ecocker vs. emag

[93civiccpe]

I thought this was put to bed years ago.

Ok, I'll clarify. With enough money you can push a mag to have accuracy similar to an autococker. BUT, That emag already costs more than the e-cocker, and I would guarantee that ecocker setup would already outshoot the mag as far as accuracy is concerned. So unless he wants to pay more money to buy the emag and then invest even more on a kit to improve accuracy, then I would advise the autococker if he was concerned with accuracy. Plus, if you took the money invested in the kit I've seen claiming to raise the accuracy of mags to that of cockers, and instead invested it in the already cheaper cocker, once again the cocker would win. I'm just talking about money and functionality. I said in the first thread not to take offense. I have fired very accurate mags that had 2 different kits on them, but IN THIS CASE, that autococker will be more accurate than the mag which doesn't have a kit mentioned in its add-ons. The autococker will shoot just as fast, and costs less (and should cost even less than that as I mentioned before). But I also know that paintball is a game of personal feel. I play both guns, and I respect and enjoy them both. I'm not saying every cocker is better than every mag or vice versa. I'm just saying what I see as the better deal for this ONE situation. In my opinion the advantage I see of the emag is that it will probably play a bit tighter than the autococker. I have always hated the mag vs. cocker rivalry. Both guns are awesome in their own respect and people just need to get over it. I'm not putting down either gun, just looking at what they currently have on them and the price and giving my own conclusion as to how they would play.

Good luck with your decision. I would definitely fire each of them and try to figure out which one you like better. The feel of walking an eblade versus an emag is different, so make sure you try both and choose whichever you like best.

[mcdkid]

autocockers are more accurate

i own both, and its about even my friend. honestly, what seemed to hit the same target most to me was my old micro magwith an armson stealth.

IMO, an armson stealth is what you need for any gun if you want some great accuracy

[JoshK]

I dont have any experiance with the ebladed cocker...but I've had two mechanical ones and a hyperframed mag (have it now), and I have only had one problem ever with my mag (the solinoid screws came loose so it wouldnt fire), compared to the countless ive had with my cockers. But then again the major problems I've had with cockers is the front pnuematics, and the eblade covers that. And that back block sure is mesmerizing.

I personally would go with the emag because it is just as accurate, and fast as the cocker, plus its like two guns in one...a electro primary, and a mechanical secondary. And as far as air goes...just get a tank like a 88/4500...that will last you a long time (it lasted me 1500 shots, plus a few tinkering shots (for my stingray).

[MonsterMag]

cockers suck mags rule

Emag wins hands down

[Dayspring]

That was filled with so much BS that I'm having to put my boots on to get through it...

THERE IS NO ACCURACY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN COCKERS AND MAGS.

Paint to barrel match & consistent air source. THAT is how you get accuracy. So, would you like to show me this kit that gives the mag better accuracy? I'd LOVE to see what we've all been missing out on for years.

Ok, I'll clarify. With enough money you can push a mag to have accuracy similar to an autococker. BUT, That emag already costs more than the e-cocker, and I would guarantee that ecocker setup would already outshoot the mag as far as accuracy is concerned. So unless he wants to pay more money to buy the emag and then invest even more on a kit to improve accuracy, then I would advise the autococker if he was concerned with accuracy. Plus, if you took the money invested in the kit I've seen claiming to raise the accuracy of mags to that of cockers, and instead invested it in the already cheaper cocker, once again the cocker would win. I'm just talking about money and functionality. I said in the first thread not to take offense. I have fired very accurate mags that had 2 different kits on them, but IN THIS CASE, that autococker will be more accurate than the mag which doesn't have a kit mentioned in its add-ons. The autococker will shoot just as fast, and costs less (and should cost even less than that as I mentioned before). But I also know that paintball is a game of personal feel. I play both guns, and I respect and enjoy them both. I'm not saying every cocker is better than every mag or vice versa. I'm just saying what I see as the better deal for this ONE situation. In my opinion the advantage I see of the emag is that it will probably play a bit tighter than the autococker. I have always hated the mag vs. cocker rivalry. Both guns are awesome in their own respect and people just need to get over it. I'm not putting down either gun, just looking at what they currently have on them and the price and giving my own conclusion as to how they would play.

