WARNING: This thread talks about "sniper" things! A question about valves.

[punkncat]

Why is it when someone comes on with the idea of what a "sniper" can be in paintball, maintaining concealment over brute force, we belittle the idea of the term sniper. However, when someone comes on and wants to be a "long range" sniper we remind them of the implausability of that in paintball. Come on now, this man wants to play a different style game that depends as much on concealment as it does brute firepower. Its a valid / different approach to situations and in many types of games may be a great change. How many times have you guys been in scenarios, gotten bored with your teams frontal assaults and wandered around solo. I know I have often, and when greeted with brute force against multiple players its nice to be able to fire a shot or two without giving away your position, and move reasonably quietly. I think its a lot of fun and a change of pace from the normal blitzkrieg style that is paintball. I doubt any of you are going to accuse me of not knowing the game.

You don't know paintball......

I really enjoy exploring the stealthy aspect of woodsball. Many scenario games I will find a busy traffic area with a few well placed bushes , crawl under one and pick people off for hours at a time. Its great seeing the look on their face when they get eliminated and have no idea where it came from.

The sound signature from a barrel can be deceiving. Oftentimes a barrel that sounds loud as you shoot it is actually quieter downfield. In other words if the porting is allowing the sound to be dispersed around the barrel instead of out the end of the barrel it will seem louder.
The best way to tell is to actually get downfield of it and have someone fire in your general direction.

[dave p]

when i used to have a one piece dye aluminum 12" on my minimag, my brother would alway comment on how he could barely hear me shoot, even though we were indoors and in the same bunker.

[famousgamer]

Yes. Then good news is that markers are already pretty quiet. After the right barrel (and maybe a silencer, shhhh) it is even quieter.

I love stealthy paintball, and really for the reasons posted above. I go to the local feilds by myself, and walk on games. I do not have alot of friends into paintball. They are into cars and motorcycles, or music. I am always a lonewolf, and therefore I usually stalk by myself. Stealth can really be the factor that keeps me in the game, and effective to my team. The downside is I volunteer for defense all the time, as friendly fire is a huge concern when you are being a lonewolf on a team full of new players. There is alot of shooting first, and asking questions later!

I was bustin out a few rounds with a cocker today, and when they got the right barrel they can be really quiet. I then busted off a few rounds with my friends flatlined Custom 98. CHUP! CHUP! CHUP! That thing just broadcasts over the feild!

Not only that, but that flatline barrel repot is so directional, and distinctive, actually reaching higher ranges of sound. At least a quiet paintball marker hits lower ranges of sound, that are muffled and hard to pinpoint in the woods.

So, I am assuming that the level 10 and the classic valve are the most condusive for automag sniping?

[REDRT]

So, I am assuming that the level 10 and the classic valve are the most condusive for automag sniping?

The sound of the mag valves are the same. The xvalve is going to sound the same as a classic valve with the same barrel. The basic differences between the valves is weight, gas usage and recharge time. Any of the rt valves are going to be able to shoot more bps than the any of the classic A.I.R valves with their faster recharge time. The Xvalve being the lightest one of the bunch because it is aluminum. The RTs all need N2 or compressed air only. Where as the classic A.I.R valve can shoot Co2 also. When you break them down futher there is The ULE trigger pull kit or just ULT as most of us refer it as. Simply a different on/off that reduces the weight of trigger pull. Not all of the rt line up can use this mod and it isn't recommended for A.I.R valves. So there is choices to be made, but nothing about the valve is going to change the sound. So any of the valves could work for your sniper marker really except maybe for the Classic RT valve. That one is a whole other animal all together.

[Lohman446]

The sound of the mag valves are the same. The xvalve is going to sound the same as a classic valve with the same barrel. The basic differences between the valves is weight, gas usage and recharge time. Any of the rt valves are going to be able to shoot more bps than the any of the classic A.I.R valves with their faster recharge time. The Xvalve being the lightest one of the bunch because it is aluminum. The RTs all need N2 or compressed air only. Where as the classic A.I.R valve can shoot Co2 also. When you break them down futher there is The ULE trigger pull kit or just ULT as most of us refer it as. Simply a different on/off that reduces the weight of trigger pull. Not all of the rt line up can use this mod and it isn't recommended for A.I.R valves. So there is choices to be made, but nothing about the valve is going to change the sound. So any of the valves could work for your sniper marker really except maybe for the Classic RT valve. That one is a whole other animal all together.

