Dc 03 Fsp

[Lohman446]

yes, the bolt moves in both. you have to look at the other reciprocating mass within the marker. the hammer. i'm almost positive there are two of them in an excal, moving in opposite of the other (hence the closed bolt-ness of it). In a viking, you have one moving back and forth -- which in theory would generate kick as it was moving back and forth.

in an excal, while one is moving forward, the other is moving the same distance back -- if you have the same amount of mass, moving at the same speed, but in opposite -- that motion would negative itself out.

Does that make sense? (i ramble).

Im not familar enough with the Excals operation to comment well, but I am going to try anyways. Those hammers would have to move at different times - if both sides exerted pressure on the bolt together than wouldn't the bolt not move? I have heard the same reports from Excel owners, having never shot one I cant comment if its exagerated.

[rkjunior303]

Im not familar enough with the Excals operation to comment well, but I am going to try anyways. Those hammers would have to move at different times - if both sides exerted pressure on the bolt together than wouldn't the bolt not move? I have heard the same reports from Excel owners, having never shot one I cant comment if its exagerated.

could very well be, too. one may move then the other may move. maybe alan could chime in, if he reads this... i'm not THAT familar with a Excal to know how the hammers move. either way, anyone that complains about kick in a paintball marker needs to have their head checked lol

[yakitori]

I understand, but still AKA doesnt hype up their markers AS MUCH as SP or Dye. Like the guy said, most dont even know what it is.

I dont see how AKA stepped on SP patent issue and had to stop producing, yet WDP still makes angels that are nearly the same design as a viking (except for the stuff I said above).

I am not saying it is the best gun in paintball. IMO, there is no best gun. There just isnt. There are a set of high end guns that set them apart from the rest and all else is preference. But the viking is in that set of markers that stands out above most.

I dont think that SP killed AKA, I think thier patent lawsuit did.

I dont see how "low pressure experts" is hype and "because quality shoots so straight" isnt. That is just a company slogan, and I dont consider it hype.

In fact, I argue what I feel to be true, and I own an Ion and a viking, and a mag (which is for sale by the way in the BST forum, I know, shameless plug ).

thats my take on the whole AKA "hype".

as for kick on a PB marker. It is not that ppl cannot handle kick, its that at high ROF, less kick translates to tighter groupings. Does it not? That may not matter to you, but it does to some. I also dont want to chance getting penalties because of the design of the Xvalve that leads to shoot up. I get hot shots even when I chronod properly. And it give barrel rise more than my other guns.

[rkjunior303]

I understand, but still AKA doesnt hype up their markers AS MUCH as SP or Dye. Like the guy said, most dont even know what it is.

I dont see how AKA stepped on SP patent issue and had to stop producing, yet WDP still makes angels that are nearly the same design as a viking (except for the stuff I said above).

I am not saying it is the best gun in paintball. IMO, there is no best gun. There just isnt. There are a set of high end guns that set them apart from the rest and all else is preference. But the viking is in that set of markers that stands out above most.

I dont think that SP killed AKA, I think thier patent lawsuit did.

I dont see how "low pressure experts" is hype and "because quality shoots so straight" isnt. That is just a company slogan, and I dont consider it hype.

In fact, I argue what I feel to be true, and I own an Ion and a viking, and a mag (which is for sale by the way in the BST forum, I know, shameless plug ).

thats my take on the whole AKA "hype".

WDP is owned and operated out of Europe -- they don't fall under the same patent filings as a US based manufacturer does. which was my understanding why the "switch" thing didn't apply to them.

[yakitori]

WDP is owned and operated out of Europe -- they don't fall under the same patent filings as a US based manufacturer does. which was my understanding why the "switch" thing didn't apply to them.

I personally think its stupid about the switch thing. Its like PeterPan suing Jiffy for using REAL peanuts in their peanut butter. How can you make peanut butter w/o peanuts?

[Lohman446]

I dont see how AKA stepped on SP patent issue and had to stop producing, yet WDP still makes angels that are nearly the same design as a viking (except for the stuff I said above).

WDP had legal grounds to continue there production, a court ruled they had not committed patent infringement because they had made financially costly moves to ensure legal compliance. Basically a court ruled that both PVI and Dr Hischel (name ??) owned the rights to the electro paintball marker. It involved a failure of PVI to assure that Dr Hischel signed a work product agreement that resulted in dual ownership. SP had purchased PVI, and as such all of its intellectual property. WDP purchased a license (or the rights, not sure) from Dr Hischel to allow them to produce electro markers. AKA made no such consideration to those that owned those rights.

I dont think that SP killed AKA, I think thier patent lawsuit did.

It could be argued that AKAs production of a marker that ignored intellectual property rights killed them. They in essence took other peoples ideas and the work others had done (or the rights they had bought in SP and WDPs case) and with no consideration of the owners of htat "technology" and innovation competed against them. I would argue that that is morally wrong.

I dont see how "low pressure experts" is hype and "because quality shoots so straight isnt. That is just a company slogan, and I dont consider it hype.

Its hype, on both sides I never said Hype was a bad thing, I personally think it is highly useful myself. I just don't stick my head in the sand enough to argue that successful companies don't engage on it. I'll start a thread about hype this evening. Its not a bad thing...

[Lohman446]

either way, anyone that complains about kick in a paintball marker needs to have their head checked lol

Agreed, the kick on even the most "extreme" common markers is easily manageable

[fullofpaint]

WDP is owned and operated out of Europe -- they don't fall under the same patent filings as a US based manufacturer does. which was my understanding why the "switch" thing didn't apply to them.

Actually it would apply to them a s long as SP got their patent recognized in the UK. But t doesn't matter anyways cause the owner of WDP was part of SP originally

[Lohman446]

Actually it would apply to them a s long as SP got their patent recognized in the UK. But t doesn't matter anyways cause the owner of WDP was part of SP originally

US patents do in fact apply to most of western Europe. WDP has been found by the court to have rights to the electronic marker based on there agreement with Dr Hischel (name?) who worked for PVI - the innovators of the electro-marker. Because the Dr. never signed a work product agreement and was not properly compensated by PVI the courts ruled he owned the patent in conjunction with SP (who had bought PVI). As such he was free to license it, or sell it (not sure which) to WDP who took advantage of that.

[magman007]

you know, im hearing a lot of ragging on dye for hype here... id like to know actually how they hyped up their line of markers?

their slogan has always been designed for the art of winning, for their markers, which, judging by the amount of teams shooting them and being sucessful it seems to make sense. if you wouldnt mind just pointing out some examples, that would be great!

[fullofpaint]

I think they mean that they charge way more then their products are worth despite how good they are, anf rememeber it's the playere that makes the marker not the marker that makes the player.

But we digress the point of this thread is too drool over the viking

[yakitori]

well, most pic threads lately have turned into a dispute of the gun companies and hype.

Oh well, Im tired. Im throwing in the towel.

[Lohman446]

well, most pic threads lately have turned into a dispute of the gun companies and hype.

Oh well, Im tired. Im throwing in the towel.

I admitted to that on the first page... I started it.. I apologize on the road this thread took. Does it fix it? Nope.. it doesn't

[rkjunior303]

this turned into a civil, good discussion.. no flames, etc. i wish more threads were like this.

[WARPED1]

So, whats the AKA site so I can look into getting a 2 liter reg?