over all. For example - what if sam walton would have been happy just with one 5 and 10 store? huh? Then you wouldnt have the multibillion dollar corporation that employs and insuress millions of unskilled workers. Walmart strong arms companies to get you the best and cheapest prices - I have seen them being attributed to helping REDUCE inflation because of this. They give millinos a year to charities. Sure they have killed some small towns and "mom and pop shops" -but I think the overall benefits out wieght this. If you have a large company you hire MORE people, create more busienss from your business (contruction to build offices, the guy who fills the snack machine, air ports for business travel). Well i could go on - but I hope you just stop and consider this.

[Star_Base_CGI]

Send in the clones. Theres two clone markers and one of them is definitely a spyder knock off. One way clones get made is when factory work is outsources to CHina. They can stop production and make a clone marker on a dead factory line or old equipment.

I myself have 2 Ford Escorts. I bought a FOrd in 91. After being screwed by bad Chevys and Pontiacs, in the family. I thought I would try Ford. My Ford Got wreked and my mom bought an Escort. In 1993 I bought a used Escort GT. I could not have made a better choice. Ten years later we are driving the Same Escorts. Its not a great car but its a good car. I have 100,000 miles on each car. They are reliable, cheap to repair and built in the US. My Escort has been a good friend while I been unemployed.

My Tips to Tom, being an unemployed graduate with a two year degree is.

1.) Aquire CAD, CAM and CNC equipment so any new markers or prototypes can be made by machine.

2.) Look to people in the field who can design or refine Mags on a CAD and drafting system. Than manufacture the designs on said equipment automatically.

3.) Reduce the parts in a marker and make them interchangable, backwards and upwards compatable.

4.) Offer manufactured parts in a DIY kit or Blister pack. So that experience users can assemble it yourself. That way you have the CNCed parts and a Cad drawing or booklet for assembley.

One thing America is known for is our creativity and problem sovling ability. Theres nothing we cant do but if we accept the idea that we cant do anything, than we will continute to create problems for society like unemployment or drug problems.

Take a problem and turn it into a soulution. If it costs $200 to assemble an E Mag offering it in a parts kit offers the buyer a chance to assemble it on their own. Perhaps this person would enjoy the opportunity to get aquanted with their Gun, marker whatever.

[spantol]

An AGD-sanctioned, significantly lower-cost do-it-yourself kit would lead to too many hastily, improperly constructed mags and effectively begin to erode one of AGD's principle competitive advantages--its sterling reputation for offering the highest quality possible. A non-trivial amount of people would by the kits assuming they could handle it, botch it, and blame the manufacturer. I don't think it'd be worth the risk.

[shartley]

Originally posted by spantol
An AGD-sanctioned, significantly lower-cost do-it-yourself kit would lead to too many hastily, improperly constructed mags and effectively begin to erode one of AGD's principle competitive advantages--its sterling reputation for offering the highest quality possible. A non-trivial amount of people would by the kits assuming they could handle it, botch it, and blame the manufacturer. I don't think it'd be worth the risk.

I agree. We are not talking about Spyders here (although they are not as bad as some would like folks to believe).

[magsRus]

well that crap is about to hit the fan now