Fireblade.... No mech mode?

[RRfireblade]

SO I just hear from tuna that there is no guarantee a Fireblade will work in mech mode(manual)...

Since Tuna has no connection to me or Logic Paintball in anyway, of course he would not 'guarantee' anything having to do with a Fireblade trigger. However I can only make the assumption that he should have the technical ability to make any neccessary adjustments on such a simple thing as the trigger in Mag.

But, regardless of whether he actually has that ability or not...

I guarantee it. Anyone who has "any" problem with a Fireblade trigger can send the marker to me and I'll make sure it functions perfectly....period. Just get the marker to me and consider it done.

Jay.

[Emert426]

^^^^

Good Businessman

[CoolHand]

Man oh man do I ever love the doom and gloomers of AO.

You know what guys?

We hold better tolerances with those FireBlades than AGD does with their trigger rod settings. We hold -+0.005" on most dimensions of the trigger. Some places get -+0.002". The holes are reamed and speced to -0.000" +0.001". There is no way that sear assmebly is checked and set for length to those kind of tolerances. And even if it were during original assembly, its not going to say that way once it goes in the bin with the rest of the batch. I mean, its a frigging threaded rod and clevis, which you have to bend to assemble. [sarcasm] I'm sure they mic the rod length down to a thou when they snap them onto the sears. [/sarcasm]

The line between mech mode working correctly with no bounce, and having uber hybrid bounce is so fine that we have to design to the "correct" rod length. Sometimes the trigger rods just come up a fuzz too short (or long) from the factory. Its not hard to lose 0.015" in a thin metal clevis and tiny bent pin connection. One little tweak during assembly, shipping, whatever, and its too short to work exactly like it needs to. AGD's solution is to set it long and just let i bounce. We all know that will get you tossed from a tourney, but it will work every time out of the box.

When you walk the razor's edge for performance, sometimes you have to actually tune and tweak your marker. It comes with the territory.

I have never ever seen an E/XMag that would not work in mech mode with a FireBlade. If it doesn't work the very first time, a half turn to one full turn of the sear rod usually fixes it up just fine (that would be a change in length of ~0.015" - 0.025").

The sears can wear funky ONLY IF THE SEAR ROD IS SO LONG THAT THE SEAR CAN NEVER FULLY RESET. IE, the sear rod is bound up against the back of the trigger so much that the sear is partially tripped at rest.

Since the only issue anyone ever has with the FireBlade is that it doesn't push the sear rod back far enough (IE there is too big of a gap between the back of the trigger and the sear rod) to fire the marker in mech mode, you would need to lengthen the sear rod over ~0.250" (or roughly TEN times as much as you could ever need to fix the problem) to cause any sear issues at all.

I am going to go out on a limb here and say that if you lengthen the rod ten times as much as you should, you deserve to chip a sear, as you are stupid. There, I said it. Stupidity should hurt.

Like Jay said, if you can't make it work, one of us can. If Tuna doesn't think he can do it, fine, that's his problem. We can. Its a simple thing. One so trivial in fact, that a smart man might surmise that the only reason he would even mention it at all, would be to stir up trouble. . . . . . . .

[Automaggot68]

Man oh man do I ever love the doom and gloomers of AO.

You know what guys?

We hold better tolerances with those FireBlades than AGD does with their trigger rod settings. I mean, its a frigging threaded rod and clevis.

The line between mech working and having hybrid bounce is so fine that sometimes the trigger rods come up a fuzz too short from the factory.

I have never ever seen an E/XMag that would not work in mech mode with a FireBlade. If it doesn't work the very first time, a half to one turn of the sear rod usually fixes it up just fine (that would be a change in length of ~0.015" - 0.025").

The sears can wear funky ONLY IF THE SEAR ROD IS SO LONG THAT THE SEAR CAN NEVER FULLY RESET. IE, the sear rod is bound up against the back of the trigger so much that the sear is partially tripped at rest.

Since the only issue anyone ever has with the FireBlade is that it doesn't push the sear rod far enough (IE there is too big a gap between the back of the trigger and the sear rod) to fire the marker in mech mode, you would need to lengthen the sear rod over ~0.250" (or roughly TEN times as much as you could ever need to fix the problem) to cause any sear issues at all.

I am going to go out on a limb here and say that if you lengthen the rod ten times as much as you should, you deserve to chip a sear, as you are stupid. There, I said it. Stupidity should hurt.

Like Jay said, if you can't make it work, one of us can. If Tuna doesn't think he can do it, fine, that's his problem. We can. Its a simple thing. One so trivial in fact, that a smart man might surmise that the only reason he would even mention it at all, would be to stir up trouble. . . . . . . .

