So - why not use an electromagnet for bolt control

[AGD202]

from what im understanding... u wont be able to make the bolt out of lightweight materials... and the battery would have to be massive.... after all of that the gun would probably end up weighing more than an emag does stock... and every1 knows emags are heavy stock... if u could make it lighter or maybe stick a battery in ur pocket w/ wire comming up to it? that would be all good.... but then whats the point if u dont have to use air? air and paint are the 2 things of paintball that make it the sport....

[txaggie08]

why not use a normal magnet for bolt return? it would eleiminate the spring issue thats for shure. plae t at the front of the chamber and use it to drive the boltback AFTER the gun discharges

[ApexAZ]

from what im understanding... u wont be able to make the bolt out of lightweight materials... and the battery would have to be massive.... after all of that the gun would probably end up weighing more than an emag does stock... and every1 knows emags are heavy stock... if u could make it lighter or maybe stick a battery in ur pocket w/ wire comming up to it? that would be all good.... but then whats the point if u dont have to use air? air and paint are the 2 things of paintball that make it the sport....

You would still need air to fire the ball.

[SlartyBartFast]

why not use a normal magnet for bolt return? it would eleiminate the spring issue thats for shure. place it at the front of the chamber and use it to drive the boltback AFTER the gun discharges

I believe the electrician already posted this idea in his boltless mag experimentation thread.

[Lohman446]

why not use a normal magnet for bolt return? it would eleiminate the spring issue thats for shure. plae t at the front of the chamber and use it to drive the boltback AFTER the gun discharges

To me the advantage of air over the bolt aws you had no resistance when the botl was trying to move forward (or minimal) The resistance to forward pressure could be "off" when the marker was firing. This is the big advantage to me over a spring (that and perhaps more controllability of dwell, I really don't know). A magnet would do the same thing as the spring, but offer little in the way of advantages I would think...

[hitech]

What you describe is an electrical solenoid. The bolt is the plunger.

You could use that idea (or a separate solenoid with a linkage to the bolt) to return the bolt instead of or in addition to the current return spring. Attempting to use it instead of wouldn't be practical. The power requirements are too high. In addition to is an interesting idea. However, to overcome the force generated by the air pressure against the bolt stem would still probably have a high power requirement.

[Glickman]

what do you think?(i "borrowed" the template from a certain ion diagram i tried from scratch and it sucked )

the first one is when its done getting reset by the magnets (yellow)

the second is when its firing


not practical at the moment, but is it feasable? (of course the magnets would be connected to a external power source)

http://img56.exs.cx/img56/599/thissucks2mo.jpg

[Lohman446]

In the first one, which is really what I had in mind when I started (but my magnets were at the back in my mind, same concept of operation though) but now realize the error of what is holding the bolt back? In my mind those magnets half to stay energized... which produced a battery life issue as others pointed out. I still think theres some way to overcome this though... just not sure what

[ICP]

I've been going over this in my head for about a 2 weeks. They have electro magnets that will run off of 3,6,9,12,18,24 volt (and higher of course). A 3/4" dia. X .66 long magnet has a holding force of roughly 5lbs with a 1 watt suplly of power, 2 watts = 7lbs, etc. all the way up to 13lbs at 10 watts. However, because I'm not any good at electronics, I don't know exactly what a 9v (or 2) will put out (in watts). Here is my idea for the design of the gun.


Single tube (1" OD, 3/4" ID), Body is 5" long (about the same length as your intelli), I would use a removable breech type setup(but that is another story at this point). Basically it is a poppit style valve set up.There will be a "breach seal" not a bolt made of thin delrin(or the like) Kind of L shaped to protrude into the body, behind the valve. This piece will have a small but strong(ish) magnet (earth maybe) set to be opposite polarity of the energized electromagnet. When the trigger is pressed, hits the switch, powers the EM and pushes the "breech seal" about .700 to close the feedport and stikes the poppit stem at the same time. As of right now there will be a valve spring in front of the valve (much like a spyder valve) that will seat up against the valve seal(damn, can't think of the name) and then against a ledge in the front of the body. Of course the valve spring will be changeable for tuning to specific function. And since the EM has a piece of steel running through the center (for mounting options) The earth magnet should draw enough on the EM to return the "breech seal" to original position and load for the next shot.

After all that rambling, this should prob. be in the tech section or mod section. But since it was already started here, I just decided to post it. Anybody that has information regarding how many volts will put out a certain amount of watts, please get in contact with, I would really appreciate it. I've thought hard about this, and will most likely try it, even if somebody finds a huge hole in my design concept. It's nice to be able to get working and sometimes makes it easier to think/change or redesign things for me.

Any imput? If it's hard to understand for a lot of people, I will try to get a sketch to explain with pictures.

[Glickman]

Watts = Amps x Volts

very well thought out.


its a great starting point, anyone wanna try?

[Lohman446]

The more coils in an electomagnet the less power it takes.. what if we made coils the full length of the firing chamber? You could vary the composition of the bolt to allow it to pull only on the back of the bolt and not the front so it would pull it back taking less power?

Just throwing out ideas now, someone with a better understanding is going to have to work out the details if they want to try it

[ICP]

Watts = Amps x Volts

very well thought out.


its a great starting point, anyone wanna try?

I'm still a complete idiot when it comes to electronics. As an example, I've got a 9v battery. How do I control the ampere output to get the watt value?

And yes I'm working on it now. I've got the body done and will use a spyder frame for now, because it already has a board that is outputing 9v. Should have my electro magnet in by the weekend. then will do some testing before completeing the body/barrel, etc.

[txaggie08]

To me the advantage of air over the bolt aws you had no resistance when the botl was trying to move forward (or minimal) The resistance to forward pressure could be "off" when the marker was firing. This is the big advantage to me over a spring (that and perhaps more controllability of dwell, I really don't know). A magnet would do the same thing as the spring, but offer little in the way of advantages I would think...

i was thinking of smoothness. allow the gun to cycle without the force of the spring driving it back. possibly even use a smaller electormagnet to "amplify the return force asthe bold moved away. just a thought. i also dont beleive the magnets that would be used in something like a full magnetic operation would draw as much energy as everyone beleives