Serious Thoughts of Modern Paintball - Please Give Some Feedback

[Crazy]

The point i was making is that the rules are enforced on Dynasty, just as it was on anyone else. Chuck explained the new rules during the captains meeting and that is to penalize the player more than the entire team. This event, instead of Disqualifing the entire team, the team is penalized 100 points(which pretty much puts you out of the event right there) and then the player is suspended for 2 full events. What do you want next? Charging these people tens of thousands of dollars? Oh wait, no one gets paid anywhere near that to play paintball unlike the millions of dollars thrown around in baseball. You think any of those players actually care when they have to pay 10, 50, or even 100 thousand dollar fine?

[hitech]

In other sports, equipment is fashioned in accordance to rules. In paintball rules are fashioned weekly in accordance to equipment, this is a problem

A line worthy of a sig quote.

[Target Practice]

A line worthy of a sig quote.

*sigh*, I remember those.

I wanted to say that there is quite a lot of bold in this thread.

I just don't see the point. Why ask questions? Why debate? Neither you nor anyone else on this board is going to change a damn thing. Nobody important cares about what any of us have to say. Do I wish it was different? Yes. Do I wish we didn't have to put up with all the crap? Yes. Do I, deep down, still love the sport? I would say so, yes.

Get used to it, guys. As long as it's about the money and the attention, nothing is going to change.

[Jotsy]

now i don't know much abt politics, but i think the main reason why so many ppl are upset is because everybody has their own opinion of what the rules should be and nobody wants to work together an make a set of rules that everybody can agree to. Sure, we may not have the power to change anything, but the ones who do have the power have a hard time changing em because they don't know who to listen to.

[shartley]

now i don't know much abt politics, but i think the main reason why so many ppl are upset is because everybody has their own opinion of what the rules should be and nobody wants to work together an make a set of rules that everybody can agree to. Sure, we may not have the power to change anything, but the ones who do have the power have a hard time changing em because they don't know who to listen to.

[PBX Ronin 23]

There's a reason other sports get big and have hundreds of millions (maybe a billion or 2 for some) of fans and followers. TRADITION. Tradition in paintball is something mostly remembered and not practiced. In other sports, equipment is fashioned in accordance to rules. In paintball rules are fashioned weekly in accordance to equipment, this is a problem

Most of the sports that you have mentioned are deeply rooted in tradition. Tradition, at least in their early years, took precedence over financial matters. After all, these sports were originally intended to be a form of recreation for the participants rather than a source of revenue. That's the way they've started. But then they evolved to be multi-billion dollar industries.

Regretfully, tradition isn't as well rooted in paintball in a way that we would have liked it to be.

Trends in the sport and the industry in general have been governed by business interests more so than anything else. Winning at all cost, whether it requires the cheating or unsafe rates of fire, is the paramount goal.

[Jotsy]

well, being in the UK, i don't really follow those sports, so i don't know what the situation is like over there... but do ppl actively complain abt the way those sports are played?

i'm not gonna presume to know abt the history of football, but i'm sure at some point in history some ppl sat down and set out some iron clad rules that everybody were willing to follow. Paintball being relatively new, i'm gonna say that we just haven't reached that point yet.

now imagine if we all (by we i mean us players/forumers... an not just AO, mebe all PB forums) actually came together and decided for ourselves how we want to play the game (and we did it sensibly), would we all still be bickering here abt rules an such?

on a different note, imagine if illegal markers were treated more seriously... like say with an instant banning from the site or mebe even a prison sentence (this would require having certain modes officially considered illegal according to the law that is), i'd be willing to bet there'd be less of those appearing at games...

[MadPSIence]

I am appaulled by how accepted cheating is in paintball really. What really gets me is when people go on about how ramping isn't cheating, and how it's allowed now. You know what, it WAS cheating, and for a good reason. But for some reason as soon as it's declared not cheating by leagues that make rules for marketing.. people support it?

The only people supporting ramping are those too apathetic so say nay against it.. and those who just fold under the pressure to fit in and start using it. Then of course there's the kids and the diva pros who don't care about the sport, fairplay or any of that.

Did anyone see the NYX Matrix commerical with that wigger fool from NYX? That was the most sickening display of paintball marketing ever.. it makes the sport look retarded.

[Lohman446]

I agree with you and would like to also add I wish paintball would follow the example of other sports. Like.. take Formula 2 or GT350 for example. Cars are limited to certain specs.. so that driving skill does become the winning factor. Allowing ramping in paintball is like putting an (hypothetical) autopilot in a racecar. It takes the load off of you.. and when EVERYONE has ramping - you basically have a racetrack with everycar on auto pilot pile every driver sits back and taps buttons. Perhaps not to that extreme but the more you move down the ladder from pro to novice the more evident the lack of skill used is seen,

This would be true if BPS were the only skill in paintball. I look at it more like the limits of racing. They don't want races won in the garage, so they limit and driver skill becomes more of a factor. I don't want to see paintball won based on BPS (though I question at which point higher BPS doesn't matter) so capping it is a step in the right direction to me.