Good luck with your decision. I would definitely fire each of them and try to figure out which one you like better. The feel of walking an eblade versus an emag is different, so make sure you try both and choose whichever you like best.

[MonsterMag]

True that , I am gonna Quote Tom Kaye on this

"Accuracy, you get the barrel for accuracy. Thats is not our job , you go get a barrel somewere else."

http://www.airgun.com/xmag/html/AirgunDesigns_HB.asf

You put a $200 barrel kit on any marker and it will shoot great

[93civiccpe]

cockers suck mags rule

Emag wins hands down

Wow.. no one in here can be objective. I play both. I like both. I know what I've experienced with both. If an autococker is too complicated for you, I bet you own a macintosh. They don't take a rocket scientist, you just have to look at how they operate and then it is simple. And I stick with my decision... the autococker price is inflated.. get it down where it needs to be and it is a much better deal. (bunch of cocker haters... can't be neutral to save your lives... i need to sell both my mag and my cocker and go buy something like a spyder so I won't have to deal with this stupidity).

[JoshK]

Wow.. no one in here can be objective. I play both. I like both. I know what I've experienced with both. If an autococker is too complicated for you, I bet you own a macintosh. They don't take a rocket scientist, you just have to look at how they operate and then it is simple. And I stick with my decision... the autococker price is inflated.. get it down where it needs to be and it is a much better deal. (bunch of cocker haters... can't be neutral to save your lives... i need to sell both my mag and my cocker and go buy something like a spyder so I won't have to deal with this stupidity).

Now you are just being stereotypical. You pick out the one person who didn't actually explain himself and accuse us all of being that way.

[93civiccpe]

Now you are just being stereotypical. You pick out the one person who didn't actually explain himself and accuse us all of being that way.

Sure I am. And "i have to use boots to get through the BS.. etc". I am an engineer. I own both and I play with both. I support both companies. You are making me defend the autococker side because all you will do is take the mag side and put down cockers. I own both and I play both so I'm going to speak honestly and not play into the stupid rivalry/feud. My mag has an x-valve with lvl 10. I have a freak kit for it and my autococker. I can put the same tip, same insert, and same paint into each. I know from experience which one hits ball on ball. Plain and simply. Now is the spread that much different on the mag that it isn't usable, OF COURSE NOT.. OR ELSE I WOULDN'T OWN ONE. You said that matching paint & barrel & having a consistent air source is what determines the flight characteristics of the paintball. I agree.. these are some of the major factors. But the air source becomes an issue when talking about an open bolt blowback and a closed bolt. They operate differently. The two designers didn't copy each other. As an engineer, I appreciate both designs, and actually I have my own design I'm having fabricated that isn't like either. I know from experience that with my cocker at a long range target I can be a little more consistent than with my mag. Is that such a terrible thing to say?? With the lvl 10, x-valve & ult I can walk my mag faster than my mech cocker. When it comes to emags I don't personally like the look of the big battery pack. They should make a battery pack that is round with ribs like a foregrip should look like.. that would be tight and very easy to create.

Read this, this is just one of the many things about the cocker vs mag arguement that is so stupid people need to get over it. Look at the last line... I do own both and I do really like playing both. Yet you are accusing me of being an autococker biased person who hates mags. It isn't true. Here's the article taken off of WarPig.com:

Is it the best? Better than the AutoCocker?

The AutoCocker vs. Automag debate will rage for some time to come. Many 'Mag owners will say their gun is best, while many 'Cocker owners will claim they've got the better gun..

The facts are that both guns are in the same class. They are both used by top professional teams. They are both high performance guns and they both tend to cost their owners lots of money.

The 'Mag is known for its simplicity of design and maintenance, its very high rate of fire, and its dislike for liquid CO2. The 'Cocker is known for its complexity of design, occasional severe maintenance problems, tedious normal maintenance, and its long effective range.

Both camps claim that their guns can be modified to operate as well as the others. The 'Mag biggots (automaggots) claim that the Black Box modification from SmartParts (see below) can increase the effective range of the Automag to compete with that of the AutoCocker. The AutoCocker biggots claim that the AutoCocker can be made to shoot just as fast as an Automag with some professional trigger customization work.

