This Gen's Jane Fonda

[Timmee]

Hanoi Jane was before my time (although not by much). I've heard the stories concerning her, though, and from what I've heard, I'm disgusted.

It's hard to imagine someone being as ignorant as she's been made to seem.

[1stdeadeye]

I know!

Originally posted by AGD
Most of this group doesnt know about "Hanoy Jane"

AGD

Oh we know! Most of us choose to ignore her very existence!

My question is what the bloody hell is he doing in IRAQ?!? Iraq is one of a select group of nations that is on the banned list of transferring currency into or out of. Did Sean go in with empty pockets? If not, he is violating Federal Banking Laws. Also I thought Iraq was a prohibited country to enter per the US Dept. of State, kinda like Cuba.

Old Soldier, you are wrong. If Sean doesn't ever come back, how is he going to get his butt kicked.

[davidb]

Originally posted by AGD
Most of this group doesnt know about "Hanoy Jane"

AGD

Now, I may only be 17...

But at least I can spell "Hanoi".

I have heard all of the same tales as the rest of you about Jane Fonda, and I personally am disgusted that she is still a free woman. The list of charges that should be brought against her is staggering, and yet she lives comfortably, even while some people lay dead because of her actions.

As for Sean Penn, he's only redoubling the feelings that I had towards him already.

[halB]

saying that if you dont like your country you should move is an ignorant opinion. if you dont like your country, you should do something to change it, just like sean penn is doing. we didnt belong in vietnam, and we dont belong in iraq.

[1stdeadeye]

Not again!

Originally posted by halB
saying that if you dont like your country you should move is an ignorant opinion. if you dont like your country, you should do something to change it, just like sean penn is doing. we didnt belong in vietnam, and we dont belong in iraq.

HalB-
Please do not start up this debate again. This thread is not about whether or not we belong there. Whether you agree or disagree, there is a right way and a wrong way to change things. Demonstrating here is one thing. Going into another country and giving support or aid to that particular enemy is wrong. If you want to change, do it from within the system. Grandstanding ala Sean Penn does nothing but stir up bitter feelings. Do it on Capital Hill, not in Iraq!

BTW-Maybe you should email Saddam with your return address. That way when he unleashes the chemical weapons you don't think he has, he can avoid your home!

[fire1811]

should get the same thing as jane........deported

[fenris69]

Amen to most of the above. Jane was a different story though...that miserable wench...arg. Well anyway, no point getting into that human trash. Sean Penn on the other hand can pack up and leave :) Wether you agree with your country on something or not, it's still your duty to support it as best you can, and not use your celebrity to undermine it in any fashion...especially from Iraq of all places...what kind of moron does that? Oh nm...Mr. Penn! Look on the bright side though, maybe he'll like it and stay?

[oldsoldier]

Halb, read my first post. I am NOT againsy nonviolent protest. what I AM against is going over into the enemy country and putting this one down. Do us all a favor are read before you type.
He can put America down, but, he uses american currency, wears american clothing, and contributes to the american economy. So, this makes him a hypocrite, traitor, and all around not so bright guy. Hope he sleeps well at night thinking he did the right thing.
Army, thanks for editing me. i was kinda upset when I read the story.

[kevdupuis]

Like the old saying, (It's a wonder she's still alive). Someone probably has a depleted uranium round with his initials carved in.

He is probably trying to revive what little career he has left.


/me starts dusting off old Barry Mcguire album.

[Python14]

Originally posted by AGD
Most of this group doesnt know about "Hanoy Jane"

AGD

In 9th grade, I dressed up like Hanoi Jane Fonda for a history project. Unfortunatey, dressing in drag was not all I thought it would have been.

Anywho, yes, I do agree. An American citizen going to another country to badmouth America and American Foriegn policy is comparable to running behind a wooly mammoth and badmouthing a rhino from there(I just finished watching Ice age). It really is a disgraceful move and I lost any respect I may have once had for Sean Hussein.

[TooDamnSweet]

Originally posted by AGD
Most of this group doesnt know about "Hanoy Jane"

AGD

My dad was in the Vietnam war and till this day he refuses to watch any movies that Jane Fonda is in or has anything to do with. He told me what she did and I find it very disturbing. My dad only talked to me about the Vietnam war twice, once because I asked him about it for a school paper I was doing. He could barely get the words out and that's the first time I saw him cry. The second time was when he told me about what Jane Fonda did. There was no sadness that time, just pure contempt.


During a 20/20 television interview in 1988 with Barbara Walkters, Jane Fonda appologized:

"I would like to say something, not just to Vietnam veterans in New England, but to men who were in Vietnam, who I hurt, or whose pain I caused to deepen because of things that I said or did," she began. "I was trying to help end the killing and the war, but there were times when I was thoughtless and careless about it and I'm . . . very sorry that I hurt them. And I want to apologize to them and their families."

I don't think that was very much comfort to those she caused so much pain too.

On a brighter note, if anyone wants to send online greeting to soldiers overseas here are a few links I found.....



Greeting 1


Greeting 2


Greeting 3

[Rooster]

"saying that if you dont like your country you should move is an ignorant opinion. if you dont like your country, you should do something to change it, just like sean penn is doing. we didnt belong in vietnam, and we dont belong in iraq."

I wasn't aware you were a US congressman. Becuase if you arn't you have absolutely no say about the attack on Iraq for the next two years. I find it ammusing that the Republicans, running on a anti-Iraq platform took both houses of congress. So not only do you have no say, but neither does anyone who agrees with you.

Iraq is as much our problem as Germany and Japan in WWII.