Your also forgetting the shot to shot inconsistency of an X-valve at low rates of fire at 800PSI input (though it has been stated this is negated at low (600ish) input levels).

[famousgamer]

Your also forgetting the shot to shot inconsistency of an X-valve at low rates of fire at 800PSI input (though it has been stated this is negated at low (600ish) input levels).

And I will be running at 800 psi I beleive. That means Id be better off with that clasic valve based on that alone. Thanks for the tip.

Good points guys. I am not too worried about the valves as far as noise is concerned. I dont suppose there is anything I could really do about it anyways, as I have to choose the valve that is best suited towards a sniper style of shooting anyways.

As long as my first shot has the same velocity as my third, I am happy. The classic valve can do that I gather.

I am kinda wondering why the Spec Ops Longbow (a TAC ONE with Spec Ops parts on it) has an X-Valve? Ummmm, isnt that not the best valve for sniping?

[Lohman446]

And I will be running at 800 psi I beleive. That means Id be better off with that clasic valve based on that alone. Thanks for the tip.

Good points guys. I am not too worried about the valves as far as noise is concerned. I dont suppose there is anything I could really do about it anyways, as I have to choose the valve that is best suited towards a sniper style of shooting anyways.

As long as my first shot has the same velocity as my third, I am happy. The classic valve can do that I gather.

I am kinda wondering why the Spec Ops Longbow (a TAC ONE with Spec Ops parts on it) has an X-Valve? Ummmm, isnt that not the best valve for sniping?

The X-valve is not terrible on consistancy. It is more consistant at high rates of fire, there is some climb to get there though. I have seen them be reasonably consistant, but not all are. I would go with a classic valve if I were you. The advantages of the X-valve are pretty minimal to you

A) Weight - like 3 ounces, you decide
B) Rate of fire - you have already stated not a concern
C) Ability to accept ULT - ULT is designed to make a lighter trigger for higher rate of fire... you decide again
D) RT (not like Tippman RT, but the trigger returning at higher force than pulled) again for rate of fire...

[REDRT]

Your also forgetting the shot to shot inconsistency of an X-valve at low rates of fire at 800PSI input (though it has been stated this is negated at low (600ish) input levels).

You're wrong. + or - 1 to 2 fps firing slow. It isn't till you rail on it it will be anymore than that at that point. Step off to the chrono and bam it is right about the same as when you chrono'd in. I can sit there and fire over the chrono all day long shooting slow 295,295,295,296,295,295,294,295 ect. That is at a 1000psi imput. That is pretty consistant in my book.

[Lohman446]

You're wrong. + or - 1 to 2 fps firing slow. It isn't till you rail on it it will be anymore than that at that point. Step off to the chrono and bam it is right about the same as when you chrono'd in. I can sit there and fire over the chrono all day long shooting slow 295,295,295,296,295,295,294,295 ect. That is at a 1000psi imput. That is pretty consistant in my book.

Mine were normally +/-10ish, normally a touch less (though all my markers are). Perhaps it has something to do with not sizing paint and just shooting a large bore. I do sometimes get those incredible chrono consistencies, but consider them just random chance.

[REDRT]

Mine were normally +/-10ish, normally a touch less (though all my markers are). Perhaps it has something to do with not sizing paint and just shooting a large bore. I do sometimes get those incredible chrono consistencies, but consider them just random chance.

Actually I find if your ball barrel match is close sometimes the inconstancies of the other balls causes spikes by running too tight. I always run a little less tight in tournament situation were velocity really counts. I also find a little maintenance (ie lube) with any mag valve really helps in keeping them consistant.

