PPS Blazer Barrel = 'Elliptical Honing' ...does it work?

[Butterfingers]

Originally posted by Ityl

Thirdly, this barrel design could just make a ball exit the barrel in a more consistent fashion, therefore increasing accuracy (well technically precision).

I definately agree...

This is a question where it is not really applicable to quote high school physics eventhough it sounds cool.

The truth is we dont know. Palmers explaination is based on an assumption of paintball deformation which the photographs and docs test show is highly unlikely.

There are multitubes of explainations that could be attributed to the end result. Palmer sees the end result which is great... It works...

What if the eliptical bore effectively arrests spin in inconsistent paintballs....

What if the eliptical bore does somthing to effect consistency?

Any one of those could be a suitable explaination...

Our purpose here is to try to find out WHY it works.

The end DOES NOT always justify the means... just as the end result does not always justify the explaination.

Palmers barrels may work but the evidence shown proves to a good extent that his explaination is unlikely.

[cledford]

Originally posted by Butterfingers

Our purpose here is to try to find out WHY it works.

The end DOES NOT always justify the means... just as the end result does not always justify the explaination.

Palmers barrels may work but the evidence shown proves to a good extent that his explaination is unlikely.

I agree.

-Calvin

[GatoLoco]

correct me if i am mistaken, but mr. Kaye's tests were conducted using their brand of paintballs. I would be interested in finding out the results of using many different brands of paintballs.....

[Butterfingers]

The tests were done in a specially made precision bored GLASS barrel so that they could see inside.

AGD dosent have a special brand of paintball... except the ones used for Law enforcement. I beleive the ones used in the test were off the shelf gelatain.

[GatoLoco]

not to flame but........ i believe it was a plastic barrel using agd's special plastic balls

[FallNAngel]

Originally posted by Butterfingers
The burnouli effect as in the tippman flatline does NOT increase range and Ill tell you why...

Alright, here's what you do. Take a non-flatlined marker and shoot it level 5 feet off the ground at say... 270fps.
Now, take a flatline barrel and shoot it level 5 feet off the ground at the same speed. The flatlined marker *WILL* shoot farther.

Now if you want to argue that it's useless because you could just "lob" balls to get the same range, that's fine. But the fact of the matter is, flatline barrels *DO* make you shoot farther.

[Ripper machinist]

One thing I would like changed on docs test, would be to have some kind of cup holding the ball that pushes against the indicator. I am just curious if as the ball expands against the point of the indicator, does it bulge around the indicators point?

Jim

[Butterfingers]

Originally posted by FallNAngel


Alright, here's what you do. Take a non-flatlined marker and shoot it level 5 feet off the ground at say... 270fps.
Now, take a flatline barrel and shoot it level 5 feet off the ground at the same speed. The flatlined marker *WILL* shoot farther.

Now if you want to argue that it's useless because you could just "lob" balls to get the same range, that's fine. But the fact of the matter is, flatline barrels *DO* make you shoot farther.

Increased range and flatter trajectories are two diffrent matters. In this case...

There is an absoulte limit to how much kinetic energy a ball can cary before running out of steam.

They just come at diffrent angles.

[Butterfingers]

Originally posted by GatoLoco
not to flame but........ i believe it was a plastic barrel using agd's special plastic balls

I thought otherwise But Im not 100 percent sure...

[GatoLoco]

we should wait for tom to post in that case

[cledford]

Originally posted by GatoLoco
not to flame but........ i believe it was a plastic barrel using agd's special plastic balls

Tom produces a line of paintballs called "Perfect Circle" and they are perfectly round (unlike ALL gelatin paintballs) and made of plastic.

The only difference between them and a normal paintball is that they have less flaws (dimples, out of round, varying sizes in same lot) therefore should be more accurate them ANYTHING else there is. The only thing that could be gained by using normal paintballs (assuming he *didn't*) would be *worse* results then he posted.

-Calvin

[GatoLoco]

Originally posted by cledford


Tom produces a line of paintballs called "Perfect Circle" and they are perfectly round (unlike ALL gelatin paintballs) and made of plastic.

The only difference between them and a normal paintball is that they have less flaws (dimples, out of round, varying sizes in same lot) therefore should be more accurate them ANYTHING else there is. The only thing that could be gained by using normal paintballs (assuming he *didn't*) would be *worse* results then he posted.

-Calvin

this is all well and good, but if it is made of a different material, than it may perform differently. There is no control in this experiment, the data just shows how PLASTIC paintballs perform in flight.

[Ityl]

Originally posted by Butterfingers


Our purpose here is to try to find out WHY it works.

The end DOES NOT always justify the means... just as the end result does not always justify the explaination.

Palmers barrels may work but the evidence shown proves to a good extent that his explaination is unlikely.

My post wasn't directed to those who were trying to figure out why it works, but the ones saying that it can't work.

Also, regarding the flatline, my point was not that tilting a normal gun can give it the same range as the flatline, but that when the barrel is level, spin does affect range.

[trains are bad]

Shotguns (the firearms) use overbored barrels and choke in thier barrels. What this elliptical honing reminds me of is shotgun choke. It might work, even if it's not because of why Palmers says it does. Sounds like a good idea actually.

[BlackVCG]

Sorry, but the Bernoulli Effect really doesn't apply to the flight of paintballs since you're dealing with compressible flow. You can't account for the density changes that result with compressed air with bernoulli's because it applies to incompressible flow.

I suppose it's okay to use it as a base model for what's going on, but it gets a lot more complex than what Bernoulli's equation shows.