[halB]

i may not be a congressman, but this is MY country, and this is YOUR country. i have a hell of a say on what they wanna do, IM the presidents boss, YOUR the presidents boss. also, considering IM gonna be the one thats gonna go out and die if they start a draft (cause wars are never as easy or quick as we make them) i sure as hell better give my 2 cents. as Alexis de Toqueville said, to paraphrase him, we are different from europeans in that we like to take the political control into our own hands, we like to have a hand in our government, and we dont trust it to the aristocracy to decide on what we should do.

germany was taking over the world and attacking our long ally britain. even though the monroe doctrine said we should stay out of european affairs, the zimmerman telegraph sure as hell showed us that it was gonna be our problem soon, as hitler wished to team with mexico to take over america.

japan issued a declaration of war, and then attacked us first, before teh declaration reached us. the pearl harbor bombing was one of the worst attacks we suffered. of course, that japanese general was right when he said "I'm afraid we have awoken a sleeping giant"

iraq has not attacked us, and anyone whose studied saddam hussein can see hes not crazy, and he wouldnt attack us cause hes not suicidal.

also, on the sean penn note, he went there to visit a childrens hospital, not to give saddam hussein a golden sheep. he went to produce the "CNN effect", which is to put a human face on the people who will be the victims. he wanted to call attention to the fact that its not gonna be a victimless crime. he didnt go and give saddam all the SS numbers of POWS

[halB]

Originally posted by Rooster
"saying that if you dont like your country you should move is an ignorant opinion. if you dont like your country, you should do something to change it, just like sean penn is doing. we didnt belong in vietnam, and we dont belong in iraq."

I wasn't aware you were a US congressman. Becuase if you arn't you have absolutely no say about the attack on Iraq for the next two years. I find it ammusing that the Republicans, running on a anti-Iraq platform took both houses of congress. So not only do you have no say, but neither does anyone who agrees with you.

Iraq is as much our problem as Germany and Japan in WWII.

oh yes, and rooster, everyone ran on an anti iraq platform. the only senator who voted nay on the iraq powers bill became extremely popular, and was going to be reelected, but was killed in a plane crash

[nippinout]

halB,

I'm not sure that you can safely say that Saddam isn't crazy. I think that man is crazy, but not stupid.

There is a world of difference from crazy and stupid.

But then again, he could be stupid, but not crazy.

Who else would defy UN resolution so blatently? Only one man, our favorite mustached little friend, Saddam.

I can safely say that 95% of the world finds him evil. Or at least shouldn't be in power. His fellow Iraqis had an awesome voter turnout. 100% voter turnout and 100% of voters voted for Saddam.

Now tell me what country has millions of citizens completely happy and complacent with their leader. I guess it didn't hurt that there was no opposition. :)

I am not afraid of his nuclear program. Well, maybe... I am more afraid of his VX arsenal which is only partially accounted for. Remember the movie, The Rock? That VX poop is REAL!!!

VX can be summarized as 'Super Evil Stuff'. The most deadly of nerve agents. 0.3mg orally is enough to kill you. In gaseous form, it is even more deadly. One flavor of VX is designed to be super sticky. Basically, it won't be removed from whatever it comes in contact with.

The United States of America also has VX. The nation's stockpile is kept in an Army base in Indiana. Because of this, it is a Superfund site.

No one knows what to do with it. They can't transport it, any leaking could lead to killing a whole town.

Any man who even has VX in his book of tactics is pure evil. So I guess I conclude that Saddam is evil. You can't control VX, so its use would also be stupid. So he is also stupid.

The US stance is to disarm Saddam. History has showed us that he likes his war toys. The man needs to be taken out of power. Saddam knows he has no chance of winning a war. His only tactic left is to take out as many as he can before he goes down.

During Desert Storm, the Iraqi air force was decimated in two weeks. Satellite imagery and reconnisance planes were able to guide missles and designate targets in the open desert. Any military tactician knows intelligence is key. Fighting a battle in open desert against an enemy with air superiority and vision of the entire battle field is down right dumb.

He has learned urban fighting is the only chance of inflicting any damage against UN/coalition forces.

Saddam has not DIRECTLY attacked the US. But everyday he attempts to attack US and British planes patrolling no-fly zones. He also provides $50,000 to the families of suicide bombers. It isn't grievance money, it's a paycheck. The man has ties and funds terrorist groups. Terrorist groups are our enemy. Ergo, Saddam is our enemy.

You said that the Pearl Harbor attacks were one of the worst attacks. More Americans died on September 11, 2001 than any other day in history. Even more than D-Day.

Sean Penn fails to realize how evil Saddam is. Sean Penn can put his face on anything he wants. There will be civilian deaths. It is inevitable. But would the people of Iraq be willing to sacrifice some casualties for a new Iraq without Saddam? Hell yes they would.

You said that he was putting a face to who will be the victims. They already are victims. They live oppressed lives.

This is not your typical war. This time around, it is not a zero-sum game. Well, yes it is, but the ousting of Saddam is good for everybody. Sean Penn is not as bad as Hanoi Jane, but he's a self-righteous guy who has no clue what he is doing.

Too many uneducated people in the spotlight.

I'm all for debate. I love it. I can't debate the hippies on campus. They refuse rhetoric. :)

Most times, I end up making people mad. It isn't my intention, but many of my opinions are not mainstream.

For instance, I am all for the use of sweatshops and cheap labor. Maybe child labor, it may be pushing it, but I am all for sweatshops and cheap labor.

Remember, I am not evil. Saddam is. :)