Is AGD DOA?

[StygShore]

AOrly?

half of those frames are either discontinued, of have an entire seasons wait to get

Really? Contact Luke, bet the wait isn't that long, and I believe he can get the Mokal/Focus frames pretty quick, and they look like a nice little frame. Not made of pot metal like the Kingman frames.

If you dont like the Mokal frames, he can make it out of many others. I will attest, they work awesome!!!


Styg


btw - where is the video for that rocking spyder frame mag?!?!?!?!?

[Nutsnyomowf]

There really hasnt been a truly new technology in paintball.

Spool valves are coming close to being a 10 year old "technology" as it is applied to paintball(spool valves have been around much longer). Spoolers arent much younger than the RT Valve. Poppet valves have been around since the mid-1900's. Yet, the Ego is one of the hottest things right now...and uses a 50+ year old technology.

The lack of technology isnt limited to AGD, every company is experiencing it. Its the reason why the industry is at a stand-still right now, and the only thing we can do is try to shave an ounce or two from the weight, or 1/2" from the height. Market it, repackage it, with a different milling design, change some dimensions and tell you its better---and the market buys it. AGD chooses not to do this.



That would be nice. Simpy put though, a paintball marker is just a piece of equipment that propels a projectile to 300 fps. How cutting edge can you really make such a simple piece of equipment.

At this point, I am surprised that the manufacturers could re-configure markers this long, and convince people they are something different enough to spend $1000 on. The Ion pretty much put a stop to that.



I agree. I am glad he made it too. It gives the consumer a choice.

As previously said, Tom doesnt want to be a part of the ramping craze. Give it time, it will only take 1 lawsuit to change this industry. And its a risk Tom isnt willing to take.




Some of those shiney new toys include RPG mags. I see some people going back to pump, some are quitting altogether, and others go for the ramping. Others are getting their shiney Rogue Mags or Tunamags

Dont worry, in 2 years I will still have my mag too. I aint going nowhere.



Thats what aftermarket guys are for. Nothing keeping someone from buying the shiney, fresh, RPG mag with minor upgrades like ReTents, Viperblade triggers, Sub-Zero feednecks, etc.



Like what...any suggestions?

Rogue you make me proud.

[jsdatjsd]

30bps increases the chances of lens failure, eye injury, head injuries and other bodily harm depending on distance you are shooting at. If the industry want to play safely with these high rates of fire, they need to re-think the safety equipment.

Trust me, there will be a serious injury or death and it will be because of the high ROF.

I can see serious injury, some twit stores his used goggles on the dashboard of his car during the winter, gets sunlight 12 hours a day, pulls them out, puts them on, starts screwing around with some friends, and decides to take a hopper full in the mask because he wants to show hes a man.

15bps later, hes on the ground with slivers of lexan in his eyes.

It will be blamed on misuse of equipment.

Death by paintball? Probably only in a situation where it would be considered assault, such as someone plinkinig a geriatric with brittle bones, and nailing the poor guy 30-40 times.

The only true danger from the faster bps, from what I can see, is mask breakage, and loss of eyesight.

Scenario players could also trip and fall on a pointy stick. That would be more dangerous....


Just my .02


Ooh, hey, and here is this little factor: supply and demand. THe demand isn;t for non-glitzy workhorses (mag), its for showy, high tolerance (sloppy machining compared to mag) paint slinging machines.

I betcha 10 to 1 that manufaturers of the ammo make 10 times more than the marker manufacturers....

[hgp3fat]

Trust me, there will be a serious injury or death and it will be because of the high ROF.

I believe statistically you are more likely to be struck by lightning, bitten by a snake, or eaten alive by a shark (that's one realistic Normandy landing scenario!) playing paintball.

[chill will]

One should never say never. Poo happens.

[Nutsnyomowf]

Poo happens.

LOL

[mag_lover05]

my mag shoots. all the time. it may not be THE fastest. but its accurate and would you want me on your team if my gun only worked half the time?

angels/timmys/egos etc... dont.



what the problem is?

[Troen]

The lack of technology isnt limited to AGD, every company is experiencing it. Its the reason why the industry is at a stand-still right now, and the only thing we can do is try to shave an ounce or two from the weight, or 1/2" from the height. Market it, repackage it, with a different milling design, change some dimensions and tell you its better---and the market buys it. AGD chooses not to do this.

whats a tac 1 then?
only thing new about it is the body, its a repackaged inteleframed rt valve with a front grip.
granted, thats woodsball oriented, but what about speedball? granted, you can play speedball with a normal mag, but what if you want something faster? emag? xmag? arn't they just selling off their old stock of emags on airgun.com? xmags you would have to buy used. what exactly is AGD doing right now? just sitting on their old stock, tac 1 bodys (original and warped), and parts for people here and there for their repairs? i don't think for a second the "industry" is at a stand still, new markers are coming out...and people are buying them. I'm sticking with my emag untill something better comes out, but will it?

[Lohman446]

my mag shoots. all the time. it may not be THE fastest. but its accurate and would you want me on your team if my gun only worked half the time?

angels/timmys/egos etc... dont.



what the problem is?

If you honestly beleive that most angels / timmys / Matrix / Egos only work half the time (or for that matter less than 99% of the time) you are either in denial or an idiot. I cannot tell you the last time a reasonably maintained marker went down on field from something that was not an error by the owner. Yeh I can, it was my proto blowing an o-ring because I never lube it at the end of last season.