"They're both right given well worked guns in the hands of someone who can use them to their fullest. It's a lot simpler to utilize the 'mags much closer to the limit by normal people than a 'cocker. Trigger pulling especially is definitely an area where each individuals shooting style makes a big difference." --John D. Mitchell ([email protected])

With enough money, either gun can be made into a lethal, professional quality paintball gun. Either gun will likely outperform its owner for many years -- by which time he will probably own one of each anyway.

[93civiccpe]

I forgot.. here's one of the other mods mention, but this one wasn't one of the ones I've tested:


"[Paintball] Checkpoint very definitely does have their own version of this modification which Greg endearingly calls his 'distance enhancer' modification. It is basically a tap done into the air chamber, a 90 degree elbow and a custom drilled expansion tube that sits against the body of the gun rather than sticking straight out like the black box. At least as good as the SP mod and a whole lot cheaper! ... The modification lowers the pressure in the air chamber so the ball get's spiked less so ball breakage decreases. ... This definitely does *not* in any way raise the velocity of the gun."
--John D. Mitchell ([email protected])

[JoshK]

Also, I know atleast I have owned both, and like you have not owned the electro version of the other. I know from my experiance that cockers can be a pain in the butt to fix, because they have more problems. But alot of those are from the 3-way which like I said in my post is fixed with a eblade...

The whole thing that got me was when you took a below average answer and generalized. Thats the only problem I have.

[FSU_Paintball]

Honestly? As someone who has owned 2 mags 2 cockers and many others?

Timmy, Matrix, or Freestyle.

[JoshK]

I forgot.. here's one of the other mods mention, but this one wasn't one of the ones I've tested:


"[Paintball] Checkpoint very definitely does have their own version of this modification which Greg endearingly calls his 'distance enhancer' modification. It is basically a tap done into the air chamber, a 90 degree elbow and a custom drilled expansion tube that sits against the body of the gun rather than sticking straight out like the black box. At least as good as the SP mod and a whole lot cheaper! ... The modification lowers the pressure in the air chamber so the ball get's spiked less so ball breakage decreases. ... This definitely does *not* in any way raise the velocity of the gun."
--John D. Mitchell ([email protected])

Also to some extent that article you quoted is not very acurate because that much be a older article...there is no need for a "black box", both guns are now both stupidly fast, they both shoot the same distance, and with the same accuracy.

[SlartyBartFast]

I am an engineer.

Yet you quote articles and seem to support the idea of the SP Magic Box.

You need HIP WADERS not boots to get through the BS of that thing. Almost as good as the spin SP said their ported barrels gave the ball.

You should have your liscence revoked.

I know from experience that with my cocker at a long range target I can be a little more consistent than with my mag. Is that such a terrible thing to say??

No. But you have to admit, that form an engineering point of view, that the statement is simply personal opinion and non-empirical.

If you test, you'll find your opinion is groundless. Or at least the reason for better long distance performance has NOTHING to do with the marker or how the marker functions but with either your experience or how you handle the different markers.

[SlartyBartFast]

I forgot.. here's one of the other mods mention, but this one wasn't one of the ones I've tested:


"[Paintball] Checkpoint very definitely does have their own version of this modification which Greg endearingly calls his 'distance enhancer' modification. It is basically a tap done into the air chamber, a 90 degree elbow and a custom drilled expansion tube that sits against the body of the gun rather than sticking straight out like the black box. At least as good as the SP mod and a whole lot cheaper! ... The modification lowers the pressure in the air chamber so the ball get's spiked less so ball breakage decreases. ... This definitely does *not* in any way raise the velocity of the gun."
--John D. Mitchell ([email protected])

While you're quoting rediculously out of date articles and disproven "mods", you may as well know the reason these mods seemed to work for the pro teams.

It was all about getting some liquid CO2 into the dump chamber. That would result in a hot shot that would, naturally, go farther. But it's cheating.

Same as chronoing with an anti-siphon tank on a tippman or other liquid tolerant gun and then managing to fire with liquid CO2 (tilting the gun and firing, then the next shot will be liquid fired and Hot).

Despite the claims in the quote above, the "lower pressure in the chamber" does NOTHING when it comes to the dynamics/pressures on the ball. All those mods did was make the Mag use more air/CO2.

There is a number of threads discussing the mod. I suggest you look them up.