[tyrion2323]

The point i was making is that the rules are enforced on Dynasty, just as it was on anyone else. Chuck explained the new rules during the captains meeting and that is to penalize the player more than the entire team. This event, instead of Disqualifing the entire team, the team is penalized 100 points(which pretty much puts you out of the event right there) and then the player is suspended for 2 full events. What do you want next? Charging these people tens of thousands of dollars? Oh wait, no one gets paid anywhere near that to play paintball unlike the millions of dollars thrown around in baseball. You think any of those players actually care when they have to pay 10, 50, or even 100 thousand dollar fine?

I guess that's a fine punishment, if it works. I just don't think that Dynasty or any other pro team is going to stop trying to cheat because of it. Where did I suggest fining paintball teams? Can you find that for me, please?

A team needs to truly be a team. None of this WDP Amalgam Arsenal crap...and teams need to know about their teammates.

What do I think the best solution is? Have Dynasty, XSV, Strange, etc. all stand up and denounce cheating, and then make a pact not to cheat again.

What do I think the realistic situation will be? Nothing will happen because these guys want to win at all costs. Chuck Hendsh's rule sounds good, but it's not going to do anything to stop the appeal or glamour of cheating that has been cultivated by today's pro teams.

[barrel break]

[QUOTE=MadPSIence][QUOTE=teufelhunden] - content -

in reguards to your reply about rules and cheating in other sports.. you're right not many corked bats or illegal things pop up. It's because in those sports there is an actual sense of tradition and an honor system. (not to mention greater consequences for cheating). Frankly, and quote me for this, tourney ballers are some of the most careless sportsman when it's come to any sort of traditionalism or honor in the game. don't get me wrong most pro-ballers are respectable and well mannered athletes (albeit spoiled celebrities) but when youngsters are just as capable of using this equipment.. seriously. 15 year olds (and younger & older) don't give (or know) 2 craps about an honor system or anything.

^^
(My age, 15)
Ya know, this is where starting to play with friends in woodsball really helps everybody.
Personally, I have wiped maybe 3 times in the ~4 years I have been playing, once at Ronn sternn camp, and twice in the woods, fooling around games. Generally, we were pretty honest. The new players are somewhat indoctrinated in wiping at feilds. ooops, ot, back to topic.

Reaction time to ramping- Last week, there were quite a few "agg kids" playing, one had his DM4 ramping something quite a bit past 15 (maybe 20?). When he shot people, they averaged three hits, people will jerk outta the way.

BPS limits- 15 is just fine with me, thank you.

Ramping in general- I somewhat ashamadely, will say I played all of last friday without realizing I was ramping. I got home, next day fooled around in modes, and found myself to have been ramping. Did I overshoot people? No, the person whom I hit the most walked off the feild with 4 balls on him because he didnt go out.
Turning into a sitting game? Hell, don't just blame ramping, even without it, shooting 10BPS, back guys still sit there shooting, and people find their favorite bunkers. I prefer a fast game, but it rests in the type of people you play with.

[PsychoBaller]

Simply Stated - I feel to much emphasis these days is on how fast someone can shoot, and not on actually playing and ENJOYING the game, regardless of who wins.

Thas why i gave up on tourny play. Its just not fun anymore. Politics... bah.

Players that enter into paintball these days are not worried as much anymore about how to play the game, but rather how fast they can get their gun to go. I remember when i first started, i wanted to learn tactics, and just work on my gun for the fun of it, and upgrade the crap outta it with knowingly useless fashion sense upgrades.

nobody cares anymore about tactics, every other thread is about "my gun shoots faster than yours" yada yada.... sad times.

-baller

ya gots to get back into PB where it started, IN THE WOOODS... scenario stuff is where its at.

[shartley]

Simply Stated - I feel to much emphasis these days is on how fast someone can shoot, and not on actually playing and ENJOYING the game, regardless of who wins.

Thas why i gave up on tourny play. Its just not fun anymore. Politics... bah.

Players that enter into paintball these days are not worried as much anymore about how to play the game, but rather how fast they can get their gun to go. I remember when i first started, i wanted to learn tactics, and just work on my gun for the fun of it, and upgrade the crap outta it with knowingly useless fashion sense upgrades.

nobody cares anymore about tactics, every other thread is about "my gun shoots faster than yours" yada yada.... sad times.

-baller

ya gots to get back into PB where it started, IN THE WOOODS... scenario stuff is where its at.

[alooney11]

It only seems bad becuase the people that post on forums all know/have the latest and greatst stuff. But when you go to a big game its still pretty cool. I have more fun now due to the new technology (eyes/level 10) than when chopping was common place.

[shartley]

It only seems bad becuase the people that post on forums all know/have the latest and greatst stuff. But when you go to a big game its still pretty cool. I have more fun now due to the new technology (eyes/level 10) than when chopping was common place.

This is not quite accurate. That does not even apply to everyone who posts on THIS forum.

I have to remind folks often that AO and PBN are far from being the only paintball forums online, nor are they the best and worst forums either. There are actually worse forums than PBN and MUCH better forums than AO. And there are forums dedicated to every style of play and niche in paintball.