<3


Did I mention how much i love my Logic Frame?

[A-Tach-One]

Man oh man do I ever love the doom and gloomers of AO.

You know what guys?

We hold better tolerances with those FireBlades than AGD does with their trigger rod settings. We hold -+0.005" on most dimensions of the trigger. Some places get -+0.002". The holes are reamed and speced to -0.000" +0.001". There is no way that sear assmebly is checked and set for length to those kind of tolerances. And even if it were during original assembly, its not going to say that way once it goes in the bin with the rest of the batch. I mean, its a frigging threaded rod and clevis, which you have to bend to assemble. [sarcasm] I'm sure they mic the rod length down to a thou when they snap them onto the sears. [/sarcasm]

The line between mech mode working correctly with no bounce, and having uber hybrid bounce is so fine that we have to design to the "correct" rod length. Sometimes the trigger rods just come up a fuzz too short (or long) from the factory. Its not hard to lose 0.015" in a thin metal clevis and tiny bent pin connection. One little tweak during assembly, shipping, whatever, and its too short to work exactly like it needs to. AGD's solution is to set it long and just let i bounce. We all know that will get you tossed from a tourney, but it will work every time out of the box.

When you walk the razor's edge for performance, sometimes you have to actually tune and tweak your marker. It comes with the territory.

I have never ever seen an E/XMag that would not work in mech mode with a FireBlade. If it doesn't work the very first time, a half turn to one full turn of the sear rod usually fixes it up just fine (that would be a change in length of ~0.015" - 0.025").

The sears can wear funky ONLY IF THE SEAR ROD IS SO LONG THAT THE SEAR CAN NEVER FULLY RESET. IE, the sear rod is bound up against the back of the trigger so much that the sear is partially tripped at rest.

Since the only issue anyone ever has with the FireBlade is that it doesn't push the sear rod back far enough (IE there is too big of a gap between the back of the trigger and the sear rod) to fire the marker in mech mode, you would need to lengthen the sear rod over ~0.250" (or roughly TEN times as much as you could ever need to fix the problem) to cause any sear issues at all.

I am going to go out on a limb here and say that if you lengthen the rod ten times as much as you should, you deserve to chip a sear, as you are stupid. There, I said it. Stupidity should hurt.

Like Jay said, if you can't make it work, one of us can. If Tuna doesn't think he can do it, fine, that's his problem. We can. Its a simple thing. One so trivial in fact, that a smart man might surmise that the only reason he would even mention it at all, would be to stir up trouble. . . . . . . .

Are you forgeting that some of us are customers and payed the 60.00 w/shipping for your trigger? If one hears news or gossip like this, aren't we allowed to speak about it? I do not beleive I am a doom and gloomer! But thanks

[Emert426]

Oops

Didn't mean to start anything guys.... I'm a big fan CoolHand, you do a great job, and I can't wait to get my trigger...

I'm just a new emag user that got a little spooked thats all.....

[magmanl337]

Are you forgeting that some of us are customers and payed the 60.00 w/shipping for your trigger? If one hears news or gossip like this, aren't we allowed to speak about it? I do not beleive I am a doom and gloomer! But thanks

Take my word for it, Jay and Ryan weren't talking about you.

[CoolHand]

Are you forgeting that some of us are customers and payed the 60.00 w/shipping for your trigger? If one hears news or gossip like this, aren't we allowed to speak about it? I do not beleive I am a doom and gloomer! But thanks

No no no.

I wasn't talking about you guys, the customers have every right to be concerned.

I was talking about the people who start these rumors. Its very nearly always the same few, and they know who they are.

That's who I was referring to.

No worries for you guys.

The ones who deserve the scorn know who they are.

[Tunaman]

Man oh man do I ever love the doom and gloomers of AO.

You know what guys?

We hold better tolerances with those FireBlades than AGD does with their trigger rod settings. We hold -+0.005" on most dimensions of the trigger. Some places get -+0.002". The holes are reamed and speced to -0.000" +0.001". There is no way that sear assmebly is checked and set for length to those kind of tolerances. And even if it were during original assembly, its not going to say that way once it goes in the bin with the rest of the batch. I mean, its a frigging threaded rod and clevis, which you have to bend to assemble. [sarcasm] I'm sure they mic the rod length down to a thou when they snap them onto the sears. [/sarcasm]

The line between mech mode working correctly with no bounce, and having uber hybrid bounce is so fine that we have to design to the "correct" rod length. Sometimes the trigger rods just come up a fuzz too short (or long) from the factory. Its not hard to lose 0.015" in a thin metal clevis and tiny bent pin connection. One little tweak during assembly, shipping, whatever, and its too short to work exactly like it needs to. AGD's solution is to set it long and just let i bounce. We all know that will get you tossed from a tourney, but it will work every time out of the box.