[NinjaoftheNight79]

As far as Barrels, the best barrel concept I have seen is the Deadlywind Wisper barrel. It is (sound absorbing) Carbon Fiber, liket the Stiffi, doesn't have any fancyness to it, and uses Freak Boremaster inserts. This would make it accurate (bore match) and pretty quiet (carbon fiber + its porting). If you wanted to be a "sniper", that would be the way to go.

My X-Valve personally hasn't quite broken in yet (as I have heard it will do after a while). It still gets really good consistancy though. I think it may also be the PMI 72 cu 3000 psi tank I am using. I don't think the regulator is the best.

As far as the X-valve on a Longbow, I am a Special Ops kinda person, so I could tell you why they do that. The reason is because they wanted to be able to put their kit on a stock marker. It was for modularity. They wanted you to be able to take your stock Tac-One, and turn it into a Longbow, or buy their Longbow, and turn it into a stock Tac-One. Pretty simple concept.

If you read in the X-Valve manual, you will see that at input pressures of 750 psi, the X-Valve functions as though it was a Classic Valve. What I mean is that if you are shooting fast the valve may starve a bit and velocity will go down. Shooting slow helps it. So, since you would be shooting slow, all "sniper" like, you could just buy a Palmers Stabilizer or CP Reg and put that on there. The recharge rate wouldn't matter so much because you are being "sniper"ish, so you would not have to worry about the Reg starving your marker.

[Aslan]

If you can find one of the old SP all american barrels, they are extremely quiet and being used they are fairly cheap.

Good luck...I've been doing everything short of promising sexual favors trying to get my hands on an SP All-American 16" and 14". Wait...that sentence sounded bad...but my point is they are hard to find.

Why is it when someone comes on with the idea of what a "sniper" can be in paintball, maintaining concealment over brute force, we belittle the idea of the term sniper. However, when someone comes on and wants to be a "long range" sniper we remind them of the implausability of that in paintball. Come on now, this man wants to play a different style game that depends as much on concealment as it does brute firepower. Its a valid / different approach to situations and in many types of games may be a great change. How many times have you guys been in scenarios, gotten bored with your teams frontal assaults and wandered around solo. I know I have often, and when greeted with brute force against multiple players its nice to be able to fire a shot or two without giving away your position, and move reasonably quietly. I think its a lot of fun and a change of pace from the normal blitzkrieg style that is paintball. I doubt any of you are going to accuse me of not knowing the game.

Awesome!

[REDRT]

Good luck...I've been doing everything short of promising sexual favors trying to get my hands on an SP All-American 16" and 14". Wait...that sentence sounded bad...but my point is they are hard to find.

I've had an all SS All-American 14" twist lock barrel for years. It isn't too bad for being quiet. It also serves as a club if you run out of paint. A heavy bugger.

[famousgamer]

I've had an all SS All-American 14" twist lock barrel for years. It isn't too bad for being quiet. It also serves as a club if you run out of paint. A heavy bugger.

Having a hand-to-hand melee option to a barrel is always nice. I usually just pull my tank out and swing it at the guy with my remote line. I call it the HPA flail!

I still think Spec Ops should have made the Longbow based on the Pro Classic. Would have saved people hundreds of dollars, and maybe even leave them with a better "sniper" marker. At least with a Pro Classic they would be paying what they are using.

Those Deadlywinds seem pretty ideal. You could get the perfect paint match with the insert, and then reap the benifits of carbon fiber, without having to buy an entire Stiffi switch kit. For me, it is between the Stiffi Switch or the Deadlywind/Freak in the end, until I learn about something better. In the meantime, I am using the J&J as an inexpensive placeholder until I can invest in a quieter high performance barrel.

It is nice learning more and more about valves and AGD marker performance. It is sounding more and more that the Classic is the clear sniper choice, as a starting platform. I just hope one day to have an AGD rope ripper, so I can see the other side. When I cave and throw on a colorful jersey, I fear I might like it too much. In the meantime, Ill hide in the woods.

[geekwarrior]

awhile back my hopper lid broke. i was out of tape but found a beanie in the back of my truck. i slid it over the hopper and it held the lid on nice.

it also seemed to make my gun alot quieter. may have been my imagination, but you could give it a try. it also helps to break up the outline of the hopper