[FiXeL]

I believe statistically you are more likely to be struck by lightning, bitten by a snake, or eaten alive by a shark (that's one realistic Normandy landing scenario!) playing paintball.

If you hit a paintball goggle system's lense over and over again on the same spot it will eventually fail. Granted, it's unlikely to happen during games, but it's a risk. If AGD decides to not bring out any markers with ramping, it's their decision. Maybe my judgement is biased since im recently got into mags, but i think they're here to stay! With a community like AO, The quality standard of the markers, and the customizability of them, they are out there to stay.

AGD can market aggressively like any other paintball company and overhype their products. Instead, they chose not to, and yes, maybe to prevent any lawsuits. I think it's not because they have to, but because they can. Marketing a product like it's something exclusive also boosts sales, when you target a certain crowd. And a good product does not need any advertising, if the customers know it's good they'll come and buy your product. Best advertising is mouth to mouth advertising. :)
The fact still remains that mags have a solid share of fans, and even tho sometimes parts like carta bodies are hard to come by it doen't change the fact that people still buy and shoot mags.

I've owned several markers since i started playing, and the only one that still gives me that "oh i love this gat so much" feeling everytime i pick it up is my xmag. Also the "turning heads" factor when i go play is kinda priceless... Don't care if you have a ego or the latest angel, i got a mag and i can keep up with you. Most AO members should know the feeling. :)

My 2 cents..

[Troen]

Its the scenario/rec version of the ULE Custom. It allows you to mount accessories to the marker previously not capable of, for a market that AGD had not previously developed anything for.

AGD didnt claim it to be a totally new marker, just a new take on an already available marker made specifically for the scenario market.

Like the gun spyder and smart parts been making, their names escape me at the moment. or is that just a repackaged ion?

Which marker is truly new? Really new? Bout the only thing I can think that is remotely and truly new is the MQValve, but thats not a new marker. Just a new valve(when Colin makes his marker available, it will be something Id consider new)

Otherwise, everything is a repackaged poppet valve, spool valve, or blow-forward.

What is new in anything consumer products?
Cars have hardly changed, idealy they're the same thing for years but they continue to be marketed as new. sure, they say add new "bells and whistles" (onstar in compairison to say, dwell adjustments) and "change the body" (on car its more drastic but on a paintball gun, how much can you actually do to it without it looking like another gun but still appealing? shave off half an inch, remill it, resell it).
Listen, i'm not trying to argue with you and come off as an ***, i have a great deal of respect for you. But as hard as it is, we must face the facts AGD as the company is pretty dead, no 'new' markers, just bodies that appeal to the woodsballers, which alot of companys are creating (spyder has the rail system i believe, iv seen them for ions as well), no new upgrades because they're not needed. i guess what im trying to get at, is what's next?

[Lohman446]

AGD chooses not to be the fad marker. That doesnt mean they are dead, it just means they arent the flavor of the month.

I'm going to expand on this point. Its a simple rule of business really. Less investment this year means you need less income.

AGD has paid for the technology they are currently producing. It was paid for by the tournament crowd. Granted there are some minor changed that take some R&D, but I doubt a lot.

It is very inexpensive for them to continue to produce this. This allows them to sell it at a better price and not be so dependent on mass sales. It is far easier (generally) to maintain your standing in a niche market than it is to maintain your standing as number one or two in the mainstream of a product. What AGD is doing now makes decent business sense.

Thats basic. Add another standard business term to it. Risk to reward ratio. TK has a lot to lose should he ever be sued. He truly beleives, judging by his previous posts, that producing a marker with the new firing modes that it seems it takes to compete in the mainstream paintball market today, poses a strong legal risk to him and his company in the event of a tragedy.

The point is, if TK is satisfied with the income and sales level of AGD why should he change things? If you are in a sustainable niche market (and CCM and PPS have both proven they exist in paintball) why fight to be something you are not?

The fact of the matter is most of our gripes about "AGD should do this" are egocentric. They are not centered around what is best for TK and AGD, they are centered around what we want.

[minimag03]

I think AGD would be better off not trying to develop the mag for awhile. I still think the market is open for a lite, good looking, low-profile hopper that is capable of high rates of fire. That's the type of equipment that anyone would buy, not just for speedball or woods ball.

[Brian Terry AGD]

if you want wood grips call smart parts field and ask for frank ,,the last time i was up there ,they had some in the case,,

[Troen]

Thats basic. Add another standard business term to it. Risk to reward ratio. TK has a lot to lose should he ever be sued. He truly beleives, judging by his previous posts, that producing a marker with the new firing modes that it seems it takes to compete in the mainstream paintball market today, poses a strong legal risk to him and his company in the event of a tragedy.

if you can find an decent example, ill apologize, but google didnt come up with anything.
my question is: What companys got "Majorly" (enough to make an impact on the bussiness) sued? Sure, i dont want to get sued, but theres companys making half-assed parts and throwing them inside of plastic covering with 600 psi in them (brass eagle) and then theres guns that shoot way faster then the legal limits, but what company has had a major lawsuit that TK was avoiding? Every company has the same risk, AGD just hasn't seemed to take it