When you walk the razor's edge for performance, sometimes you have to actually tune and tweak your marker. It comes with the territory.

I have never ever seen an E/XMag that would not work in mech mode with a FireBlade. If it doesn't work the very first time, a half turn to one full turn of the sear rod usually fixes it up just fine (that would be a change in length of ~0.015" - 0.025").

The sears can wear funky ONLY IF THE SEAR ROD IS SO LONG THAT THE SEAR CAN NEVER FULLY RESET. IE, the sear rod is bound up against the back of the trigger so much that the sear is partially tripped at rest.

Since the only issue anyone ever has with the FireBlade is that it doesn't push the sear rod back far enough (IE there is too big of a gap between the back of the trigger and the sear rod) to fire the marker in mech mode, you would need to lengthen the sear rod over ~0.250" (or roughly TEN times as much as you could ever need to fix the problem) to cause any sear issues at all.

I am going to go out on a limb here and say that if you lengthen the rod ten times as much as you should, you deserve to chip a sear, as you are stupid. There, I said it. Stupidity should hurt.

Like Jay said, if you can't make it work, one of us can. If Tuna doesn't think he can do it, fine, that's his problem. We can. Its a simple thing. One so trivial in fact, that a smart man might surmise that the only reason he would even mention it at all, would be to stir up trouble. . . . . . . .

Stir up trouble? Thats absolutely rediculous. My problem is that when i build a custom Emag, my sears all come in pieces...not put together. I set the trigger rod length to 2.125 as per AGD specs. I dont have time to loctite the trigger rod, install The Fireblade, test, find out that it doesnt work, take the gun apart, pick some imaginary sear rod length, re loctite, reassemble, test, find out it doesnt work correctly and start the process all over again. What is the correct trigger rod length for the Fireblade to work correctly anyway? How much does one have to charge to install one of these triggers? 50 bucks? Because thats about how much time it takes to get one right. If all the triggers are the same, Please post the correct trigger rod length that it needs to be so anybody can adjust one. I know its not rocket science, so please let us know.

[tyrion2323]

Okay, now hang on. I highly doubt that Tunaman is going around trying to spread false rumors or bad-mouth products. Let's all just chill out. Having dealt personally with both Tunaman and Coolhand, I know that both guys deliver. Let's keep it at that!

[SpecialBlend2786]

Is it just me or does Ryan always have false rumors spread about his products...

[Tunaman]

I am just trying to figure out how to sell/install/install customers triggers so they don't COST ME money!

[Tunaman]

Is it just me or does Ryan always have false rumors spread about his products...

And nobody said ANYTHING bad about his or any other products. I am not into that.

[ClassicMagger]

Hey:

Tuna nor any other AGD Tech or Dealer cannot warranty or guarantee that one of Logic's triggers will work in the E-Mag.

It is NOT covered under AGD Warranty. You can read it all you like; and I know I have. There is no special exception to the warranty process that says a Logic Trigger is under our warranty.

Also, moving your trigger rod ANY length outside of the 2.125 that AGD specifies is moving it outside of spec, which can void your warranty.

So, I'd suggest for anyone who would like to void their AGD warranty with a product other than AGD's to go to the person who makes that product and demand a warranty from them.

TunaMan is doing it for his own good. Why warranty a product you don't create or the company you work for doesn't create??? Makes no sense to me, if I were in his position I wouldn't warranty it either or guarantee that it will work.

Peace said.

If you would like to go into this any farther and choice words need to be used all of you know how to E-Mail or PM me.

-ClassicMagger

[Vex]

Hey:

Tuna nor any other AGD Tech or Dealer cannot warranty or guarantee that one of Logic's triggers will work in the E-Mag.

It is NOT covered under AGD Warranty. You can read it all you like; and I know I have. There is no special exception to the warranty process that says a Logic Trigger is under our warranty.

Also, moving your trigger rod ANY length outside of the 2.125 that AGD specifies is moving it outside of spec, which can void your warranty.

So, I'd suggest for anyone who would like to void their AGD warranty with a product other than AGD's to go to the person who makes that product and demand a warranty from them.

TunaMan is doing it for his own good. Why warranty a product you don't create or the company you work for doesn't create??? Makes no sense to me, if I were in his position I wouldn't warranty it either or guarantee that it will work.

Peace said.

If you would like to go into this any farther and choice words need to be used all of you know how to E-Mail or PM me.

-ClassicMagger

100% True.
Word to your mother...